What will Tours do for $30?

[rijde]

Disappointing the DLC should be adding depth to the combat, economy, or empire. Tours looks another joke of a DLC. Sims 4 offered more depth of content for $30 than these jokes of popups of events.

[VipreRX]

"What will Tours do for $30?"

Offset the cost of continuing development and the free updates that come with that development.

One of the biggest complaints levied against DLC of the past was it was practically a mandatory purchase because access to so much content was locked in it.

People cried they didn't WANT to be forced to buy DLC just to avoid having a "busted game" so critical content was moved from DLC to the free patches, but that doesn't make creating any of the content cheaper. or add more hours to a day for the creation of even more content, and now the complainers are crying there's not ENOUGH content in the DLC because more of it is provided in the free patch.

Personally I say to everyone, "Make up your GD minds."
You want DLC that in your heads justifies the price, fine, the free patch content goes back in the DLC and if you want to play the "real" game you have to buy it no complaints.
All everyone gets free from now on is bug fixes.

I have absolutely no envy at all toward present day game devs. No matter what you do someone is going to drag you for it.

[JC]

Originally posted by rijde:

Disappointing the DLC should be adding depth to the combat, economy, or empire. Tours looks another joke of a DLC. Sims 4 offered more depth of content for $30 than these jokes of popups of events.

Basic tours are part of the Free update, same with the Regency aspect.

There will be a lot more depth on Hunts and Tournaments and other aspects of the Paid side, Read the diaries. If that doesn't sound worth it, by all means just get the free update, with tours included.


A clip from the dev diary about tours,

Since Travel inevitably touches nearly every aspect of the game, I figured I’d spend some time here at the end attempting to answer a few questions that are sure to arise.The focus for this expansion has been to create a Travel System that will specifically work for getting characters to and from Activities. With that said, we’ve endeavored to make this system as flexible as possible for future work and iterations–which is why it’s a free feature.

The Travel Mechanic has also been integrated into smaller activities such as Meet Peers, Grand Blot, and Grand Rite. We are currently working on integrating the mechanic into more game systems. Some Schemes are still completable while you or your Target is traveling.

[Ashling]

Originally posted by rijde:

adding depth to the combat

They're reworking how knights are handled with training and specialization. Knights are like 50% of the combat in this game.

Also, they're reworking MaA to be more inline with how it was in CK2 (not a full replica, but slimmed down a bit).

Originally posted by rijde:

depth to the economy

They're adding caravans and caravan masters. They might not be trade-focused right now with the update, but it's pretty clearly foundational stuff for some things that might be pretty big,

Originally posted by rijde:

depth to the empire

They've talked about an Empire DLC before and wanting to make each empire feel unique and special. I'm pretty sure they'll make that its own DLC rather than squishing it together with tournaments.

[lazarusblack]

Thing is, I couldn't care less about tours or hunts. I would have appreciated some depth being added to the core gameplay loops. Not bells and whistles added to the distractions one is meant to do, in ones down time.

I'd like them to flesh out the various and sundry cultures, nations and empires to help differentiate regional and kingdom/empire specific gameplay. I'd have liked them to add some more challenge to gameplay and not by nerfing the speed at which you can do things with artificially contrived "speed bumps" that actually rob you of the fun of the game in exchange for additional busywork and frustration, but with actual challenge from competent AI and mechanics that the AI can actually understand and use in a meaningful way.

Instead we keep getting "fluff" Sugary flavoured padding that is meant to appeal to the superficial aspects of our imaginations but lacking any real depth or complexity to the actual core gameplay.

And I'm 110% in favour of bundling updates into DLC. I have always hated the "free" patch mechanic updates as they have often been used as a means of implementing only half of the intended changes in the free patch while paywalling the functional aspects behind the DLC. It's scummy business practice and it's always confused me that so many people defend it and think it a GOOD thing.

Northern Lords had the right idea, if somewhat narrow in focus. Iberia was good on paper, unfortunately the implementation was poor and the dumb as bricks AI can't handle it properly. Royal Court? What a joke. And this? Buildings revamp? New map assets for buildings? pfft. More frilly but ultimately vacuous busywork to try to distract us from the empty and shallow core gameplay? Yeah, sounds about right.

[chebonaparte]

35 euros for chapter 2 dlcs on sale now... lol

I think I'd rather buy a whole new game!

[Rialm]

Then wait for next year. The price of the bundle is really cheap, obviously as long as they deliver. Chapter 1 let say they took them a lot of time. But I imagine that this time they already planned everything, and more importantly the expansion is just around the corner.

[JC]

Originally posted by chebonaparte:

35 euros for chapter 2 dlcs on sale now... lol

I think I'd rather buy a whole new game!

Over half the games i have bought i didn't play more than a few hours, though i will say some are because i have yet to even get to them because i'm busy playing games i LOVE! I have way more money spent on buying new games that i didn't like, than money spent on DLC on games i do and going by my average cost, i'd probably end up with 5 games for 35 bucks, Not 1, though the Divinity bundle 1&2 on sale for 22 bucks still temps me.


If i love a game it's pretty much always been worth it, If i don't i never spend another dime on it. It's a pretty simple concept. Sounds like you don't love it, so you know what you should do.

[YuMMz]

Originally posted by lazarusblack:

Thing is, I couldn't care less about tours or hunts. I would have appreciated some depth being added to the core gameplay loops. Not bells and whistles added to the distractions one is meant to do, in ones down time.

Counterpoint, I DO care about tours and hunts. I look forward to the regency aspect of longer tours. I think fleshing out hunts and feasts with intrigue options is a great addition. I don't know how you read the last few dev diaries and think the upcoming update and DLC is vacuous busywork.

[stun]

Originally posted by VipreRX:

Offset the cost of continuing development and the free updates that come with that development.

The five cents you'd have to pay someone to bump this out in a night?
People are mad that they were sold a game that doesn't work and doesn't have anything in it that specifically fails it's development promises. CK3 is infinitely less modable than CK2, and that was part of the day0 marketing. Don't try to push that onto something to do with the dlc model.

[Razorblade]

Originally posted by stun:

CK3 is infinitely less modable than CK2, and that was part of the day0 marketing.

Calling ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on this one. The EK devs are doing things with CK3 that they never could with the CK2 version of the mod, and they're about the most prolific CK modders out there. How do you figure that CK3 is less moddable?

[Athmet]

Originally posted by stun:

CK3 is infinitely less modable than CK2, and that was part of the day0 marketing

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2949767945

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2922050163

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2926309668

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lKgF1cRJ1RY

https://www.reddit.com/r/CK3AGOT/comments/11ubf6u/ck3agot_what_to_expect/

I mean... those are total conversion mods but there are so many out there. But sure, infinitely less modable ...

[stun]

Originally posted by Razorblade:

Calling ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ on this one. The EK devs are doing things with CK3 that they never could with the CK2 version of the mod

lolwut
Gonna call a ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ source on this one. Name one thing you can do in CK3 that can't be done in CK2.

Originally posted by Razorblade:

and they're about the most prolific CK modders out there. How do you figure that CK3 is less moddable?

They're the most prolific CK modders (N.B. their mod is literally just a map replacement) because nobody wants to touch CK3 modding with a ten foot pole. It is not a significant mod, it's basically vanilla CK3 on a different map with some contextless letter_events.

Originally posted by Razorblade:

How do you figure that CK3 is less moddable?

Because it is? Do you have any idea what you're talking about?
Everything is hardcoded, everything that isn't hardcoded can't be accessed in a convenient way and you need to set up laborious hacks with variable assignation to deal with them.
Immortal maldives spends like 40 lines on an implementation of something that takes 1 in CK2 (and is optional since surrounding systems actually work the way you would hope they do instead of e.g. AI using age instead of immortal_age for marriage fertility calculation) and I would consider immortal maldives best practice for the most part.
Call me when CK3 doesn't CRASH TO DESKTOP if a woman is listed as a father while simultaneously requiring you to script a (resource intensive for some reason because polling characters rapes your PC in CK3 for some reason) check-for-women-with-the-trait on_action event (which will also have downtime where it doesn't check for characters generated in certain ways in time, for instance) to replace one trait with another if you want to have a trait that has different versions for men and women.

[-sb- zveroboy]

I saw the Chapter 2 bundle for £30 and briefly considered it, but I only play the game to update my mod, so I just can't justify the price. I wish I could get into CK3 :(

[khalasar]

[JC]

How did talking about tours turn into a let's complain about modding thread? At least make your own thread if you want to discuss what can be better on that end.

Originally posted by stun:

Originally posted by VipreRX:

Offset the cost of continuing development and the free updates that come with that development.

The five cents you'd have to pay someone to bump this out in a night?
People are mad that they were sold a game that doesn't work and doesn't have anything in it that specifically fails it's development promises. CK3 is infinitely less modable than CK2, and that was part of the day0 marketing. Don't try to push that onto something to do with the dlc model.

I don't know what they said about modding, but i do know they said they were going to lean much more into the family dynasty, RP and sandbox side of things. It was the main reason why i bought CKIII, and no longer play II, i can't get past everyone looking the same.