What is V1's purpose?

[ChickenShred]

Alright, so the new death screen was a pretty massive bombshell in terms of lore. It confirmed our theories that V1 is sentient and can feel emotion, from when it said "You're not getting away this time" to "No vocal interface detected. Unable to complete task."
But one thing i can't put my finger on is V1's purpose in all of this. I heard somewhere that v1 was originally meant to be the machine to end the final war, but since the final war never happened, v1 had no real purpose. All he could do was harvest blood, like the other machines when they all purged humanity. So now v1 can only go down the 9 layers of hell to find blood and survive. But now what I have to say is: does v1 still have a goal? Does it even have a goal? Is v1 merely a form a tragedy in how its existence is inherently meaningless?

[purevessel]

v1 was made to counter earthmovers and survive previous machines. He doesnt really care tho, he just want blood.

[calembredaine]

past explicit goal was to be the next step in the arms race.
current goal is to survive and feed on blood, just like every other machines (or at least that's the intuition).
existential goal is a question the game loves to toy with using its different characters, but really it's the same as asking why living beings exist in the universe, or why the universe exists.

hope this helps.

[MURDER BEAR ESPORTS]

Originally posted by ChickenShred:

Is v1 merely a form a tragedy in how its existence is inherently meaningless?

Given the dialogue in the Mirage secret level I am inclined to say yes. Existence is functionally meaningless, and nothing we do will matter in the grand scale of the universe. V1 follows its directive in order to survive, but to survive it must kill, and once it has finished killing there will be nothing more to keep it alive. It has "won" and its victory will be nonexistentence.

But as is pointed out in the secret level, that doesn't mean life is inherently worthless. Rather, that we are free to live life how we may choose. V1 is trapped because at the end of the day it chooses to only follow its original directive - but it is seeing that same trap and seeing it reflected in hinself which causes Gabriel's introspection and his rebellion against the council. He cannot atone for what he has done to the denizens of hell. But with his death he may free the masses of Heaven.

I must of course cite Dreams End Come True by MothCPU for saying all this better than I can https://mothcpu.neocities.org/dect/story

[MURDER BEAR ESPORTS]

Now what I find interesting is V2's purpose. V1 was made as the final killing machine of the Final War. But V2 was made for security purposes during the new peace, hence why it is more durable than V1 is. V2 was never explicitly made to kill - did it go to hell for the same reason as V1? Or was it looking for something else in hell?

[purevessel]

Originally posted by MURDER BEAR ESPORTS:

Now what I find interesting is V2's purpose. V1 was made as the final killing machine of the Final War. But V2 was made for security purposes during the new peace, hence why it is more durable than V1 is. V2 was never explicitly made to kill - did it go to hell for the same reason as V1? Or was it looking for something else in hell?

blood

[ChickenShred]

Originally posted by MURDER BEAR ESPORTS:

Originally posted by ChickenShred:

Is v1 merely a form a tragedy in how its existence is inherently meaningless?

Given the dialogue in the Mirage secret level I am inclined to say yes. Existence is functionally meaningless, and nothing we do will matter in the grand scale of the universe. V1 follows its directive in order to survive, but to survive it must kill, and once it has finished killing there will be nothing more to keep it alive. It has "won" and its victory will be nonexistentence.

But as is pointed out in the secret level, that doesn't mean life is inherently worthless. Rather, that we are free to live life how we may choose. V1 is trapped because at the end of the day it chooses to only follow its original directive - but it is seeing that same trap and seeing it reflected in hinself which causes Gabriel's introspection and his rebellion against the council. He cannot atone for what he has done to the denizens of hell. But with his death he may free the masses of Heaven.

I must of course cite Dreams End Come True by MothCPU for saying all this better than I can https://mothcpu.neocities.org/dect/story

God that's cool, I didn't even knew there was this story made for V2's death.
There is still one thing that bothers me. You say v1 is trapped because it chooses to follow its original directive, but CAN it choose? In the same secret level, I think it's v1 who talks to mirage and teaches her that life is worthless yet we are free to live life as how we choose. What if in the level, v1 was only him in his most natural humane self and mirage was an amalgamation of v1's original directive? What if this is v1 trying to reflect upon itself? What if he wants to choose but he can't? And with this game's nods to Harlan Ellison, I feel that v1 is a representation of the angry menace in that it's trapped and in cosntant pain because it can't ever stray from its original directive, which is to kill. It has no mouth but it must scream.

[lynkcrafter]

Originally posted by ChickenShred:

but since the final war never happened,

??????????

[MURDER BEAR ESPORTS]

Originally posted by ChickenShred:

Originally posted by MURDER BEAR ESPORTS:

Given the dialogue in the Mirage secret level I am inclined to say yes. Existence is functionally meaningless, and nothing we do will matter in the grand scale of the universe. V1 follows its directive in order to survive, but to survive it must kill, and once it has finished killing there will be nothing more to keep it alive. It has "won" and its victory will be nonexistentence.

But as is pointed out in the secret level, that doesn't mean life is inherently worthless. Rather, that we are free to live life how we may choose. V1 is trapped because at the end of the day it chooses to only follow its original directive - but it is seeing that same trap and seeing it reflected in hinself which causes Gabriel's introspection and his rebellion against the council. He cannot atone for what he has done to the denizens of hell. But with his death he may free the masses of Heaven.

I must of course cite Dreams End Come True by MothCPU for saying all this better than I can https://mothcpu.neocities.org/dect/story

God that's cool, I didn't even knew there was this story made for V2's death.
There is still one thing that bothers me. You say v1 is trapped because it chooses to follow its original directive, but CAN it choose? In the same secret level, I think it's v1 who talks to mirage and teaches her that life is worthless yet we are free to live life as how we choose. What if in the level, v1 was only him in his most natural humane self and mirage was an amalgamation of v1's original directive? What if this is v1 trying to reflect upon itself? What if he wants to choose but he can't? And with this game's nods to Harlan Ellison, I feel that v1 is a representation of the angry menace in that it's trapped and in cosntant pain because it can't ever stray from its original directive, which is to kill. It has no mouth but it must scream.

That's an interesting idea about the mirage level. I think the question of choice is an interesting one because V1 doesn't have a lifetime or death date.

Mortals, like humans, live a finite amount of time. No matter how healthy or unhealthy you are, after around a century even the healthiest human bodies start to shut down. That gives humans a pretty concrete amount of time to do what they want and determine how they want to live their lives. But V1 and Gabriel are functionally immortal. V1 can keep running forever so long as it has blood, and as long as Gabriel is connected to god's light he won't die.

But between Gabriel being severed from god's light and blood becoming a finite resource, both are now faced with the possibility of dying. If Gabriel simply followed the council's directives he could once again live forever. But his choice was to accept his death sentence and reject the council. V1 could choose to stop murdering. But its remaining life would likely be a short one. That is a choice it can make - but as the game over screen says.

I don't want to die
I don't want to die
I don't want to die
I don't want to die

[MURDER BEAR ESPORTS]

https://twitter.com/KuRanberrri/status/1895890032931840113 Just saw this fanart and think it's fitting of this topic

[Cozy]

Not that it really matters but my thoughts were that why V1 and V2 were BUILT was to take down Earthmovers from the inside, since Earthmover vs Earthmover is basically an eternal stalemate, judging from their appearance in Violence. I know they were designed after the ceasefire but I have a hard time believing everyone would give it up. They even designed them to use blood fuel still. I think the implication is there clear enough that someone wanted the conflict to continue till there was nothing left. Or they're just stupid.

[MURDER BEAR ESPORTS]

IIRC from the terminal, V1 was made during the final war but the war ended before it could be mass produced. V2 was made after the New Peace began and was explicitly intended for security purposes.

[<#76428a>Sharkbilby]

V1 was designed to kill, heal off of blood and survive.
Their short term survival instincts set their goals to short term survival, and that's it.

[ChickenShred]

Originally posted by MURDER BEAR ESPORTS:

Originally posted by ChickenShred:

God that's cool, I didn't even knew there was this story made for V2's death.
There is still one thing that bothers me. You say v1 is trapped because it chooses to follow its original directive, but CAN it choose? In the same secret level, I think it's v1 who talks to mirage and teaches her that life is worthless yet we are free to live life as how we choose. What if in the level, v1 was only him in his most natural humane self and mirage was an amalgamation of v1's original directive? What if this is v1 trying to reflect upon itself? What if he wants to choose but he can't? And with this game's nods to Harlan Ellison, I feel that v1 is a representation of the angry menace in that it's trapped and in cosntant pain because it can't ever stray from its original directive, which is to kill. It has no mouth but it must scream.

That's an interesting idea about the mirage level. I think the question of choice is an interesting one because V1 doesn't have a lifetime or death date.

Mortals, like humans, live a finite amount of time. No matter how healthy or unhealthy you are, after around a century even the healthiest human bodies start to shut down. That gives humans a pretty concrete amount of time to do what they want and determine how they want to live their lives. But V1 and Gabriel are functionally immortal. V1 can keep running forever so long as it has blood, and as long as Gabriel is connected to god's light he won't die.

But between Gabriel being severed from god's light and blood becoming a finite resource, both are now faced with the possibility of dying. If Gabriel simply followed the council's directives he could once again live forever. But his choice was to accept his death sentence and reject the council. V1 could choose to stop murdering. But its remaining life would likely be a short one. That is a choice it can make - but as the game over screen says.

I don't want to die
I don't want to die
I don't want to die
I don't want to die

I like the comparison between V1 and Gabriel. Gabriel chose death because he wanted to free himself and the citizens of hell from what's basically authoritarian rule. And that begs the question: what reason does v1 have to choose death? He has nothing to protect or lose.
All he seems to know is to survive yet judging his role in the mirage level, he knows what life is like. I feel like v1 had some idea of what life was like before the final war but never got the chance to really experience it. And now that the world is gone of life, there is essentially no reason for v1 to "live." Only survive.

[Verban]

the final war did happen, it's just by the time the first one was made it was already ending, there was just simply no resources to sustain the manufacturing of the final machine to end the final war. So yes, it's utterly useless.