What is the point of Guard Counter?

[|<[]-ę]

I wanted to make classic knight, sword and board type.

Guard counters are useless. Every enemy can literally kill you before your guard counter hits them because it takes so much time. Idea is good, but it's literally most useless mechanic beside very scpecyfic situations where you maybe land one and break enemie's posture.

Can someone explain how I'm suppose to use that, or just make dual blade build and forget about shields.

[Dirty Hippy]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

frowningmirror eredeti hozzászólása:

Why would you block Maliketh, let alone guard counter? Hes meant to be dodged. Are you a troll? He has a huge greatsword of death that does damage over time on hit, only on the most dedicated shield build would you even attempt this.

Hes also not a boss thats easily poise broken, which is a big reason you'd use guard counter

No, but you are obviously a troll.

If people who build a tanky blocky character with a focus on guard counters basically get told, "lel dodge instead, you aren't spose ta block spammy attack" that just proves how bad guarding and guard counters really are.

It's also how many bosses with cancel their recovery times just to hit you and interrupt your GC attempt. It's also hilarious how many of them have massive push back on their attacks to keep you from using a GC (this happens even if you have guard boost so high that you lose zero stamina blocking the attack that pushes you back). It is funny how many bosses just do massive damage right through your shield. It is also funny how many bosses just add delayed explosions/shockwaves to their attacks so that trying to guard counter only makes you eat a hit instead. It is funny some enemies can even recover from a recoil before your GC connects, allowing them to back hop through it, and punish you instead.

Etc. Etc. Etc.

GC is terrible. But you don't actually care about any of this, and you will just continue trolling with ad hominem fallacies instead.

I don't think Guard Counters are terrible. There are more than a few situations where they're not going to work or won't work well. Keeping a thrusting weapon on hand for shielded pokes covers what GCs can't pretty well. The Great Epee is pretty rad for that.

[The Palmtop Tiger]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

Jork eredeti hozzászólása:

everyone here saying guard counter sucks really needs to try again with a greatshield instead of a normal shield.

it makes a huge difference.

It still sucks. If you think it is good, try using it in the Maliketh fight.

yeah bummer you can't just cheese one of the harder bosses in the game by sitting there and taking a beating.

[Morton Koopa Jr.]

Guard counter was literally one of the moments when I realized, oh wow, this game really is more accessible than the previous souls games.

You just have to be smart about when to use them, in a pve context anyways.

[Mesond]

I use it all the time. It works very well provided you use a one handed weapon. Are you using a heavy sword or something? Or just try to guard counter the wrong moves?

It tends to cause the enemy to flinch as well. Misbeggoten can be countered easily for a quick kill with the boss fight where it teams up with the crucible knight.

The only issue I've had with guard counter is that half the time when I release shift and then attack after it instead I'm doing the special attack as if I was holding shift. There seems to be a delay between when I release shift and when the game goes "Now I won't register shift". I just have to wait a brief moment before attacking after my shield (or weapon I'm blocking with) gets it. Which is fine if it's the right move to guard counter against. Because the enemy animation will be playing out anyway.

It takes a LOT of practice to know which moves to guard counter and which are more risk then they're worth. Crucible knight is good to train against.

[Morton Koopa Jr.]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

Morton Koopa Jr. eredeti hozzászólása:

Guard counter was literally one of the moments when I realized, oh wow, this game really is more accessible than the previous souls games.

You just have to be smart about when to use them, in a pve context anyways.

Except it is not, because you get going with it, then you run into bosses like Maliketh, and everything have your build setup for suddenly becomes basically useless.

Great Shields are heavy and have high Str requirements. Shield Barricade got super nerfed. Even people ITT staying GC are good are saying not to use it and just dodge instead in the exact sort of cases that you would want to use it. Late game bosses pushes blocking extremely hard.

And an INT focused build might have problems when they run into Rennala while I just stun locked the crap out of her.

Guard counter is great. It's not useless all because you may not be able to utilize it to your benefit in certain encounters. I certainly couldn't spam guard counter when I started the game and fought Margit. It's another tool in the toolbox.

If you can't survive blocking, either adjust your build to one that has enough stamina and a greatshield than can take advantage of that ability, or you don't rely on guard countering because it's not something upon which your current build capitalize.

[State Line Crosser]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

The very least they could have done is give it 100% super armor (You still take damage, but can never be staggered out of it.)

Definitely. That would make it situationally useful to block with a weapon as well.

[landmass]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

kkmmnn eredeti hozzászólása:

Oh hey, I’m that person that will find one situation it doesn’t work in and say “blah blah it’s not good”

You’re a nuisance

Funny how you always want in game examples, but then when those in game examples prove you wrong, you resort to personal attacks like this instead.

dont think ive ever once requested an "in game example" of anything. guard counters are amazing for a majority of enemies in a huge amount of situations for all sword and board builds.

youre wrong, deal with it... keep chasing that meta

[Asakura Shinichi]

|< -|- eredeti hozzászólása:

I wanted to make classic knight, sword and board type.

Guard counters are useless. Every enemy can literally kill you before your guard counter hits them because it takes so much time. Idea is good, but it's literally most useless mechanic beside very scpecyfic situations where you maybe land one and break enemie's posture.

Can someone explain how I'm suppose to use that, or just make dual blade build and forget about shields.

So basically you complain cause you want Guard Counter the first hit of a combo make a super fast counter and either stun the enemy or make him stop do his combo attack, sure maybe lets jus make all enemies stop attacking in the first place and sit on their asses so you lazy low skill kiddos can hit and kill them the easy way.

[frowningmirror]

Things can be situational.

I hear what you're saying about the broken stuff, but I figure that will be patched out eventually. If you fight "fair" without OP weapon arts, or say the cuckoo stone - carian retaliation glitch, its a good situational technique for smaller enemies.

[Morton Koopa Jr.]

D. Flame eredeti hozzászólása:

Morton Koopa Jr. eredeti hozzászólása:

And an INT focused build might have problems when they run into Rennala while I just stun locked the crap out of her.

Guard counter is great. It's not useless all because you may not be able to utilize it to your benefit in certain encounters. I certainly couldn't spam guard counter when I started the game and fought Margit. It's another tool in the toolbox.

If you can't survive blocking, either adjust your build to one that has enough stamina and a greatshield than can take advantage of that ability, or you don't rely on guard countering because it's not something upon which your current build capitalize.

Renala is one optional boss. GC gets blown up by several bosses, including mandatory ones.

Also try actually reading my posts before you try commenting on them.

Taking Margit for example, all of his glowing blade attacks will do chip damage through

Unfortunately, I'm not going to read this recent post because I haven't finished the game. But it honestly doesn't matter. There is no one technique that will work on every single boss in the previous souls games. They reward different things (and actually this is one of the things that DS1 in particular excels at.)

Naming off certain bosses in late game that punish guard counter doesn't tell me that guard counters are "useless".

Do they stop working on normal enemies? Do they stop working on ALL boss attacks? Do they only stop working if you DONT use greatshield?

Because if the answer is no, then the claim that they are useless is bunk.

I read your other completely. It didn't change my response. Oh and Margit? Yes, I use guard counters on Margit when it is safe. I block his glowing attacks completely.

[I'm cucked]

Guard counters do a ton of stagger and don't require you to commit. That's why they're good. Yhere ya go.

[ImHelping]

*player wishes guard counter was more useful and more polished overall because even a greatshield guard counter can sail over the head of a stationary enemy even with some long weapons*: Ugh, what a baby

*generic knight number nine thousand guard counters off a colossal weapon swing as if you gave them a light tap*: Well of COURSE guard counters should be rewarded and strong.

[Clockeye]

"...beside very scpecyfic situations where you maybe land one and break enemie's posture."

I like how people are ignoring this point of his, just to repeat it as if it's a counter argument lol.

[I'm cucked]

Clockeye eredeti hozzászólása:

"...beside very scpecyfic situations where you maybe land one and break enemie's posture."

I like how people are ignoring this point of his, just to repeat it as if it's a counter argument lol.

In one of my playthroughs, I build hard into guard countering. It's very strong. His point is anecdotal. That wasn't my experience. With the right setup and the curved sword talisman, it's legit.

[I-Chi]

I think one of those (very rare?) enemies I could never guard counter in time is the NPC invader right before Rennala. That dude's got crazy moves.

I have a primarily strength / heavy armor / greatsword + greatshield build and guard countering plays a huge roles in fights. I'm actually pretty stoked about how well my build is turning out.