Dune 2 defined RTS genre, not C&C

[Rapulamankeli]

enought in headline :)

[jonoliveira12]

Yes, but you can never remaster Dune 2 (license issues), and C&C was the first RTS to actually have mass appeal. It overshadowed Dune 2 by a wide margin.

[Turbo Nozomix]

I really like that in Dune 2 you have to build ground tiles before building buildings on them. I also like that in Warcraft 1 you can build roads and have to build buildings next to them.

I wish modern RPGs would involve more mechanisms like so that the gameplay isn't all just quickly build a ton of units and attack with them. That's something I don't like about Sarcraft and why I like Age of Empires: The base design is a fun part of the game, and it feels more interesting to have the purpose of the game be about more than just amassing a horde to attack with.

[dprog1995]

CnC improved the genre vastly.

[Cosmic Cat]

Dune 2 was the first strategy game using mouse!

[Vincent]

For PC user surely but I played "Herzog Zwei" real time STR on Genesys before "Dune II" even release.
It was greatly used as inspiration source for creating Dune II, so I can't honestly think the same.

[Rapulamankeli]

Originally posted by Vincent:

For PC user surely but I played "Herzog Zwei" real time STR on Genesys before "Dune II" even release.
It was greatly used as inspiration source for creating Dune II, so I can't honestly think the same.

And of cource not with PC with Amiga. And "Herzog" was more tactical than Strategic :) of cource its counted as pre-dune, but as RTS definer, not so :) its can be counted as MOBA predecessor :)

[I>U]

Originally posted by Woob:

Dune 2 was the first strategy game using mouse!

I've played it with gamepad on SMD, though.

[Nyerguds]

It's debatable.

After all... Dune II was the first C&C game :p

https://i.imgur.com/Pi1HHUI.png

[Vincent]

Originally posted by Rapulamankeli (Ville):

Originally posted by Vincent:

For PC user surely but I played "Herzog Zwei" real time STR on Genesys before "Dune II" even release.
It was greatly used as inspiration source for creating Dune II, so I can't honestly think the same.

And of cource not with PC with Amiga. And "Herzog" was more tactical than Strategic :) of cource its counted as pre-dune, but as RTS definer, not so :) its can be counted as MOBA predecessor :)

Herzog Zwei is confirmed as RTS, and is also a MOBA predecessor.

Wiki RTS:

IGN cites Herzog Zwei (1989), released for the Sega Mega Drive/Genesis home console in 1989 as "arguably the first RTS game ever",[23] and it is often cited as "the first real-time strategy game" according to Ars Technica.[8] It combines traditional strategy gameplay with fully real-time, fast-paced, arcade-style action gameplay,[24] featuring a split-screen two-player mode where both players are in action simultaneously and there are no pauses while decisions are taken, forcing players to think quickly while on the move.[24] In Herzog Zwei, though the player only controls one unit, the manner of control foreshadowed the point-and-click mechanic of later games. Scott Sharkey of 1UP argues that it introduced much of the genre conventions, including unit construction and resource management, with the control and destruction of bases being an important aspect of the game, as were the economic/production aspects of those bases.[15] Herzog Zwei is credited by 1UP as a landmark that defined the genre and as "the progenitor of all modern real-time strategy games."[15] Chuck Sperry cited Herzog Zwei as an influence on Dune II (1992).

There is more about STR roots on the wiki which seem to start in 1981.

[I>U]

Originally posted by Nyerguds:

It's debatable.

After all... Dune II was the first C&C game :p

https://i.imgur.com/Pi1HHUI.png

And Empreror: BFD was the last. But CnC kids would never know.

[Nyerguds]

Originally posted by I>U:

And Empreror: BFD was the last. But CnC kids would never know.

Sorry to out-nerd you on obscure facts like this, but EBFD was outsourced to Intelligent Games in the UK, just like Dune 2000, so I'm not sure if that counts.

And apparently quite some of the original WW team worked on Generals: Zero Hour.

[GamerCH]

Originally posted by Nyerguds:

It's debatable.

After all... Dune II was the first C&C game :p

https://i.imgur.com/Pi1HHUI.png

by that logic the last one would be UaW.

Hm... did ya guys ever look... thoroughly at their Dune games? Like the... backstory of it? Dune 2 is possibly a prequel to RA.

[Nyerguds]

Originally posted by Ivanka 46th:

by that logic the last one would be UaW.

I also got evidence from interviews that the game engine used for Dune II was called the Command & Conquer engine, even back then.

Universe at War was never officially part of the C&C series. Dune II was. This isn't about logic; it's about what the developers said.

Originally posted by Ivanka 46th:

Hm... did ya guys ever look... thoroughly at their Dune games? Like the... backstory of it? Dune 2 is possibly a prequel to RA.

Dune was a licensed game on the Dune franchise, setting it about 10.000 years into the future. So, no. Get yer crackpot theories out of here.

[GamerCH]

How was it the Command & Conquer engine when back then Command & Conquer was gonna have magic and had a different name that I can't dig up atm.

You surely know it.

In its early days, as with all projects, what is set in stone and what isn't varies. Especially over time.

[Nyerguds]

Originally posted by Ivanka 46th:

How was it the Command & Conquer engine when back then Command & Conquer was gonna have magic and had a different name that I can't dig up atm.

Because the name "Command & Conquer" existed before that concept. They conceived the name for Dune II.

And, yes, I know it. The old fantasy concept was called "Command & Conquer: Fortress of Stone".