Can we get off Ranni's back for just a minute?

[Adonan]

I'm getting kind of sick of seeing her face in everything. She evens gets most of the real-estate in Rule 34, which is stunning considering Melania's second phase tears off most of her clothing. I made the decision to go for the Frenzied Flame ending on my first playthrough because:
1. It's one of the two endings that feels different to the rest.
2. Everyone and their mother probably did Ranni's ending for their first playthrough, if not their second.
I get she's everyone's waifu, but let's all take a day to stop thirsting over her, please. Yes, I am maidenless. How did you know?

What about Roderika? She's cute, and she serves a damn good purpose in my opinion. Or Melina, the girl who's always by your side even when you can't see her (like Torrent) and literally gives you the strength to keep going.

[Adonan]

Originally posted by zero:

Originally posted by Adonan:

Which is why I admitted Roderika wasn't a good example, but I also gave Melina as one. Also, the examples I gave were that first step, and I even tried to have a discussion about why Ranni isn't a particularly fantastic character here:


Which would have led to more discussion about the other characters, as I would need the examples. Obviously, everyone has their opinions, but if opinions weren't dynamic we'd be living in a rather stagnant society (we aren't, by the way). My goal was to change opinions, hence why I started this thread.

melina: you mean the non quest npc that you only interact with 4 times?

your missing the point yet again, people talk about ranni cause ranni has the most important quest: it unlocks a unique ending, an entire section of the map you cannot get to otherwise(ive heard this is untrue but i have no idea how to get there otherwise), a fan fav weapon(moonlight greatsword dark moon version), unlocks 2 merchant npcs (or upgrades inji's shop for a good trinket), and actively lore dumps upon you about ranni, the history of the world, and her goals, along with requiring you to do more then "go to location, kill boss", you have to find a key item, not fall for her (admittedly easy) ruse of the toy doll, find a coffin, and if you so desire, post quest you can return to her rise for slightly more info/a slight change to the ending.

loux's quest is automated, if you show up where she is and kill the boss, she contiunes on, at the end give her a key item, done.

fia's/D's will contiune if you do nothing, but she also points you directly to where to go to do it normally, then she leaves and you find her at the end.

like the only other long lasting quest if volcano manner, and that revolves around several npcs, but isn't exactly complex: just go and fake invade as the marked spot.

i simply do not get your goal, if you wanna talk about another npcs, melina is your example this time: then talk about her, what are you trying to talk about thats so meaningful about her aside from the chaos flame ending (which has had several threads about here already, mind you)

i dont even like ranni (aside from her hat but i steal all mage hats in all games) but even i can actively see how her quest is the most interesting/useful compared to the others unless you specifically want those endings.

so i guess to shorten it: WHAT about other characters do you want to talk about, and why not just make a thread about that in specific?

Yeah, the NPC that I admitted was a bad example. Although, again, the only bad thing was that she didn't have a questline that was as involved. Her story isn't presented to you as readily as Ranni's. In fact, I just had a refresher on her lore, and I think she's more engaging if only for the fact that you have to make the connections yourself. More importantly, it seems like you're saying the questline was the main draw, not Ranni herself. Again, she doesn't have any character development, like most characters in this game, and she seems rather emotionless, so why do people care so much for her? Yes, she's connected to the quest, but so is Blaidd and Selivus.

Also, her quest isn't that much better than anyone else's quest in terms of what you do. You find a key, talk to some people, kill a few bosses, jump in a coffin (not sure what about that is so exciting), and get the greatsword as a reward. The greatsword I understand, but that's at the end of the questline, and it's a reward so there's not much engagement there. What about everything leading up to that? As far as I can tell, it's just everything you do in every other questline combined into one. As far as I'm aware, most people don't like exposition dumps, so I'm not sure why that's a point in that quest's favor. Heck, most people don't care for lore, again, as far as I know.

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

[Adonan]

Originally posted by Gray:

"Tarnished. A word. I heard you conspired with Ranni the Witch. I understand. The need for puppt gash is strong. Do you think I have not felt it?
In my quest to be all knowing, I too have known the draw to the blue cunny.
With her four arms...think of all the things she could do it, your tarnished tackle...and then? Imagine ten more.

Just, tell me this. When she was minature and in your grasp did ya...
did ya stick her in a jar?
and did ya...
fill that jar with your tarnished seed?
I'd do the same, if given the chance.

Be on your way then, to the capital."

I don't know what the hell that was, but I laughed so you earned that reward.

[Noeat]

Originally posted by Adonan:

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

no, thats not how it works..
when you will jumping around and crying and yelling "dont talk about this, change your opinion, it is bad, dont like that!" then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak..

[zero]

Originally posted by Adonan:

Originally posted by zero:

melina: you mean the non quest npc that you only interact with 4 times?

your missing the point yet again, people talk about ranni cause ranni has the most important quest: it unlocks a unique ending, an entire section of the map you cannot get to otherwise(ive heard this is untrue but i have no idea how to get there otherwise), a fan fav weapon(moonlight greatsword dark moon version), unlocks 2 merchant npcs (or upgrades inji's shop for a good trinket), and actively lore dumps upon you about ranni, the history of the world, and her goals, along with requiring you to do more then "go to location, kill boss", you have to find a key item, not fall for her (admittedly easy) ruse of the toy doll, find a coffin, and if you so desire, post quest you can return to her rise for slightly more info/a slight change to the ending.

loux's quest is automated, if you show up where she is and kill the boss, she contiunes on, at the end give her a key item, done.

fia's/D's will contiune if you do nothing, but she also points you directly to where to go to do it normally, then she leaves and you find her at the end.

like the only other long lasting quest if volcano manner, and that revolves around several npcs, but isn't exactly complex: just go and fake invade as the marked spot.

i simply do not get your goal, if you wanna talk about another npcs, melina is your example this time: then talk about her, what are you trying to talk about thats so meaningful about her aside from the chaos flame ending (which has had several threads about here already, mind you)

i dont even like ranni (aside from her hat but i steal all mage hats in all games) but even i can actively see how her quest is the most interesting/useful compared to the others unless you specifically want those endings.

so i guess to shorten it: WHAT about other characters do you want to talk about, and why not just make a thread about that in specific?

Yeah, the NPC that I admitted was a bad example. Although, again, the only bad thing was that she didn't have a questline that was as involved. Her story isn't presented to you as readily as Ranni's. In fact, I just had a refresher on her lore, and I think she's more engaging if only for the fact that you have to make the connections yourself. More importantly, it seems like you're saying the questline was the main draw, not Ranni herself. Again, she doesn't have any character development, like most characters in this game, and she seems rather emotionless, so why do people care so much for her? Yes, she's connected to the quest, but so is Blaidd and Selivus.

Also, her quest isn't that much better than anyone else's quest in terms of what you do. You find a key, talk to some people, kill a few bosses, jump in a coffin (not sure what about that is so exciting), and get the greatsword as a reward. The greatsword I understand, but that's at the end of the questline, and it's a reward so there's not much engagement there. What about everything leading up to that? As far as I can tell, it's just everything you do in every other questline combined into one. As far as I'm aware, most people don't like exposition dumps, so I'm not sure why that's a point in that quest's favor. Heck, most people don't care for lore, again, as far as I know.

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

i mean yes, this is a game, so the questline is obviously the main draw, i cant really comment on your porn remarks or how "cute" you find the characters cause i don't look that stuff up or care about about your subjective opinion of an npc's looks, hence, questline.

most characters in this game have 0 character devlopment? what? where did you ever see a character improve aside from like sellen, at the very end, cause you showed yourself to be capable, so she was kind for 10 seconds before karma gets her?

people LOVE blaidd also, as seen by these forums, and hate selivus, cause hes a creepy little puppet dude.

and i mean, her quest is objectively better, cause its a bit of everything, and is required to reach specific zone. and people don't like monolgues, people like clues, which exposition provides, its worldbuilding, especially coming from one of the key faces in said world, one of the demis themselves, who is directly to blame for the entire event of the game, with her god slaying blades.

stop trying to change opinions, instead change your actions, put what you want into the world.

want to talk about mel? go ahead, talk about her right now, hit us with it.

if you honestly believe you cannot make a thread about other characters because ranni is interesting, thats just you admitting your other characters aren't interesting and have nothing going for them to make them stand out.

but you believe otherwise: so just go and do it instead of making what ultimately amounts to a hate thread.

if you have to drag down someones interest to promote your own, then you have bad interests.

but you dont have to, people love pokemon but there are people who like digimon too, they dont fight about it they just both talk to their own indiviudal groups, it'd be childish to be "well pokemon(ranni) sucks, digimon(pick idc) is better" eh?

[GuRu Asaki]

Originally posted by Target:

Stop for a second, look at your self. You are complaining about porn on the steam Forums, I dont even care if you are trolling or not, either way, their are better things you could be doing with your life. Your ancestors died so that you could live, make it worth it.

If people actually stood by your statement here today? We wouldn't have the shttiest Community of people on this Platform today, & some of us would actually enjoy being here not creating a painful experience for everyone, & not being hated by everyone, either... Everything you just said is exactly why I don't support changes today, that I just want to go back to 2015 where Games are about Games again, & other people's views & their Politic Correctness stay out of our
Games... -_-

[Izlude]

Originally posted by Adonan:

Originally posted by zero:

melina: you mean the non quest npc that you only interact with 4 times?

your missing the point yet again, people talk about ranni cause ranni has the most important quest: it unlocks a unique ending, an entire section of the map you cannot get to otherwise(ive heard this is untrue but i have no idea how to get there otherwise), a fan fav weapon(moonlight greatsword dark moon version), unlocks 2 merchant npcs (or upgrades inji's shop for a good trinket), and actively lore dumps upon you about ranni, the history of the world, and her goals, along with requiring you to do more then "go to location, kill boss", you have to find a key item, not fall for her (admittedly easy) ruse of the toy doll, find a coffin, and if you so desire, post quest you can return to her rise for slightly more info/a slight change to the ending.

loux's quest is automated, if you show up where she is and kill the boss, she contiunes on, at the end give her a key item, done.

fia's/D's will contiune if you do nothing, but she also points you directly to where to go to do it normally, then she leaves and you find her at the end.

like the only other long lasting quest if volcano manner, and that revolves around several npcs, but isn't exactly complex: just go and fake invade as the marked spot.

i simply do not get your goal, if you wanna talk about another npcs, melina is your example this time: then talk about her, what are you trying to talk about thats so meaningful about her aside from the chaos flame ending (which has had several threads about here already, mind you)

i dont even like ranni (aside from her hat but i steal all mage hats in all games) but even i can actively see how her quest is the most interesting/useful compared to the others unless you specifically want those endings.

so i guess to shorten it: WHAT about other characters do you want to talk about, and why not just make a thread about that in specific?

Yeah, the NPC that I admitted was a bad example. Although, again, the only bad thing was that she didn't have a questline that was as involved. Her story isn't presented to you as readily as Ranni's. In fact, I just had a refresher on her lore, and I think she's more engaging if only for the fact that you have to make the connections yourself. More importantly, it seems like you're saying the questline was the main draw, not Ranni herself. Again, she doesn't have any character development, like most characters in this game, and she seems rather emotionless, so why do people care so much for her? Yes, she's connected to the quest, but so is Blaidd and Selivus.

Also, her quest isn't that much better than anyone else's quest in terms of what you do. You find a key, talk to some people, kill a few bosses, jump in a coffin (not sure what about that is so exciting), and get the greatsword as a reward. The greatsword I understand, but that's at the end of the questline, and it's a reward so there's not much engagement there. What about everything leading up to that? As far as I can tell, it's just everything you do in every other questline combined into one. As far as I'm aware, most people don't like exposition dumps, so I'm not sure why that's a point in that quest's favor. Heck, most people don't care for lore, again, as far as I know.

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

Ranni is a waifu so of course people gonna care about her more than Blaiid or the puppetlover. And the other female npcs dont really offer much to like. Melina is pretty sure but we dont really know anything about her so theres not much to get attached to and theres not even stuff we get to find out about her to make us care more. As for little Red Ridin...errr spirit tuner lady well her entire personality is just "Im meek and softspoken" not much there to work with. Oh and then there is Nepheli who...I mean lets be real is anyone actually physically attracted to Nepheli? As for Fia....well I mean she clearly is far more into a certain deadboi than she is the tarnished and no one wants to be the Will Smith to her being Jada (for reference Jada openly talks about how she would want to be with Tupac rather than Will)

[blood_guts]

Originally posted by Target:

Stop for a second, look at your self. You are complaining about porn on the steam Forums, I dont even care if you are trolling or not, either way, their are better things you could be doing with your life. Your ancestors died so that you could live, make it worth it.

Originally posted by Falleax:

She has FOUR arms!!!!
Imagine the HUGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

thank you both. You made me laugh super ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ hard, one after another.

[Adonan]

Originally posted by Noeat:

Originally posted by Adonan:

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

no, thats not how it works..
when you will jumping around and crying and yelling "dont talk about this, change your opinion, it is bad, dont like that!" then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak..

Oh? I don't seem to recall crying or yelling. Could you point out when that occured? I recall becoming frustrated at one point, but I left out the caps to try and keep the situation more level. At this point, I've mellowed out (without drugs). In fact, I feel great, and alert. These discussions have put me in the zone. However, if it would help us get back on track, then I apologies for any misbehavior on my part.

[Noeat]

Originally posted by Adonan:

Originally posted by Noeat:

no, thats not how it works..
when you will jumping around and crying and yelling "dont talk about this, change your opinion, it is bad, dont like that!" then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak..

Oh? I don't seem to recall crying or yelling. Could you point out when that occured? I recall becoming frustrated at one point, but I left out the caps to try and keep the situation more level. At this point, I've mellowed out (without drugs). In fact, I feel great, and alert. These discussions have put me in the zone. However, if it would help us get back on track, then I apologies for any misbehavior on my part.

you somehow miss this part:

"then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak.."

read whole thing again, slowly and loudly.. and then come with your offer..

[Adonan]

Originally posted by zero:

Originally posted by Adonan:

Yeah, the NPC that I admitted was a bad example. Although, again, the only bad thing was that she didn't have a questline that was as involved. Her story isn't presented to you as readily as Ranni's. In fact, I just had a refresher on her lore, and I think she's more engaging if only for the fact that you have to make the connections yourself. More importantly, it seems like you're saying the questline was the main draw, not Ranni herself. Again, she doesn't have any character development, like most characters in this game, and she seems rather emotionless, so why do people care so much for her? Yes, she's connected to the quest, but so is Blaidd and Selivus.

Also, her quest isn't that much better than anyone else's quest in terms of what you do. You find a key, talk to some people, kill a few bosses, jump in a coffin (not sure what about that is so exciting), and get the greatsword as a reward. The greatsword I understand, but that's at the end of the questline, and it's a reward so there's not much engagement there. What about everything leading up to that? As far as I can tell, it's just everything you do in every other questline combined into one. As far as I'm aware, most people don't like exposition dumps, so I'm not sure why that's a point in that quest's favor. Heck, most people don't care for lore, again, as far as I know.

My goal here is to change opinions, as I previously stated. I did not just make a thread about another character because I did not think it would get as much engagement as a thread about Ranni or her questline. The first step is to introduce the idea that the other characters can be interesting, and to do that I need to present a case as to why Ranni isn't as interesting as people think. Her questline isn't either, now that I've had a think on it.

i mean yes, this is a game, so the questline is obviously the main draw, i cant really comment on your porn remarks or how "cute" you find the characters cause i don't look that stuff up or care about about your subjective opinion of an npc's looks, hence, questline.

most characters in this game have 0 character devlopment? what? where did you ever see a character improve aside from like sellen, at the very end, cause you showed yourself to be capable, so she was kind for 10 seconds before karma gets her?

people LOVE blaidd also, as seen by these forums, and hate selivus, cause hes a creepy little puppet dude.

and i mean, her quest is objectively better, cause its a bit of everything, and is required to reach specific zone. and people don't like monolgues, people like clues, which exposition provides, its worldbuilding, especially coming from one of the key faces in said world, one of the demis themselves, who is directly to blame for the entire event of the game, with her god slaying blades.

stop trying to change opinions, instead change your actions, put what you want into the world.

want to talk about mel? go ahead, talk about her right now, hit us with it.

if you honestly believe you cannot make a thread about other characters because ranni is interesting, thats just you admitting your other characters aren't interesting and have nothing going for them to make them stand out.

but you believe otherwise: so just go and do it instead of making what ultimately amounts to a hate thread.

if you have to drag down someones interest to promote your own, then you have bad interests.

but you dont have to, people love pokemon but there are people who like digimon too, they dont fight about it they just both talk to their own indiviudal groups, it'd be childish to be "well pokemon(ranni) sucks, digimon(pick idc) is better" eh?

Considering I've been trying to draw people's attention to my argument rather than the porn comment, I would like nothing more than to move on from that.

I'm not sure what your first statement means, as it seems to corroborate my statement about a lack of character development. Sellen wasn't particularly mean before, and she recognized your potential well before the last act.

I've never really seen much discussion of Blaidd as I have Ranni. The consort thing in particular seems to get everyone hooked. Selivus is a good place to start though. Hating someone doesn't mean you can't make an effort to understand them. If anything, I imagine the hate would make things more interesting, as it's an opportunity to grow past your instinctual predilection.

If her quest is better just because it's a bit of everything rather than something different, there's nothing from her quest that you can't get anywhere else. You can't even really say it's faster because it takes place from early to mid or even late game. Also, exposition doesn't give you clues, it's gives you unambiguous information about the narrative or background. That's why most people hate exposition. That, or because most story writers misuse it. If you want clues, you're better off looking at Melina's story.

As I said before, I'm trying to change opinions through actions. They aren't mutually exclusive. I'm talking to you now in an effort to change your opinion. I never said I couldn't make threads about other characters because Ranni is interesting. I said I wanted to change opinions because she isn't interesting, or at least no more interesting than anyone else. Melina is just as interesting as Ranni, she just requires more work to figure that out (others have already done the work for us). Does anyone know Ranni's motivations? Not her goals, mind you, but her motivations. Goals aren't motivations. Lastly, I don't hate Ranni. In fact, I believe I recall stating I don't hate her or the people that like her. I'm just here to open your mind to other possibilities.

I think your simile is off, as it's similar to the other simile about the Magic books and Cyberpunk books.

[Adonan]

Originally posted by Noeat:

Originally posted by Adonan:

Oh? I don't seem to recall crying or yelling. Could you point out when that occured? I recall becoming frustrated at one point, but I left out the caps to try and keep the situation more level. At this point, I've mellowed out (without drugs). In fact, I feel great, and alert. These discussions have put me in the zone. However, if it would help us get back on track, then I apologies for any misbehavior on my part.

you somehow miss this part:

"then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak.."

read whole thing again, slowly and loudly.. and then come with your offer..

Oh I read it. You seem to have missed the part where I said I don't recall yelling. You know, the thing that he's saying changes nothing. I also already apologized if I did. I've seen first hand how some people can read anger in rather ambiguous behavior in this forum.

[Noeat]

Originally posted by Adonan:

Originally posted by Noeat:

you somehow miss this part:

"then it change nothing.. you just encourage ppl to talk about it.

offer them alternative, something better.. and talk about it

you cant change opinion that pizza is great just by crying and demanding that they need stop liking pizza.. offer something.. for example spaghetti, or steak.."

read whole thing again, slowly and loudly.. and then come with your offer..

Oh I read it. You seem to have missed the part where I said I don't recall yelling. You know, the thing that he's saying changes nothing. I also already apologized if I did. I've seen first hand how some people can read anger in rather ambiguous behavior in this forum.

and you still somehow again miss that whole part :D

[GuRu Asaki]

Food in General sux today, period...
- Doesn't matter where you get it anymore...
- Brainwashing people just cause they dissagree with a Doctor over a statement being made, isn't going to change how people feel about the food today, -_-

Pizza is by far the best Food today, yet even Pizza deserves a low rating of aweful taste...

[Rinny]

"hehe I dont like X character because they're popular aren't I so cool and different"

[Izlude]

Originally posted by Adonan:

Originally posted by zero:

i mean yes, this is a game, so the questline is obviously the main draw, i cant really comment on your porn remarks or how "cute" you find the characters cause i don't look that stuff up or care about about your subjective opinion of an npc's looks, hence, questline.

most characters in this game have 0 character devlopment? what? where did you ever see a character improve aside from like sellen, at the very end, cause you showed yourself to be capable, so she was kind for 10 seconds before karma gets her?

people LOVE blaidd also, as seen by these forums, and hate selivus, cause hes a creepy little puppet dude.

and i mean, her quest is objectively better, cause its a bit of everything, and is required to reach specific zone. and people don't like monolgues, people like clues, which exposition provides, its worldbuilding, especially coming from one of the key faces in said world, one of the demis themselves, who is directly to blame for the entire event of the game, with her god slaying blades.

stop trying to change opinions, instead change your actions, put what you want into the world.

want to talk about mel? go ahead, talk about her right now, hit us with it.

if you honestly believe you cannot make a thread about other characters because ranni is interesting, thats just you admitting your other characters aren't interesting and have nothing going for them to make them stand out.

but you believe otherwise: so just go and do it instead of making what ultimately amounts to a hate thread.

if you have to drag down someones interest to promote your own, then you have bad interests.

but you dont have to, people love pokemon but there are people who like digimon too, they dont fight about it they just both talk to their own indiviudal groups, it'd be childish to be "well pokemon(ranni) sucks, digimon(pick idc) is better" eh?

Considering I've been trying to draw people's attention to my argument rather than the porn comment, I would like nothing more than to move on from that.

I'm not sure what your first statement means, as it seems to corroborate my statement about a lack of character development. Sellen wasn't particularly mean before, and she recognized your potential well before the last act.

I've never really seen much discussion of Blaidd as I have Ranni. The consort thing in particular seems to get everyone hooked. Selivus is a good place to start though. Hating someone doesn't mean you can't make an effort to understand them. If anything, I imagine the hate would make things more interesting, as it's an opportunity to grow past your instinctual predilection.

If her quest is better just because it's a bit of everything rather than something different, there's nothing from her quest that you can't get anywhere else. You can't even really say it's faster because it takes place from early to mid or even late game. Also, exposition doesn't give you clues, it's gives you unambiguous information about the narrative or background. That's why most people hate exposition. That, or because most story writers misuse it. If you want clues, you're better off looking at Melina's story.

As I said before, I'm trying to change opinions through actions. They aren't mutually exclusive. I'm talking to you now in an effort to change your opinion. I never said I couldn't make threads about other characters because Ranni is interesting. I said I wanted to change opinions because she isn't interesting, or at least no more interesting than anyone else. Melina is just as interesting as Ranni, she just requires more work to figure that out (others have already done the work for us). Does anyone know Ranni's motivations? Not her goals, mind you, but her motivations. Goals aren't motivations. Lastly, I don't hate Ranni. In fact, I believe I recall stating I don't hate her or the people that like her. I'm just here to open your mind to other possibilities.

I think your simile is off, as it's similar to the other simile about the Magic books and Cyberpunk books.

Ok you want a bunch of thirsty guys to talk about a wolf man more than a pretty blue lady? Ok spoilers but thats never gonna happen. You also mentioned Melina's story but she doesnt have much of one so of course no one is hooked with her. You have to explain how the characters you want others to like are actually interesting. Make arguments for them. If you just try to say "Ranni bad and here is why" but all your points can also apply to every single npc you would prefer people talk about then it means you didnt make a good point. Actually explain whats so interesting and great about the npcs you want people to like.