Boredspace: Storybreaker, aka delete the story and give us more real content.

[Dead Beef]

This is not a criticism of the quality of the story or any slander on whoever tried to write it, but its a criticism the devs need to be given. Either the time between the last update and release at best has been a total waste of who knows how much time and money or at worst it has degraded the quality of the final game significantly. The problems are -

1. The story has zero impact on the gameplay, the player character, or any mechanical aspect of anything you do. So whats the point? Why should anybody care about any of these characters that only exist as still frame icons and audio when you never interact with them and their existence has zero impact on anything? The story has as much depth as a blurb from a hard drive but so much worse because of the next problem

2. Unskippable cutscenes and dialogue are an unforgivable sin and you all deserve a paddling. Every time that damn intercom icon pops up or theres some dialogue cutscene it forces you to sit there and listen to a story that will never effect anything you do, no capacity to skip it whatsoever. Anytime they pop up the game might as well be telling you to go get a drink or use the restroom because its a much better use of your time than listening to someone talk at you with no capacity to talk back or engage in a dialogue. Speaking of engagement..

3. You have no agency. If you are not interweaving the story and the gameplay in any meaningful way or providing any form of agency to the player over the story than it serves no purpose and should not even exist. The studio has wasted their efforts in putting a story into the game that has no influence over you nor you over it, it serves no purpose other than to interrupt what you are doing and remind you that a ton of manpower was burnt on this instead of more ships and game mechanics.

Maybe the devs will learn from this experience for their next project that if they were not willing to push the brilliant core gameplay idea to their own creative limits than they should have been more transparent to begin with. Or this is the limit of their creativity which would be a bad omen for whatever they choose to do next.

[Datucis]

While I do understand the cut scene's being un-skippable in some spots as an issue. I would state the story for itself is just for a different audience than you. I for one like the story, and it gave me something to look forward to on the game itself.

To the post of the story being of no consequence i would say the same is true of the game play. I started playing and enjoy the game play rather surprisingly when it was first in early access. However, i was only entertained for a bit before it got repetitive. Then the story started taking shape and I had something to look forward to. I even quit playing the game when i finished the second act until yesterday so I could get the full story.

While people don't have to agree on the game play or story being the driving factor. It is there for a broader audience. Not just your personal choices. That's the way i look at it. I would prefer there to be more to the game. For instance, once you get your debt paid off maybe the ability to go into some form of enterprise. I would also like the ability to make adjustments to the story based on personal choices. However, that's not what this type of game is and I am fine with that. All games leave something wanting I feel. Nothing can be Mass Effect of old in story options (not including 3). And there are very few games I know of at all that have 0 story to them. So, i feel this one put a decent balance between the two.

I would state a skip option would be nice, since i play on no revival if i ever die i have to go back through the whole story again. That is annoying for sure.

[zero]

just cause you dislike something doesn't mean it should be removed, you can always not play the story mode.

that said: removing it wont get you more ships, them seeing the game getting sales would encourage additional content, as is standard with most games.

[Doomdrvk]

Originally posted by zero:

just cause you dislike something doesn't mean it should be removed, you can always not play the story mode.

that said: removing it wont get you more ships, them seeing the game getting sales would encourage additional content, as is standard with most games.

So we have to pay more than $35 for additional content to encourage devs which already haven't put out to POSSIBLY add more content? You know RimWorld is the same price and is still getting updated with that price tag with new dlcs and everything else. Oh and the devs actually listen to their playerbase. And don't claim every single thing that could improve the game is "too hard". Hell I'm playing Power Washing Simulator for cheaper and getting a better experience and good devs.

[zero]

Originally posted by Doomdrvk:

Originally posted by zero:

just cause you dislike something doesn't mean it should be removed, you can always not play the story mode.

that said: removing it wont get you more ships, them seeing the game getting sales would encourage additional content, as is standard with most games.

So we have to pay more than $35 for additional content to encourage devs which already haven't put out to POSSIBLY add more content?

i mean yes, that is how you show you want more, "vote with your money" and all that.

not really sure what confused you there but that is literally how companies work, people buy their former products and it makes them realize people want more, so they make more, either through dlc or sequels, in this context.

[Samseng Yik]

There is a trope call
"Play the game, ignore the story"
Such happen to Diablo and countless "great game".
Also, story is not the reason I play this game anyway. And the gameplay is great
I still take a look as a side content.

[Doomdrvk]

Originally posted by zero:

Originally posted by Doomdrvk:

So we have to pay more than $35 for additional content to encourage devs which already haven't put out to POSSIBLY add more content?

i mean yes, that is how you show you want more, "vote with your money" and all that.

not really sure what confused you there but that is literally how companies work, people buy their former products and it makes them realize people want more, so they make more, either through dlc or sequels, in this context.

Not confused, you just don't seem to understand that people aren't going to pay for halfassed development just so they have a chance of getting something good. Its like asking us to repeat early access again and be disappointed again.

[zero]

Originally posted by Doomdrvk:

Originally posted by zero:

i mean yes, that is how you show you want more, "vote with your money" and all that.

not really sure what confused you there but that is literally how companies work, people buy their former products and it makes them realize people want more, so they make more, either through dlc or sequels, in this context.

Not confused, you just don't seem to understand that people aren't going to pay for halfassed development just so they have a chance of getting something good. Its like asking us to repeat early access again and be disappointed again.

people not paying is also part of that process, so yes, i understand.

if you think its not worth it, don't buy, and the product falls flat, simple.

but if you want ship breaking, and hope for more, then i mean, pretty obvious what the method is.

[MechWarden]

From a certain point of view, this criticism could be a complement. The Devs have to make a hard choice on what to put in and by how much, and many of the criticisms could just be nitpicking things because it just doesn't match up with a favorite kind of game feature one likes.

(Going off of the OP message)

1. The story doesn't impact game mechanics: This can be a good thing,since the story could be even more intrusive and actually make things tedious and punishing just like how the lore depict things. Everyone working there (Hal doesn't count as actually working ) is in debt bondage and working in terrible conditions and controlled by very unethical methods. Honestly, I don't want to actually live in that situation. I'll just stick with the ship cutting game mechanics, thanks. Many people here are in it for the fun game mechanics, which are propped up by some fleshed out lore. I honestly find the lore neat, but others don't; and that's fine. Making the story impact the gameplay could both be too much for players to tolerate, and be too much for the devs to create right now.
   
   
2. Unskippable Dialog: This has been talked about for ages, and honestly there is no real good answer to it. Sure, some games allow you to skip it, and many of us are used to that, but if you put so much effort into a story, would you like it if people just outright ignored it? Let alone put in a feature just for that? Maybe in the future the Dev team will allow it, despite really wanting to tell a story. That said, It isn't by far the most terrible case of unskippable scenes. At least you aren't forced to watch a 30 minute thing play out, locking you out of game play the entire time. But I am glad that some of the dialog seems better fleshed out upon release, and the interruptions are usually pretty tolerable for most players. Heck, a restroom break as a reminder likely isn't a bad idea when playing for so long.
   
   
3. No Player Agency: I'd have to say some agency has been put in. Used to in EA there was no say at all when those tutorial scenes would kick in, which often meant clearing whatever job you were doing. That said, many games don't allow for actual narrative agency. Have you played any of the Half Life games? Sure you get to explore a bit, maybe get some interesting failure messages, but the game is entirely on rails and ultimately the story will progress how it will progress, and no one (that I know of) complains about that aspect. Sure they make fun of how Freeman doesn't talk and how everyone tells him everything, but that's just how the trope goes. If you want a complex and interactive storyline (with a playable character that talks) play something like Disco Elysium, or even The Stanley Parable if you want a witty commentary about the illusion of player agency in video games. But I get it, the story does kind of provoke the player a bit to want to do something (though typically to tell someone to shut up or rat people out to LYNX back in EA), but branching story lines just isn't in the cards for this game.

Honestly, the story is OK. It isn't going to win any game of the year awards, but for most it really helps build up some of the why's and how's of the setting; and that's all it has to do, and I think it does it well! The game's main focus isn't about the story (as neat or terrible as people think it is), it is about the neat physics mechanic of taking apart space ships.

Maybe later, when this game is polished enough, the devs might make another game with a more interactive story, since they do seem to love this setting. Until then, let's just be happy that they got this game to vers 1.0, with the prospects of additional content later on.

[scavenger]

Basically, think of the story so far as dark souls, does it affect you in any actual way, no, but does it at least add some lore to the game, yes. It does however REALLY make me wanna just use the cutter on HAL though :D, since people like him do indeed exist.

[Lord Lurk]

Originally posted by MechWarden:

...

1. Unskippable Dialog: This has been talked about for ages, and honestly there is no real good answer to it. Sure, some games allow you to skip it, and many of us are used to that, but if you put so much effort into a story, would you like it if people just outright ignored it? Let alone put in a feature just for that? Maybe in the future the Dev team will allow it, despite really wanting to tell a story. That said, It isn't by far the most terrible case of unskippable scenes. At least you aren't forced to watch a 30 minute thing play out, locking you out of game play the entire time. But I am glad that some of the dialog seems better fleshed out upon release, and the interruptions are usually pretty tolerable for most players. Heck, a restroom break as a reminder likely isn't a bad idea when playing for so long.

...

The fact that so many want to be able to skip the 'story' should be a pretty big indicator that people don't really like it, and are far more interesting in the gameplay loop itself. Devs need to balance what they want from their game with what their paying customers want, cause money makes the world go round...

Originally posted by MechWarden:

Maybe later, when this game is polished enough, the devs might make another game with a more interactive story, since they do seem to love this setting. Until then, let's just be happy that they got this game to vers 1.0, with the prospects of additional content later on.

Hope hard, cause the devs pretty much dropped core gameplay content quite a while back to focus purely on the story...and have stated they don't really have any more plans to add anything major to the game, like more ships, etc. I mean never say never, but all signs point opposite on this one sadly...

[Fly]

(Going off of the OP message)
The story doesn't impact game mechanics: This can be a good thing,since the story could be even more intrusive and actually make things tedious and punishing just like how the lore depict things. Everyone working there (Hal doesn't count as actually working ) is in debt bondage and working in terrible conditions and controlled by very unethical methods. Honestly, I don't want to actually live in that situation. I'll just stick with the ship cutting game mechanics, thanks. Many people here are in it for the fun game mechanics, which are propped up by some fleshed out lore. I honestly find the lore neat, but others don't; and that's fine. Making the story impact the gameplay could both be too much for players to tolerate, and be too much for the devs to create right now.

I like the lore, I would like the story if it was told in a better way, but most of all, a story that is told to you without engaging you is not quite suitable for a computer game. That's something you'll find in a stage play or a movie, both also very well received entertainment products, but different products. A story in a computer game has the unbeatable advantage over the other two that it can actually involve the person watching it, it can be made interactive and it can respond to the decisions and answers given by the player. That needn't be much, a nod to the dialogue decision the player made in the response immediately following their own would already suffice, but the way it is presented here is taking away any and all engagement and agency from the player. Not only can the player not do anything to influence the story whatsoever, not even getting the chance to have a single dialogue line differ based on their input, the story doesn't even involve them. You are spoken to, but your "silent protagonist" self doesn't even get to agree with anything told to them. Essentially, you're audience. Not participant.

Unskippable Dialog: This has been talked about for ages, and honestly there is no real good answer to it. Sure, some games allow you to skip it, and many of us are used to that, but if you put so much effort into a story, would you like it if people just outright ignored it? Let alone put in a feature just for that? Maybe in the future the Dev team will allow it, despite really wanting to tell a story. That said, It isn't by far the most terrible case of unskippable scenes. At least you aren't forced to watch a 30 minute thing play out, locking you out of game play the entire time. But I am glad that some of the dialog seems better fleshed out upon release, and the interruptions are usually pretty tolerable for most players. Heck, a restroom break as a reminder likely isn't a bad idea when playing for so long.

There is a word of wisdom for everyone who ever wants to write a story, and anyone who actually plans to should google that phrase: Kill your darlings. Every writer has them. A trope, an idea, a motif, a ploy, a character. Something they think is so awesome that everyone MUST love it. You worked long and hard to make them work out, you redid your story 10 times to finally find out how to fit them together, then you realize that it's essentially superfluous. Not necessary for the plot. Not relevant. Maybe even distracting.

It's easily said and a sound advice, but it's terribly, terribly hard to do. Still, in the end, what matters is not you, the writer but them, your audience. That's what you write for. If you write for yourself, what you get is Mary Sue Fanfic. Nobody wants to read that. By the way, if you want to know where the term Mary Sue comes from, google that phrase "A trekkie's tale". This is the reason why you kill your darlings. You want people to read your story. And people don't do that unless they want to, you can't force the donkey to drink.

No Player Agency: I'd have to say some agency has been put in. Used to in EA there was no say at all when those tutorial scenes would kick in, which often meant clearing whatever job you were doing. That said, many games don't allow for actual narrative agency. Have you played any of the Half Life games? Sure you get to explore a bit, maybe get some interesting failure messages, but the game is entirely on rails and ultimately the story will progress how it will progress, and no one (that I know of) complains about that aspect. Sure they make fun of how Freeman doesn't talk and how everyone tells him everything, but that's just how the trope goes. If you want a complex and interactive storyline (with a playable character that talks) play something like Disco Elysium, or even The Stanley Parable if you want a witty commentary about the illusion of player agency in video games. But I get it, the story does kind of provoke the player a bit to want to do something (though typically to tell someone to shut up or rat people out to LYNX back in EA), but branching story lines just isn't in the cards for this game.

"Silent protagonists" are a trope of computer games and hardly something anyone complained about here. The thing here is, though, that the story runs parallel to the game but doesn't interact with it. There is exactly one moment of interaction when Hal takes away the ship you're building and given the nature of that interaction, it's something players who already know it's gonna happen will likely try to avoid it (and stall the story in the process, too). I don't know a single game where the story was well received where it doesn't even involve the game you're playing. You quote Half Life as an example of a silent protagonist, which is true, but in Half Life the cutscenes and story elements (as far as I remember them at least, it's been a decade) do blend into the gameplay. They actually affect the place you're in and are necessary to keep the game rolling, so to speak. Yes, it's on rails, but at least it feels like the story is actually interacting with you. This isn't exactly a feeling I get in this game.

Honestly, the story is OK. It isn't going to win any game of the year awards, but for most it really helps build up some of the why's and how's of the setting; and that's all it has to do, and I think it does it well! The game's main focus isn't about the story (as neat or terrible as people think it is), it is about the neat physics mechanic of taking apart space ships.

Erh... no. Yes, the story itself is ok and fits the world, but the writing is clunky and the characters are unbelievable and cardboard cutout stereotypes. Maybe it's asking too much from a computer game to have believable and interesting characters, but why the hell does it work in JRPGs and why do they have to have a gameplay I can't suffer? I guess I can only have either good storytelling or a game I want to play. :(

Maybe later, when this game is polished enough, the devs might make another game with a more interactive story, since they do seem to love this setting. Until then, let's just be happy that they got this game to vers 1.0, with the prospects of additional content later on.

If they get someone else to write the characters and story, that may well work out. The base idea is fine, it's just the execution that's crap.

[Bainrow Kicks]

Calling it a cutscene when they could've easily had the dialog/podcast playing while we're cutting. Or choosing ships. Or upgrading equipment. Or reading emails.

[Insubordination]

What's the deal with point n click adventures man? They all got stories. I don't want a story I want to rub items together to progress to the next screen.

[doubleo_maestro]

Fine by me for the story to stay in the game. But cutscenes should be skippable. It is a mark of shame on the developers for not putting this in. It is barely effort to put that feature in, and games only ever lack this feature when the dev's want to force their narrative on the players.

[ProfessorAnthrax]

Great post, i came here to post this same thing.

The story is a waste of time. Uncompelling and not even any choices for the player to choose to alter a possible ending.

i just want to skip past it all. especially that dumb chick that won't shut up, and her stupid gay fantasies. They want to complain about forming a union but it's in their contracts that they can't. STORY OVER. STFU and let me break ships.