I might be misremembering my chemistry

[SteveWinwood]

But aren't these two structures the same?

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/772858335317141310/DD6CDB855E3B1EAA60053CE1BB24FC8138BFBACA/

Benzene rings have the alternating bonding pattern and theyre both resonance forms.

I guess I can understand because it's what the game is exactly expecting from you, but it's functionally the same thing. They sometimes just put circles in the middle instead of any of the double bonds.

Also yes I only got into this situation because I didn't notice a benzene ring is given to you in the starting molecule options.

[DrMage]

It seems in its current state the game is VERY particular about getting everything exact. Something I hope they revisit later on in development. One thing I think really opened Spacechem up in terms of creativity in solutions was how as long as the bonds were all there the shape of the final product didn't matter.

[Sith]

Yeah the game doesn't account for identical structures atm. I had to double check that diethyl ether didnt have any rotational or optical isomerism.

[MoonShark]

Yeah this is super annoying me for some reason. I'm going to refund this until they fix it I guess. A lot of elegant solutions are just off the table.

[Dinjoralo]

It would be nice to hear from the devs on this. It would be weird if this game needed the molecules to be exactly like the example output, given Spacechem didn't have such a rule.

[Garick]

I just started on Y-Hydroxybutyric acid and

- I could do much better solves if precursors could be mirrored and not just rotated
- It would be good if the game will accept a mirrored solution

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

If the molecules only exist in 2 dimensions it makes sense, but either solution is correct depending on which side of the plate you are looking through.

Note if precursors could mirror I'd be able to run an interesting alternate solution with Ethylene Glycol as one of the precursor, and probably produce 3 molecules at a time.

The game is still very enjoyable. Normally I'm all for having to work within a box, but this particular point just taunts me in a way that isn't enjoyable.

[Zednaught]

So, if I gather this correctly, the shape has to match the output shape exactly? Right now, I have an early puzzle that has the correct bonds for everything, but some arms turn in a different direction.

[fodder]

saw an article on rps about this game...

chirality matters, but obviously doesn't apply to gbh. kinda curious if this is going to stay 2d or going 3d. or if it'll do events like the wrong stereochemistry killing the consumers

[Igorious]

Originally posted by Garick:

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

The game is right.
Your example is different from example of the topic-stater.
You have two different molecules called enantiomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer). They have different behavior in a general case.

[Garick]

Originally posted by Igorious:

Originally posted by Garick:

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

The game is right.
Your example is different from example of the topic-stater.
You have two different molecules called enantiomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer). They have different behavior in a general case.

So I've learned that there are mirror universe compounds that can do things the exact opposite way (or weirder just do something entirely unrelated) to the 'normalised' counterparts just because they face the other way in a 2D extrapolation. Given the molecules are meant to exist in 3D space its sort of hurting my brain to think that its 2D representation is not only relevant but critically important if you want your medicine to cure a disease instead of kill you.

I'm not sure knowing this is going to change my life, but I guess I'll appreciate that the game is realistic in enforcing this and work around it.

[SteveWinwood]

Yeah I guess I'm just complaining about my benzenes because if you try to make one it's pretty easy to have it go the opposite way, and its actually the same thing (or technically constantly going back and forth between the two). Not really about stereoisomers.

If you want to learn about why chirality is important you should read the tragic story of Thalidomide.

[Blodo]

Originally posted by Garick:

So I've learned that there are mirror universe compounds that can do things the exact opposite way (or weirder just do something entirely unrelated) to the 'normalised' counterparts just because they face the other way in a 2D extrapolation. Given the molecules are meant to exist in 3D space its sort of hurting my brain to think that its 2D representation is not only relevant but critically important if you want your medicine to cure a disease instead of kill you.

I'm not sure knowing this is going to change my life, but I guess I'll appreciate that the game is realistic in enforcing this and work around it.

Rotation is not the same as reflection. It's like comparing your right and left hand, yea if you flip your left hand you can place it across the contours of your right hand but it's still facing upwards while your other hand faces downwards. Another example is a mirror image: you can't rotate a mirror image in 3d space to look exactly the same as the original, you have to mirror it again. This is why enantiomers are a thing.

[fodder]

Originally posted by Igorious:

Originally posted by Garick:

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

The game is right.
Your example is different from example of the topic-stater.
You have two different molecules called enantiomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer). They have different behavior in a general case.

in the 2 cases listed on this thread... the limitation is the game, rather than the chemistry. they are identical compounds even though the game doesn't think they are. (for ghb, if you rotate one of them you'll get the other.. )

thing about thalidomide is that even if they made the correct enantiomer only instead of the racemic mix, the end result would have been the same as they apparently convert to the other form when inside the body anyway.

[Arucard]

Not sure if this was added later, but you can rotate the starting position of precursors as well. In the given (op) image you can simply rotate 180 degrees and be done.

[heysek]

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. IF it not the same, WHERE this "rule"is stated ??

Originally posted by Igorious:

Originally posted by Garick:

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

The game is right.
Your example is different from example of the topic-stater.
You have two different molecules called enantiomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer). They have different behavior in a general case.

[leonoel]

Originally posted by Igorious:

Originally posted by Garick:

This is what I've got right now. The right product is accepted but the left is not
https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/757095817929494729/F7C1AE7B1B24895B90ACE4C7E87128B8610F1ABB/

The game is right.
Your example is different from example of the topic-stater.
You have two different molecules called enantiomers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enantiomer). They have different behavior in a general case.

Thats just wrong, GHB isn't chiral so there are no enantiomers. Additionally the game isn't even able to display chiralty due to the fact that it's two dimensional only, with no additonal information about the third dimension (like wedged/dashed bonds).