How Are They Going To Combat Cheating ?

[CptnSpandex]

I mean if they are going to use easily bypassed anti-cheat as it should be called or client side anti-cheats then i am 100% out before i am even in, not even going to waste the time of day on something that is going to get swarmed with cheaters from day 1, if their cheat stuff is server side though so it cannot be tampered with by the player then it is a different story ?.

[bourland]

Let the GM's figure it out or the Devs. I'm wondering were the GM's are in the Discussions.

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by bourland:

Let the GM's figure it out or the Devs. I'm wondering were the GM's are in the Discussions.

? I gather they have not answered this question yet, because i know without a shadow of a doubt if it is indeed easy anti cheat or client side anti cheat and people knew it would for sure have an impact on game sales, alot of people will not even go near a game now if it has them, pay out 75 quid just to not be able to play the game 2 days later because of thousands of people cheating with 0 consequences, yeah i would rather not.

Originally posted by bourland:

I'd play this Solo if I bought it. What I would really like is a Skilled Programmer making offline game play possible. You know when there is a game glitch and you just leave the game and play and level, then check back in with a new character. Kinda like playing without the server lag, ganking zergs, etc. You have been there.
But really, for now I'm going to watch Twitch, You Tube and this Board for all the cheats, hacks, game glitches, secret codes and hints that make a new game Funner ...
Playing Solo on Dune is my major goal so don't F it up for me..

Oh silly me lol, i see you are planning on cheating already and this is why you would like to know !!!.

[wildbill]

Originally posted by CptnSpandex:

Originally posted by bourland:

Let the GM's figure it out or the Devs. I'm wondering were the GM's are in the Discussions.

? I gather they have not answered this question yet, because i know without a shadow of a doubt if it is indeed easy anti cheat or client side anti cheat and people knew it would for sure have an impact on game sales, alot of people will not even go near a game now if it has them, pay out 75 quid just to not be able to play the game 2 days later because of thousands of people cheating with 0 consequences, yeah i would rather not.

Originally posted by bourland:

I'd play this Solo if I bought it. What I would really like is a Skilled Programmer making offline game play possible. You know when there is a game glitch and you just leave the game and play and level, then check back in with a new character. Kinda like playing without the server lag, ganking zergs, etc. You have been there.
But really, for now I'm going to watch Twitch, You Tube and this Board for all the cheats, hacks, game glitches, secret codes and hints that make a new game Funner ...
Playing Solo on Dune is my major goal so don't F it up for me..

Oh silly me lol, i see you are planning on cheating already and this is why you would like to know !!!.

I guess he figures if you can't beat em, join em (join the cheaters that is).

[Scribe]

If big rich Rockstar can't figure it out then I don't know how Funcom could.

I have absolutely no idea how it can be avoided, many say cheating/scripting/hacking is an inevitability... We are all gonna just have to see how it plays out.

[wildbill]

Originally posted by Scribe:

If big rich Rockstar can't figure it out then I don't know how Funcom could.

I have absolutely no idea how it can be avoided, many say cheating/scripting/hacking is an inevitability... We are all gonna just have to see how it plays out.

Seems some players can't help but try and find an unfair advantage. Could be with PvP, could be PvE (like blocking off resources). Not just cheating/scripting/hacking, but also griefing. This is why some want private servers. Others want a single player version. Some have a higher tolerance for bad behavior, some just don't want to be around it and the best way to avoid it is to not play on an official server.

[Scribe]

Any options to avoid being in the same session as cheats sounds good to me :-)

[Sir.Dave.Wolf]

If you want to know how they currently combat cheating, let's take a look at Conan Exiles:

They do 1 patch every ~3 months (often longer).
They use BattleEye as Anticheat.
There have been cheaters using the same cheats for 5 years now.

So they never really did something against the cheaters. They occasionally fixed exploits but even those took them months to fix.

[E=d.u²]

Until I stop playing Conan Exiles because cheaters, we still had a good amount of them dominating the official PvP servers and you just couldn't win, even reporting.

We've reached a point where they had so much resources scattered around so many accounts, and doesn't matter that you proved those accounts were from the same cheaters (you have to prove, because they don't care and don't investigate), the cheaters kept cheating and winning.

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by Scribe:

If big rich Rockstar can't figure it out then I don't know how Funcom could.

I have absolutely no idea how it can be avoided, many say cheating/scripting/hacking is an inevitability... We are all gonna just have to see how it plays out.

Grand theft auto and red dead online are peer 2 peer servers mate, there are no servers, someone hosts the server on their machine, did you not know that ?, that is how they cannot stop cheating, do you see cheating on wow or guild wars ?, nope because their servers pick them up instantly. If gta 6 does this same formula it is doomed from day 1 by the way due to their ignorance and pure greed.

You see games companys can go the expensive way which is to have their own servers and have payed anti cheat server side which the player cannot get around because they cannot tamper with it, or they can go the cheap route and have it client side and then the player just deletes it and runs a file to make the game think it is running when in fact it is not even on their pc at all. Even better is to have in house anti cheats made by the developer that run checks, then the cheat seller or whatever has no clue what they are trying to code and combat.

Any game where they ask you to report cheaters is just saying we have your money now and we don't care, we could take bigger steps that would involve spending money but we wont do that so we can have a larger profit, greed that the player then suffers from and from that greed the lifespan of that game then suffers and the money they could of made goes down the toilet because they did not look at the bigger picture just the instant release cash.

But this kinda answers my question, think ill turn my back on this one, i mean they are planning on battlepasses and such so i bet player level and their shop is protected server side and then all else will be chucked client side, this is ok for a pve game but it's not, a huge portion of it is pvp, i mean how hard would it be server side to run random checks on how much damage did the player do, they know the max amount of damage possible so if they did more = Ban, how much damage did their shield and health take, they know the max values so if it exceeds = Ban, they do not have to run a check of every person at the same time just randomise the check and it would catch them.

[Scribe]

Yeah, I forgot Roxy used peer to peer, it's been a while, saw it in a video explaining the whole menu mod cheater thing a while ago.

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by Scribe:

Yeah, I forgot Roxy used peer to peer, it's been a while, saw it in a video explaining the whole menu mod cheater thing a while ago.

Yup, all it took is for them to make official servers and the mod menu problem would have been gone in an instant but would they ?, nah they would prefer to let their valued customers take one so they can reap the extra cash and not buy official servers, does not say alot for rockstar now does it !!!.

[Bloodflush]

Originally posted by CptnSpandex:

Originally posted by Scribe:

If big rich Rockstar can't figure it out then I don't know how Funcom could.

I have absolutely no idea how it can be avoided, many say cheating/scripting/hacking is an inevitability... We are all gonna just have to see how it plays out.

Grand theft auto and red dead online are peer 2 peer servers mate, there are no servers, someone hosts the server on their machine, did you not know that ?, that is how they cannot stop cheating, do you see cheating on wow or guild wars ?, nope because their servers pick them up instantly. If gta 6 does this same formula it is doomed from day 1 by the way due to their ignorance and pure greed.

You see games companys can go the expensive way which is to have their own servers and have payed anti cheat server side which the player cannot get around because they cannot tamper with it, or they can go the cheap route and have it client side and then the player just deletes it and runs a file to make the game think it is running when in fact it is not even on their pc at all. Even better is to have in house anti cheats made by the developer that run checks, then the cheat seller or whatever has no clue what they are trying to code and combat.

Any game where they ask you to report cheaters is just saying we have your money now and we don't care, we could take bigger steps that would involve spending money but we wont do that so we can have a larger profit, greed that the player then suffers from and from that greed the lifespan of that game then suffers and the money they could of made goes down the toilet because they did not look at the bigger picture just the instant release cash.

But this kinda answers my question, think ill turn my back on this one, i mean they are planning on battlepasses and such so i bet player level and their shop is protected server side and then all else will be chucked client side, this is ok for a pve game but it's not, a huge portion of it is pvp, i mean how hard would it be server side to run random checks on how much damage did the player do, they know the max amount of damage possible so if they did more = Ban, how much damage did their shield and health take, they know the max values so if it exceeds = Ban, they do not have to run a check of every person at the same time just randomise the check and it would catch them.

you wrong about wow ^^ botter/cheater most the time get banned after 6+ month

why do i know that easy i know same botter (by the way there where in top 1-100 guilds) that play wow for free and run 5+ bots for free

why never need to farm or pay sameone only blizzard gets more payed so why banning

if you can ban them 6+ month later and make more money


but will it happen her maybe maybe not after all it more work to do buy acc lvl acc but we know there are still companys that will do it anyway after all it only energy for them

But that aswell can only happen if not so nice guys buy stuff on site like that but if buy/bots/hacker get banned fast it is not profit or less than doing it in another game

it will not happen but we all know starts in anygame most are FOMOS and there like cheap offers and rich guys dont carre if there lose 100-1k money so there will do it anyway if the offers are there

but if bots/cheater get banned after 1-2h atleast there will go away quickly

[AdahnGorion]

In the vast majority of games with a competitive angle.. there will be cheating, also cheating that can´t be stopped.

So expect cheating and then just try to have fun anyway.

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by AdahnGorion:

In the vast majority of games with a competitive angle.. there will be cheating, also cheating that can´t be stopped.

So expect cheating and then just try to have fun anyway.

All games that do not have the anti cheat software client side have no cheating, you leave it client side and that opens up the possibility or the guarantee that they will either bypass it easily or a company will bypass it and charge for the cheats, look at all shooters with anti cheats, be it battle eye, easy anti cheat, denuvo anti cheat they are all client side on your machine, that is where the fault lies.

[Kyutaru]

Originally posted by CptnSpandex:

Originally posted by AdahnGorion:

In the vast majority of games with a competitive angle.. there will be cheating, also cheating that can´t be stopped.

So expect cheating and then just try to have fun anyway.

All games that do not have the anti cheat software client side have no cheating, you leave it client side and that opens up the possibility or the guarantee that they will either bypass it easily or a company will bypass it and charge for the cheats, look at all shooters with anti cheats, be it battle eye, easy anti cheat, denuvo anti cheat they are all client side on your machine, that is where the fault lies.

You seem to misunderstand how cheating software works. I have no doubt you have heard the problem being tied to "client-side" software being the problem. But that's where you got mixed up.

If anti-cheat software wasn't client-side, there would be no way to detect cheaters. The server doesn't see your cheats, it only sees the legal spoofed actions your computer is sending to it. So if your computer claims to have landed a headshot, the server believes it. You can't prove server-side that it wasn't a headshot because the HIT DETECTION is what's client-side.

The hit detection being client-sided is what leads to cheating, but it's also necessary because lag was intense in the old days when it wasn't and it cost servers a lot to run the calculations themselves. I still remember having to aim 2-3 seconds ahead of my target, which made standing still in a shooter deadly while moving around and spamming jumps was the optimal way to confuse targets. Due to the latency, we had to aim 10-20 feet ahead of where the target was going and try to match its velocity and trajectory.

On top of this, ways to spoof the anti-cheats too were developed using programs that ran before the anti-cheat did to inhibit its detection processes. That's why kernel anti-cheats now exist that run at the admin level, to detect cheats that also run at the admin level. Some even require you to run the anti-cheat at Startup to ensure there are no other programs capable of outspeeding it and establishing a spoof. Yet even this isn't foolproof because external cheating is now possible, which is processed off your computer's hard drive and isn't detectable by the anti-cheat software that is limited to your computer.

In the war against cheating, it's a progressive battle of moves and countermoves and there is no way as of yet to completely solve the problem. MMORPGs are generally the safest because they aren't actually running processes on your computer client-side most of the time, they are simply accepting button inputs from your UI that the server itself processes like health and damage dealt. Sometimes MMOs will cheat and give your computer these processes to save money, or have things like movement permissions handled by the client which leads to speedhackers or ghosting, but you can theoretically still handle it all server-side and give the client nothing but a joystick to control a remote character with.