Am I stupid or do faith builds suck?

[MisterRed]

I made a thread a few days asking if it was fun, since I wanted to do a faith build for my final achievement run, and the response was about 50/50 between it being unfun vs fun, playing it now, and I'm wondering if I am doing something wrong, because the build feels beyond weak rn at least. I rushed Flame of Frenzy for my attack spell, and that does decent damage, sometimes. My spell slots are Heal, Flame of Frenzy, and Flame Sling. I use a lordsworn straightsword with holy infusion. This is the first time I've struggled with Margit, who guards the Godskin Tome I need for black fire. Both my melee builds easily steamrolled the first boss, while even after grinding more than usual my faith build struggles. Am I missing a vital part of how to do this kind of build, or are there just kinda bad?

[Elbonris]

MisterRed a écrit :

billybobtexan1000 a écrit :

the ability to heal without using a flask is amazing. faith builds are more about the self utility then actually going in like a sorcerer, The best faith builds in my opinion, are hybrid bulds, take just enough faith required for the highest incantation you want to cast, the sacred ashes are situational at best, and useless against many bosses, so its not likely you will be using faith to scale your weapons.

Yeah, my issue is that Margit always put my foolish ambitions to rest if I try to sneak heals in lol. And maybe I really should go hybrid build. My plan is a finger maiden cosplay with the Winged Scythe, so maybe Dex Faith does well

Dex faith is good since lightning scales with dex

[MisterRed]

Sonnenbank a écrit :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHxgKnyzFSo&ab_channel=lordad

hier the video i just made with new char
faith vs margit

actually 100% same as melee ;)
just different visuals.

but movement and positioning and r1 spam is exactly the same

Watching this, I can definitely tell I was constantly overestimating the range of my spells. I see you miss like once, but for me that was like 8/10 times when I was trying it. I literally almost never touched them with touch flame, which is definitely player error, but I can agree, that definitely looks easily possible, at minimum as easy as it was for my strength and Dex builds

[Sonnenbank]

MisterRed a écrit :

Sonnenbank a écrit :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHxgKnyzFSo&ab_channel=lordad

hier the video i just made with new char
faith vs margit

actually 100% same as melee ;)
just different visuals.

but movement and positioning and r1 spam is exactly the same

Watching this, I can definitely tell I was constantly overestimating the range of my spells. I see you miss like once, but for me that was like 8/10 times when I was trying it. I literally almost never touched them with touch flame, which is definitely player error, but I can agree, that definitely looks easily possible, at minimum as easy as it was for my strength and Dex builds

yepp
<3

range is very short but damage is very high ;)
i was even surprised the 1 time i missed an attack cause it was really close but still not close enough.

This video was actually the 2nd time ever i did margit with catch flame ;)
but i did him 100times + as melee helping others in coop

there are lots and lots of openings in phase 1

IN phase 2 there is only 1 real opening :( (which is why i hate phase 2)
you can see in Phase 1 0.46 ... he also does that attack in phase 2 somtimes and its the only one you can really punish

when he throws dagger than fast jumps forwards with a slash -> roll into his left leg
then walk around the left leg to his back.

he will try a delayed overhand and as soon as it landed you can get in 3 attacks

thats the only good opening in phase 2

[ChloroformNapkin]

Treat yourself to a coded sword and pick up some Dragon Communion skills. The scarlet rot breath is a great deterrent. Once you hit them with the rot just keep pressure on them till they drop.
https://gamerant.com/elden-ring-coded-sword-location-unblockable-blade/

[Amereth]

MisterRed a écrit :

Sonnenbank a écrit :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IHxgKnyzFSo&ab_channel=lordad

hier the video i just made with new char
faith vs margit

actually 100% same as melee ;)
just different visuals.

but movement and positioning and r1 spam is exactly the same

Watching this, I can definitely tell I was constantly overestimating the range of my spells. I see you miss like once, but for me that was like 8/10 times when I was trying it. I literally almost never touched them with touch flame, which is definitely player error, but I can agree, that definitely looks easily possible, at minimum as easy as it was for my strength and Dex builds

if you have difficulty landing catch flame, try locking on target and sprinting before casting.

catch flame can be cast while jumping or sprinting.

[Amereth]

ChloroformNapkin a écrit :

Treat yourself to a coded sword and pick up some Dragon Communion skills. The scarlet rot breath is a great deterrent. Once you hit them with the rot just keep pressure on them till they drop.
https://gamerant.com/elden-ring-coded-sword-location-unblockable-blade/

big problem with dragon breaths, you don't learn boss patterns... you just stay away and spam that without really learning anything.

[MisterRed]

Amereth a écrit :

ChloroformNapkin a écrit :

Treat yourself to a coded sword and pick up some Dragon Communion skills. The scarlet rot breath is a great deterrent. Once you hit them with the rot just keep pressure on them till they drop.
https://gamerant.com/elden-ring-coded-sword-location-unblockable-blade/

big problem with dragon breaths, you don't learn boss patterns... you just stay away and spam that without really learning anything.

I can see how that can be an issue for sure, luckily this is my third playthrough now, so I already know how most bosses operate, with exception to Dragonlord Placideux, he kinda broke himself both times I tried to fight him, so I was never allowed to learn how to fight him.

[MisterRed]

Sonnenbank a écrit :

MisterRed a écrit :

Watching this, I can definitely tell I was constantly overestimating the range of my spells. I see you miss like once, but for me that was like 8/10 times when I was trying it. I literally almost never touched them with touch flame, which is definitely player error, but I can agree, that definitely looks easily possible, at minimum as easy as it was for my strength and Dex builds

yepp
<3

range is very short but damage is very high ;)
i was even surprised the 1 time i missed an attack cause it was really close but still not close enough.

This video was actually the 2nd time ever i did margit with catch flame ;)
but i did him 100times + as melee helping others in coop

there are lots and lots of openings in phase 1

IN phase 2 there is only 1 real opening :( (which is why i hate phase 2)
you can see in Phase 1 0.46 ... he also does that attack in phase 2 somtimes and its the only one you can really punish

when he throws dagger than fast jumps forwards with a slash -> roll into his left leg
then walk around the left leg to his back.

he will try a delayed overhand and as soon as it landed you can get in 3 attacks

thats the only good opening in phase 2

Thanks for all the advice, I'm definitely getting more excited for the build as I learn more about what kinds of cool things there are.

[hemorrhage911]

Did a pure faith build on my first run, it worked out just fine. Everything is situational.

I do miss Unfaltering Prayer though :(

[Baron01]

MisterRed a écrit :

Darkside99x a écrit :

Out of curiosity has anyone found/no of a faith weapon that deals just physical damage (know holy).

I’ve found a few that scales fire but was kinda hoping for a nice generic weapon to get me through the endgame stuff.

It seems that the Erdsteel Daggers (One from Kenneth Haight, the other in Leyndell) have Faith Scaling, but no special damage type, so a physical faith weapon seems to be that.

I'm surprised to see this as I was about to reply to the question with resounding "NO" as I did not see any other weapon with Faith scaling that dealt only physical damage. I ignored daggers so I guess that is why Erdsteel Daggers slipped.

MisterRed a écrit :

Out of curiosity then, can anyone confirm if Fire Damage always scales with faith? If so maybe I can rush Fort Gael again and pick up Flame of the Redmanes for it's usage

I believe no elemental damage on a weapon scales with specific stat without a weapon scaling being involved. My understanding is that if you have strength scaling weapon with fire and physical damage. Weapon damage will be scaled only by strength no matter what.

I did a bit of testing on Fire Guardian Swordspear and increasing Faith did not increase fire damage.

[TK]

UnholyDentist a écrit :

Lightning spear, Catch Flame, Pest Threads. Those 3 are the best to start with. You can get them all without fighting. Just ride to Lake and Caelid.

Since when is Lightning spear obtainable without fighting?

[Diomedes]

Baron01 a écrit :

MisterRed a écrit :

It seems that the Erdsteel Daggers (One from Kenneth Haight, the other in Leyndell) have Faith Scaling, but no special damage type, so a physical faith weapon seems to be that.

I'm surprised to see this as I was about to reply to the question with resounding "NO" as I did not see any other weapon with Faith scaling that dealt only physical damage. I ignored daggers so I guess that is why Erdsteel Daggers slipped.

MisterRed a écrit :

Out of curiosity then, can anyone confirm if Fire Damage always scales with faith? If so maybe I can rush Fort Gael again and pick up Flame of the Redmanes for it's usage

I believe no elemental damage on a weapon scales with specific stat without a weapon scaling being involved. My understanding is that if you have strength scaling weapon with fire and physical damage. Weapon damage will be scaled only by strength no matter what.

I did a bit of testing on Fire Guardian Swordspear and increasing Faith did not increase fire damage.

.. There are two different types.. A flame and fire affinity, flame scales with faith, fire is solely strength (and a trivial amount of dex) base.. Flame of the Redmanes is specifically the strength based fire skill.
As for the TC, if you're going for a faith based caster like build, I highly recommend you put points into arcane.. The dragon breath spells are some of the best offensive spells for pve in the game.. Rot breath for instance is one of the most useful spells in the game in trivializing most boss fights.

[MisterRed]

Diomedes a écrit :

Baron01 a écrit :

I'm surprised to see this as I was about to reply to the question with resounding "NO" as I did not see any other weapon with Faith scaling that dealt only physical damage. I ignored daggers so I guess that is why Erdsteel Daggers slipped.



I believe no elemental damage on a weapon scales with specific stat without a weapon scaling being involved. My understanding is that if you have strength scaling weapon with fire and physical damage. Weapon damage will be scaled only by strength no matter what.

I did a bit of testing on Fire Guardian Swordspear and increasing Faith did not increase fire damage.

.. There are two different types.. A flame and fire affinity, flame scales with faith, fire is solely strength base.. Flame of the Redmanes is specifically the strength based fire skill.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but to gain the right to choose which I get, I need to visit Redmane Castle right? Try not to die long enough to snag a whetblade

[Amereth]

Baron01 a écrit :

MisterRed a écrit :

It seems that the Erdsteel Daggers (One from Kenneth Haight, the other in Leyndell) have Faith Scaling, but no special damage type, so a physical faith weapon seems to be that.

I'm surprised to see this as I was about to reply to the question with resounding "NO" as I did not see any other weapon with Faith scaling that dealt only physical damage. I ignored daggers so I guess that is why Erdsteel Daggers slipped.

MisterRed a écrit :

Out of curiosity then, can anyone confirm if Fire Damage always scales with faith? If so maybe I can rush Fort Gael again and pick up Flame of the Redmanes for it's usage

I believe no elemental damage on a weapon scales with specific stat without a weapon scaling being involved. My understanding is that if you have strength scaling weapon with fire and physical damage. Weapon damage will be scaled only by strength no matter what.

I did a bit of testing on Fire Guardian Swordspear and increasing Faith did not increase fire damage.

you need whetstones to unlock the options for scalings, every ashe of wars come with basic scalings, unless you have specific whetstones you are stuck with the basics.

[Baron01]

Diomedes a écrit :

.. There are two different types.. A flame and fire affinity, flame scales with faith, fire is solely strength (and a trivial amount of dex) base.. Flame of the Redmanes is specifically the strength based fire skill.

Correct. I was responding to a question where someone asked if fire damage always scales with Faith. The answer is fire damage does not scale with Faith, any elemental damage including fire scales with scaling stats of the weapon. If your weapon scales with STR & DEX and it has fire, icreasing Faith will have no effect on fire, or any other, damage.