Denial about how bad the quest system is.

[3eastW0rld]

Look don't get me wrong, Elden Ring is definitely gonna be at least a nominee for GOY but can we agree that the quest system does translate into open world horribly? I mean even if you argue that "Explore more, talk to the NPCs", let's be real, you don't know what the hell they're talking about (or they give you too vague of a dialogue to point you in the right direction) and if you did its cause you looked it up online. I feel like this needs to be discussed genuinely to inspire some improvements for the next game or more so the DLCs. I am OBSESSED with exploration, in fact I believed i over - leveled before most bosses because i prioritized exploring solely because i know how souls games are (been playing since Demon Souls came out). You can't genuinely say you'll know how to progress through any questline by exploring and buying the notes/secrets cause its flat out not true and i feel like people are saying that just to have an opposition because they wanna believe the game is flawless (close, but definitely not).

It takes away from the immersion and makes it feel like a chore that i have to switch to the google tab because everytime i breathe the questgiver moves to an undisclosed location. You look it up: "Oh yeah the person moves here if you did this, but if you did that then they're either here or there but if they're not there you might have to reload but its possible getting to this boss may trigger them to move here" like seriously theres absolutely no sense of linear progression whatsoever and some questlines don't have to be but at least make it possible to know where to hell to go. I get it, souls game is suppose to be cryptic and vague and that builds the mystery that everyone loves about the lore, yes it nice but i shouldn't have to go to sources outside of the game to know about the game it defeats the purpose of playing the game for story. Whats disturbing most is that you have die hard fans that are in an unnatural denial that this is a logical complaint. I'm sure they only do so because they already sucked it up and ate the bs spending 50% of their play hours being idle while scouring through eldenring wiki and are upset that no one else is willing to accept the same standard. We appreciate your dedication (because without the fanatics we wouldn't have guides to help the other 99.9% of the ppl to complete quests) but to deny that the quest system isn't gorilla cheek dingleberry ♥♥♥♥ is absurd. I'm hoping with the DLCs they'll be some better improvements.

[Sparhawk 59]

I'm hoping for them to fix the game period but not holding out much hope

[AILAD]

Originally posted by 3eastW0rld:

Look don't get me wrong, Elden Ring is definitely gonna be at least a nominee for GOY

Well, ER wins game of the year by default because nothing else comes out this year. All the games that are potential contenders are delayed. Except for Horizon Forbidden West, but that game isn't that great.

[Clail]

I hate that people keep refering to them as "quests." I keep imagining those ♥♥♥♥♥♥ MMO NPC's with exclamation points over there heads and a "walk here" path. That's the last thing I want to see in this series.

You don't need to interact with every single NPC in a souls game, you likely won't ever even use what ever items you might get out of it. You don't have to pull up a google page to find out what to do next, that's a choice you are making for yourself that's breaking your own immersion. Play the game and let it happen naturally.

[ɸ It That Dwells ɸ]

Some of the questlines could really be improved. But some do a good enough job, despite being in an open world. Irina and her father is a good example.

[MundM]

"Denial about how bad" is right. Because it's good.

I feel like you people ignore how the experience with previous souls titles was. Tell me again, how you easily did npc quests in previous titles.

NPC quests here are extremely immersive. The npcs have their own agenda, they move through the world just like you. You aren't the focus of their world (except for stalker Gideon, lol).
Nobody ever said any souls game had linear npc quest lines. You always triggered them doing things without being able to know it before.

I mean, if you want linear, there's Hyetta's quest, who walks a few hundred meters further, after giving her a grabe. Meaning, you literally trigger a linear quest path for her. And if you listen and read flavor texts, you slowly start to understand what's happening, at least vaguely and you can make your own interpretations.
You should list that example as a positive, but no, you just wanna crap on something popular, because you don't like a game that everyone knows has those elements.

You know, over 90% of all games are not like Elden Ring and the souls series. Why do you want the last 10% to be the same? Can't you let other people enjoy something different? You don't have to play Elden Ring. If your profile wasn't private, I would give you an example of a game you like, where I would never think about coming to the forum and demanding changes because the game is not how I like it, despite never being advertised as being like I would like it.

[MundM]

Originally posted by almost_a_jill_sandwich:

Originally posted by Sparhawk 56:

I'm hoping for them to fix the game period but not holding out much hope

Fromsoft actually commented on this, they heard that you are having difficulties with their quest system and plan to revamp it entirely so that people such as yourselves won't feel challenged.

The next update of the game will feature colored markers which tell you directly where to go, and will even have fast travel options which allow you to go directly to the next objective. That way, you can turn your brain off entirely and just follow directions.

It's going to be so much fun I'm really hyped.

Good one!

Also, maybe change the word "challenged" to "triggered". It fits more with 2022 current year argument popculture.

[Nope]

Originally posted by Clail:

I hate that people keep refering to them as "quests." I keep imagining those ♥♥♥♥♥♥ MMO NPC's with exclamation points over there heads and a "walk here" path. That's the last thing I want to see in this series.

You don't need to interact with every single NPC in a souls game, you likely won't ever even use what ever items you might get out of it. You don't have to pull up a google page to find out what to do next, that's a choice you are making for yourself that's breaking your own immersion. Play the game and let it happen naturally.

You also don't need hand holding, but a simple quests design that give you a hint where you SHOULD look at, no need to point you exact location nor guide you there on a path just a simple suggestions of where, anything but Milli"vanishing"cent

And the old dark souls quests are linear as hell, because they just move to the next location in the linear map, and not somewhere here on this entire huge open world. They don't need to say anything because you can easily find them in the next area most of time by spending a little bit of time exploring the new area

[Hammer_Squirrel]

Originally posted by 3eastW0rld:

can we agree that the quest system does not translate into open world horribly?

I can agree with what's written here.

[Enderspoons]

The NPC questline (for lack of a better shorthand word) structure is basically exactly the same as it is in Dark Souls.

Main difference between Elden Ring and Dark Souls is the way both games' worlds are built: It's way, way harder to miss them in Dark Souls, since the world is more constricted and NPCs tend to be more directly placed in your path. They give you absolutely no hints on where they go next because they don't really need to: The level structure does that for you, by placing their next location somewhere ahead of you, where you might realistically bump into them again.

In Elden RIng, it is effortlessly easy to miss NPCs, even if you're only off by a few meters, because of how vast the world is and how small NPCs are — I know I certainly missed Millicent a dozen times or more when she moved to Altus, despite warping to the nearest Grace more times than I could count wandering off in different directions.

Elden Ring's NPCs tend to move absolutely vast distances between locations, and like before, give you literally no indication of where they're going next. Let me give an example:

If you were passively trying to follow Alexander's progression, you'd be able to track him up to Redmane Castle fairly easily (Gael Tunnel is vaguely on the way and it's skippable, but Alexander doesn't mention it and Gael Tunnel is literally on the opposite side of Caelid). But, after you defeat Radahn, Alexander doesn't give you any hints on what landmarks you could use to triangulate his next location, or even what region on the world map he's headed to. There's not even a cryptic hint for you to unravel.
He just vanishes unceremoniously.

I don't need a navigation arrow pointing directly toward Alexander's next meet, or for his icon to show up on the map, or any non-diagetic aids like that. All I want here is for him to mention where he's going in a roundabout manner, so I can feel clever when I connect the dots and explore the nearby area to find him there.

[stage]

So why are you complaining now instead of back in 2009?

[Jimothy]

Here's why the quests suck; I wanted to do quests and don't think I did any, not sure. The quests are awful because they are ambiguous, impossible to find and unplayable if you don't look up what to do on the internet.

That's really really lame. The vast majority of the content shouldn't be completely unfindable.

[TyresTyco]

This is the first open world where you dont even need to complete a single quest. There is one single main objective. I dont get why so many newcomers suddenly want to change the game into western open world bang your head at the keyboard and win game.

[3eastW0rld]

Thank you for the condescending pricks that like to belittle people for having opinion, you proved my point about the denial. Theres a main difference why the questline work in the DS series and why it don't work in Elden Ring. For one Dark Souls IS NOT OPEN WORLD, christ of course the questline works because the game is linear you don't have a choice but to run into the npcs, Elden Ring is only comparable to DS in its mechanics its an entirely different genre. C'mon guys seriously?

[AILAD]

"NPC quests here are extremely immersive. The npcs have their own agenda, they move through the world just like you. You aren't the focus of their world"

From what I've seen, NPCs are in the same place until the player talks to them or does something that makes them move. And it usually doesn't make much sense from the NPCs perspective. (for example Rya will be at the Lift of Dectus if the player has completed the Dectus medallion only, but if you haven't she won't be there.)

I also don't find anything immersive about a frail woman standing in the middle of a swamp lake surrounded by mobs waiting for the player to pass by so she can ask him to retrieve a necklace.

Or a guy also standing forever in the middle of nowhere with mobs near him shouting for someone to clear a castle for him.

"they move through the world just like you"

You don't seriously believe that...

Anyway, you all can argue about quest logs all you want, but at the end of the day, the "quests" themselves in ER are low effort and nothing to write home about.

[3eastW0rld]

Originally posted by Clail:

I hate that people keep refering to them as "quests." I keep imagining those ♥♥♥♥♥♥ MMO NPC's with exclamation points over there heads and a "walk here" path. That's the last thing I want to see in this series.

You don't need to interact with every single NPC in a souls game, you likely won't ever even use what ever items you might get out of it. You don't have to pull up a google page to find out what to do next, that's a choice you are making for yourself that's breaking your own immersion. Play the game and let it happen naturally.

What if I want the items? I would have never found the dragon Communion seal without looking it up. You literally have to go back to where you start the game and put in a sword key to find it but you get dragon spells further into the game to where you would not assume it was there. Second, how can I even be immersed if i don't know wtf im doing or where to go in the first place? Its not a choice because you're not given one.