Souls like vs hack'n'slash

[Kai]

Can this title be moved to a hack'n'slash style rather than this slow boring souls clone? And can this title be given to an experienced dev for this type of game, specially the combat, that has no depth. No offence to Respawn, as they are industry leads in what they're good at, Activision has earned billions over the years and are milking the same cod till this day. But the characters, the setting are really good and can be a great series. It would be such a waste if this ends up being just a shallow platformer souls clone.

[Muerte]

Do you seriously think the charactersi n this game are good?!

[Kai]

Not great sure, but at least they aren't annoying. Anakin, Ahsoka and Ezra were annoying as hell, but look at them now.

My point is that this can be great, Cal being a padwan during the republic can tie him to everything and who knows might even fill the starkiller role in canon.

[Go0lden_Archer]

Respawn did a good job on their own game, and if their own game is given to some idiots it would just make things worse. to get progress, you let inspired devs continue, not offshore it to whomever. plus ea doesn't have any whomevers, they killed off closest possible studio. not to mention there're couple sw projects in the work at ea, doubtful they need more.

p. s. that all being said, I understand even less why you'd want someone to meddle with the existing IP instead of making entirely new one. Star Wars has a massive timeline and boring hack'n'slash can fit it anywhere just as much as this fitted in. no need to make apples into pears

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

Originally posted by Go0lden_Archer:

Respawn did a good job on their own game, and if their own game is given to some idiots it would just make things worse. to get progress, you let inspired devs continue, not offshore it to whomever. plus ea doesn't have any whomevers, they killed off closest possible studio. not to mention there're couple sw projects in the work at ea, doubtful they need more.

p. s. that all being said, I understand even less why you'd want someone to meddle with the existing IP instead of making entirely new one. Star Wars has a massive timeline and boring hack'n'slash can fit it anywhere just as much as this fitted in. no need to make apples into pears

Not to mention that hack’n’slash is kind of a dying genre, being replaced by the more skilled approach to flashy combat that people refer to as souls-like, though usually it really isn’t like the combat in those games.

I also think the patience souls-like challenge instills is a lot more conducive of a Jedi, over the chaotic spectacle of hack’n’slash.

[GenerallyThrawn]

They did good, up until the game optimization part came in.

[Lupin III]

Originally posted by Kai:

Not great sure, but at least they aren't annoying. Anakin, Ahsoka and Ezra were annoying as hell, but look at them now.

My point is that this can be great, Cal being a padwan during the republic can tie him to everything and who knows might even fill the starkiller role in canon.

Ezra never stopped being annoying.

[Kai]

Originally posted by Lupin III:

Originally posted by Kai:

Not great sure, but at least they aren't annoying. Anakin, Ahsoka and Ezra were annoying as hell, but look at them now.

My point is that this can be great, Cal being a padwan during the republic can tie him to everything and who knows might even fill the starkiller role in canon.

Ezra never stopped being annoying.

He turned fine in the end.

Originally posted by (Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr:

Originally posted by Go0lden_Archer:

Respawn did a good job on their own game, and if their own game is given to some idiots it would just make things worse. to get progress, you let inspired devs continue, not offshore it to whomever. plus ea doesn't have any whomevers, they killed off closest possible studio. not to mention there're couple sw projects in the work at ea, doubtful they need more.

p. s. that all being said, I understand even less why you'd want someone to meddle with the existing IP instead of making entirely new one. Star Wars has a massive timeline and boring hack'n'slash can fit it anywhere just as much as this fitted in. no need to make apples into pears

Not to mention that hack’n’slash is kind of a dying genre, being replaced by the more skilled approach to flashy combat that people refer to as souls-like, though usually it really isn’t like the combat in those games.

I also think the patience souls-like challenge instills is a lot more conducive of a Jedi, over the chaotic spectacle of hack’n’slash.

Dying genre? no. GOW is still sony's big gun. DMC is back on top within capcom, Square enix has turned FF into a turn based and hack'n'slash hybrid. There are multiple upcoming high budget games like Nier, hellblade and Granblue fantasy. Theses a lot more, its definitely doing better than souls like games for that matter.

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

Originally posted by Kai:

Originally posted by Lupin III:

Ezra never stopped being annoying.

He turned fine in the end.

Originally posted by (Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr:

Not to mention that hack’n’slash is kind of a dying genre, being replaced by the more skilled approach to flashy combat that people refer to as souls-like, though usually it really isn’t like the combat in those games.

I also think the patience souls-like challenge instills is a lot more conducive of a Jedi, over the chaotic spectacle of hack’n’slash.

Dying genre? no. GOW is still sony's big gun. DMC is back on top within capcom, Square enix has turned FF into a turn based and hack'n'slash hybrid. There are multiple upcoming high budget games like Nier, hellblade and Granblue fantasy. Theses a lot more, its definitely doing better than souls like games for that matter.

GOW isn't hack'n'slash anymore, neither is FF7 Remake. FF16 also looks more like a skill-based Action RPG rather than HnS, but we will have to see.

The term "Souls-like" is a bit misused, really people are just referring to an ARPG where skill and challenge are emphasized in the gameplay design over style and spectacle.

[Kai]

Originally posted by (Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr:

Originally posted by Kai:

He turned fine in the end.


Dying genre? no. GOW is still sony's big gun. DMC is back on top within capcom, Square enix has turned FF into a turn based and hack'n'slash hybrid. There are multiple upcoming high budget games like Nier, hellblade and Granblue fantasy. Theses a lot more, its definitely doing better than souls like games for that matter.

GOW isn't hack'n'slash anymore, neither is FF7 Remake. FF16 also looks more like a skill-based Action RPG rather than HnS, but we will have to see.

The term "Souls-like" is a bit misused, really people are just referring to an ARPG where skill and challenge are emphasized in the gameplay design over style and spectacle.

Action adventure is just the generic genre used so it can be labelled with other similar games but with other mechanics when they have to be tagged for awards. The core game of gow is still hack n slash, just like how arkham and spiderman are beatemups, but labeled as action adventure, but are they the same as sekiro or dmc? no. Yakuza used to be a beatemp, now its a turn based game, still labelled as action adventure.

ARPGs are also a generic term used mostly for diablo like games, for some reason. That is why its insane to get into genre labelling arguments. If i say soulslike, beatemups, hacknslash, its already understood, people know what they are talking about, no need to press it further.

[hearwade]

The game is decent. not perfect, but decent.. A full game with a full story and about 2-3 replays for the interested gamer.
fighting is simplistic with several methods that are unlocked as you level up.
Fully upgraded, there are a few good combos and power moves. enemies are okay with a number of sub-types.
Not darksouls, not a hack and slash but closer to a H&S than dark. good platformer.
It is a game that should not exist...there were to be lootboxes and i think a store planned but after the terrible battlefront2 issue and the authorities looking into if looboxes were legal they stripped this game back to a nice full story with good basic game mechanics..
The maps are fun and quite hard.

[Krispy]

imagine wanting a hack and slash game with lightsabers... the weapons are supposed to kill in a single hit, not bat away at enemies like garbage force unleashed

[Kai]

Right, last time i checked all duels in movies and clone wars were full contact continous back and forth hits that lasted for long screen time. Never had anyone stood still, attacked, dodged, stood still then attack again, then repeat over and over again like how these souls like game work.

TFU games were leagues of fun ahead of this game at least.

[(Edgy) Asriel Dreemurr]

Originally posted by Kai:

Right, last time i checked all duels in movies and clone wars were full contact continous back and forth hits that lasted for long screen time. Never had anyone stood still, attacked, dodged, stood still then attack again, then repeat over and over again like how these souls like game work.

TFU games were leagues of fun ahead of this game at least.

Sekiro is a thing.

[Lupin III]

Originally posted by Kai:

Right, last time i checked all duels in movies and clone wars were full contact continous back and forth hits that lasted for long screen time. Never had anyone stood still, attacked, dodged, stood still then attack again, then repeat over and over again like how these souls like game work.

TFU games were leagues of fun ahead of this game at least.

Actually your second description of dueling is pretty much what the fights from the original trilogy were like. The fight between Obi-wan and Vader was slow, deliberate, and spent a lot of time with the two opponents just standing back and testing each other. That's also how the fight between Vader and Luke goes in Return of the Jedi, right up until the point that Luke loses his ♥♥♥♥ and almost falls to the dark side.

The entire problem, though, is that Disney won't allow human dismemberment. Not in their games, and not in their movies. Lightsaber combat should be like the fight between Count Dooku, Obi-Wan, and Anakin in Attack of the Clones. The first person to make a mistake loses a limb, the fight, and would generally end up dead at that moment without some external influence changing the outcome. That's how a lightsaber duel should be.

A fight against the grunts of an army should be like what we see in Phantom Menace when Qui-gon and Obi-wan are hacking battle droids to pieces on the Trade Federation ship.

Disney is the problem. Just look at what they did to lightsaber combat in their awful sequel trilogy. Rey slashed Kylo across the head with a lightsaber and all it did was leave a rash. That strike clearly should have cut half his face clean off. Same with what Kylo did to Finn... Finn should have ended up like Maul, in two pieces. Disney neutered lightsabers and made them no more deadly than any other steel sword.

Fallen Order's lightsaber combat could do it perfectly. The timed parrying, blocking, and dodging is how it should be... but the boss duels should be over at the first mistake.

[Kai]

Originally posted by Lupin III:

Originally posted by Kai:

Right, last time i checked all duels in movies and clone wars were full contact continous back and forth hits that lasted for long screen time. Never had anyone stood still, attacked, dodged, stood still then attack again, then repeat over and over again like how these souls like game work.

TFU games were leagues of fun ahead of this game at least.

Actually your second description of dueling is pretty much what the fights from the original trilogy were like. The fight between Obi-wan and Vader was slow, deliberate, and spent a lot of time with the two opponents just standing back and testing each other. That's also how the fight between Vader and Luke goes in Return of the Jedi, right up until the point that Luke loses his ♥♥♥♥ and almost falls to the dark side.

The entire problem, though, is that Disney won't allow human dismemberment. Not in their games, and not in their movies. Lightsaber combat should be like the fight between Count Dooku, Obi-Wan, and Anakin in Attack of the Clones. The first person to make a mistake loses a limb, the fight, and would generally end up dead at that moment without some external influence changing the outcome. That's how a lightsaber duel should be.

A fight against the grunts of an army should be like what we see in Phantom Menace when Qui-gon and Obi-wan are hacking battle droids to pieces on the Trade Federation ship.

Disney is the problem. Just look at what they did to lightsaber combat in their awful sequel trilogy. Rey slashed Kylo across the head with a lightsaber and all it did was leave a rash. That strike clearly should have cut half his face clean off. Same with what Kylo did to Finn... Finn should have ended up like Maul, in two pieces. Disney neutered lightsabers and made them no more deadly than any other steel sword.

Fallen Order's lightsaber combat could do it perfectly. The timed parrying, blocking, and dodging is how it should be... but the boss duels should be over at the first mistake.

Currently Lucasfilm is undergoing an internal struggle, between the people who have ruined star wars for the last 5 years and continue to force woke bs like High Republic and most of the upcoming shows milked from the Mandalorian and the people who actually make good starwars like Filoni and Favreau. They used to take Filoni for granted as its easy to say clone wars is or kids, but now when hes got hands on with live action and showed the casual fans how its done, he can possibly retcon and fix star wars.

There was dismemberment in Season 7, in the Maul corridor scene, so it all depends on whos in charge. Even Luke's rescue of Grogu was pure hack n slash with no hesitation or fear. Even without it, this game lacks the technical quality and feedback of the basic lightsaber combat. I didnt realise it at first, but i went and played Tsushima and came back for a NG+, realised its inferior in so many ways for 2020. Even DMC5 has timed parrys, timed blocking and timed dodges, theses a lot going on in those games thats so hard to master. So its not about these mechanics, but the core design thats flawed.

Original trilogy was in the 70s, Hollywood didnt even understand what martial arts was. Most of weapon based choreography was like the old samurai movies. I dont think they even still do, they hired Dinnie fk Yen for Rogue One and gave him a silly role, they shouldve made him a full Jedi and go up against Vader just to establish in live action once and for all how strong Anakin is even without his physical prowess. But after the Prequels, theyve adopted a more theatrical approach thats been the norm in all starwars media. The old republic cutscenes by Blur studios have done the best duels imo. So since EP1, all combat have been all about theatrical choreography. Sequels were designed to cater OT wannabe elitists, ah even thinking about the sequels pisses me off.

It makes no sense for Jedi/Sith game to have souls like combat, because that style instils fear, survival and fight like youre inferior to all your opponents and one mistake can kill you, even a level 1 trooper. Only way it would work is if you put an untrained padawan on Korriban and tell him survive all the sith. It should be a fast paced lightsaber flurry mixing force powers and environment with confidence, building killstreaks with the most imaginative ways. that makes it fun.