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討論區規矩與守則
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Are you certain you are talking about Radagon?
I have allready formulated a lot of arguments why most of the bosses are bad design......
i am at the cinema now and going to watch batman soon.
i can give you a list in ~ 4h
you just not very smart ;)
its pretty funny
Sure thing.
A short list:
Most bosses in DS3 (and the earlier games) have "safe sectors" during many of their attacks. Places near them that you can just stand, without rolling or blocking, where you will be safe from that particular attack. Elden Ring has very few of these because so many attacks are wide horizontal sweeps and bosses can more easily turn on a dime halfway through their chargeup. Tracking is too high. (Good specific example is Blood Lord Mohg's super big fireball explosion. In an older DS game, you would be able to run around him if you're close while he is channelling. In this one he channels 90% of the way and then on release of the spell he will spin ~120 degrees if he needs to in order to face you.)
Pretty much every single boss is too big by at least 20%. Take a quick look at a video for Kalameet vs any of the dragons in this game. Iudex Gundyr compared to an Ulcerated Tree Spirit. Even the things that are supposed to be big, take a quick glance at the Last Giant from DS2 or Iron Golem from DS1 and then the Fire Giant from Elden Ring.
Bosses move way too fast and way too abruptly. There are so many important moves in Elden Ring that you simply cannot react to. They are too fast. Nobody can dodge Godskin Noble's charged piercing attack on reaction alone, they have to move predictively. This has always been a thing but there are far more in this game and they are far more likely to outright kill you if you fail.
Too many things kill you if you get caught. In previous games, for most players, boss fights were often battles of attrition with a lot of traded blows. I expect far less estus is consumed in boss fights in Elden Ring on average, because you can't trade blows in many cases. Malenia's weeb fury attack, Alecto's jumping weeb blender attack, Godskin Noble's jackhammer stabs, Placidusax's fire breath AOE, Astel's grab, Blood Lord Mohg's countdown. They all have counters, yes. In many cases those counters involve playing very passively and keeping distance for an absurdly drawn out fight. Not everyone wants to do no-hit runs.
Editing to add a few more:
Way too many duo/trio/summon/mismatched pair fights. Way, way, way too many. Like the "no safe sectors" point I think this was done to intentionally try to hamstring coop/summons because it's absolutely trivial to kill anything (even the crowd bosses) 3v1, but that's just a theory.
Most bosses can't be interrupted so you can only really ever safely swing when they're completed done with their combos. Weirdly, too many can be too easily staggered with jump attacks.
Downtime between combos is way too short. Some of these guys basically chain 12 swing helicopter moves into another 12 swing helicopter move. It's boring, especially combined with the point above.
Too many changeups and switcheroos in combos make it almost like there aren't combos. Generally I'd be for this. I like a much more fluid and reactive challenge than learning a script. But this just doesn't work when combined with the idea of oneshot killers, dodges that rely on prediction, and never being able to interrupt them except with stagger.
They have way too much health. If you only get to attack once every 2 minutes, they should die pretty quickly. Beating Alecto literally took me more than 10 minutes. It's a humanoid boss. That's dumb.
Margitt was really tough but then i grinded all the dungeons before fighting morgitt and he was just easy.
You can parry btw.
Keep in mind that the boss, is supposed to be annoying, the boss is supposed to frustrate you, the boss is supposed to back off because the boss want to give you a challenge.
Elden Ring forces you to be watchful of the signs the bosses are giving off to their next move, they wore made to be read but if you are impatient you will be punished, if you are too patient you will be punished, if you learn to time everything you will be reworded. When you figure out what works you will realize it's not that damn difficult it was all in your head because everything you need to beat the game is in the game.
Margit has an item that can be found called Margits shackle, when you activate the item during the first act of his fight it will bind him to the floor leaving him open for some free hits. It can be used twice in the first act of the fight only.
These bosses aren't so tedious if you people just use your brains, go on youtube and look up videos that will help you increase your damage output by adding some new undiscovered equipment to your arsenal or respec your character. There's too many ways for you to improve your experiences, for me to hear you guys cry and belly ache about mechanics when this game can be approached in so many ways to make it easier. I also wondered if some of you people ever considered just running pass some of these enemies? You don't have to fight every NPC you see sometimes I just run pass them just to get to the boss because they are just annoying and soaking up all of my resources before I even reach the boss.
I'm hearing about things that can be easily fixed if you just changed your approach to the game.
Not all hard bosses are fun to fight. All easy bosses are boring to fight.
And now to the things i dont like with ER bosses
1.) Hit boxes that are bigger than visuals
A lot of the hitboxes are bigger than the visual of the weapon. Extreme case is Margit and Morgott.... both in their diagonal swings have far longer reach than what their visual weapon shows.
If you dodge a weapon close you will still get hit by the body of a boss which makes no sense.
best example Morgott spear running attack. If you jump right next to it while he is still running you stand next to the spear have no connection to it but morgots left body will hit you 3 times as if it was the spear >_<
This happens also a lot if you are 45c evading a frontal attack.
you clearly visual dodge the weapon but parts of the body of the boss hit you for full weapn damage.
this was completely different in DS3 and Sekiro
One of the funnier things is that if you jump over a vertical Axe swing from for example a Gargoyle you get still full axe damage even after the axe has landed and you are still in the air above the axe >-<
2.)Super Late extreme tracking
Bosses in ER have ridiculous tracking
they somtimes can 170c change their attack mid animation and hit you from completely unrealistic angles.
its almost always better to iframe roll directly into the attack than to evade next to the attack....
even though visually the boss can not hit you in the correct position he will still pull off a miracle 170c anglechange just at the last moment of his attack.
i think tracking is not that big of a problem if done correctly
DS3 and Sekiro bosses both had it.
But they could only change direction at the start of the animation.
in ER they can often change direction of attack miliiseconds before the end of the attack.
Its completely ridiculous.
Thats also the reason why it is impossible to consistently evade attacks by running.
the attacks will track you down like a heat guided missle......
4.) recovery animation cancel into super fast close range attacks.
Many bosses have these.
It means they do a ultra heavy attack and should be in recovery animation but they can just cancel it and start ultra fast attack combos out of nowhere when you are close.
Good example is again Morgott spear running attack.
He runs with the spear and does a heavy thrust but immediately follows up with a super fast diagnoal downsinwg with his sword that hits anything that is next to him.
doesnt matter if you are left or right... unless you are directly behind him which needs double roll and some luck you can only run away or will always get hit.
5.) super long combos where u basically can do nothing but watch and wait.
boooring
6.) Very odd Parry Timings that just feel wrong.
Again the time when to parry has nothing to do with the actually attack.
In DS3 and Sekiro you can parry on visuals of the attack
in ER you cant
Just a few examples and its like that for many bosses.
Margitt Backhand -> you have to parry super super early almost 1 second before it even happens
Margit stab from above -> parry super super late just before the stick hits you.
Overhand swings ? parry on visual with medium delay
Long big delayed overhand attack -> parry quick 0.2 seconds after it starts to go down
Its just as if they decided which attacks have what parry timings by rolling dice.
It makes zero sense and is super artificial.
You can easily parry just by learning the patterns
but it feels so wrong even when you can pull it off.,
There is just no visual connection between the weapon and the parry timing.
You can adapt to all of this easily by just playing super save.
run away run away .. choose 1-2 attacks of the boss that are safe to punish and then run away again.
but thats super boring.
you can also win easily by using spirit ashes and getting free openings....
super boring
you can also dapat to all of this by just being overleveld and trade....
boring.
In DS3 and Sekiro when you are good you can create "Art"
The fights give possibilities to express yourself
the better you get the more options you see to be creative
in ER its not really possible so far.
Those mechanics shown above level the playing field.
It does not matter if you are skilled or super skilled....
it will be same result,
there is not a lot of room to be creative with skill.
Here are just some examples of DS3 how creative you could get when you are good.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWlHRf60kBA&ab_channel=Aeraloth
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UTe-k-2Lys&t=43s&ab_channel=TolomeoR
you could do all kinds of crazy stuff if you are good.
Boss mechnanics in ER dont allow that.
mainly bad hitboxes, close range recovery cancel into quick attacks and late tracking....
Its not ! about being able to beat the bosses
its about creating art through skill.
First of all, no the combat should neither be constant attacking or constant avoiding. A good boss design falls into a rhythm where you do both in constant flux. Running away from a boss waiting for them to be done with an attack you cannot consistently avoid is NOT good design. Especially when most boss moves in this game will come out in combos too fast to dodge consecutively, but too slow to dodge once through such as Gael's Cloak. If only we could actually block Malenia to cover for these hiccups but unfortunately that would make her fight even more drawn out giving her more opportunities to use her one shot.
Secondly, yes Midir is a boring fight. I wouldn't consider it a BAD fight but it definitely takes too long mainly because you spend half the fight chasing his fat ass around the arena, much like Elden Beast which people are ALSO complaining about funnily enough.
Thirdly, Gael does not require you to avoid him for anywhere near as long as Malenia. His attacks are well thought out and executed with clear wind ups. Hell I can consistently avoid Malenia's one shot even if I'm right next to her, that does not mean that move is not horrendous boss design. One simple fix? Have her traverse a good distance away from the player BEFORE she winds up the attack. It's not like she won't be able to reach you during her first combo anyway and it'll actually give people enough time to REACT to it.
If my eyes could roll out there ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ skull they would.