Learning legendary mods, is this normal?

[AnonymousGamer79]

So I have played about 2 months and probably 800 hours or so, I didn't check Steam but it is quite a bit. Most of that time has been merely chasing legendary mobs, holiday mobs, doing events for item drops, farming the pails/packs, etc. I've done some quests lately but mainly it has just been obtaining legendary items and scrapping them in hopes of being able to make equipment to play with and make my character better. I've scrapped several thousand items I've obtained this way, as well as turned in thousands in scrip to Murmrgh for items to scrap. I mistakenly bought 5000 scrip worth of vault steel as well but thats another story.

For the Tier 1 legendaries, there are 35. I have unlocked 20 of them. I won't go into the other tiers but it's pretty much what you would expect, less of tier 2 and very few of tier 3.
My question is if this extremely bad grind is normal? Do the managers of this game feel this is a positive way to attract and retain new players who will spend cash in their shop? This is an inordinate amount of time invested for very little result and in fact no result as I cannot really make any quality weapons or armor. I can't imagine that a truly casual player ever has any hopes of crafting items.

It's also noteworthy and I have been nooticing that the Mods I do not possess are the few that are "desirable" as far as the game mechanics and current meta. Here are the Tier 1 legendaries I have not yet been granted: Aristocrats, Bloodied, Bolstering, Chameleon, Instigating, Life-Saving, Medics, Mutant Slayers, Overeaters, Quad, Stalkers, Two Shot, Unyielding, Vampires, Weightless. Just about every Tier 1 legendary that matters is on that list, ones that I have not been "lucky" enough to unlock. While I have received a number of mod boxes, again they are not of the proper type nor numerous enough for crafting.

So is this normal? Am I having "bad luck"? I've read many stories online of "legacy" players having a much easier time with this aspect of the game and I'm curious about what is going on.

[Phantom]

1% chance to learn
1.5% chance to get a loose mod

800 hours in 2 months is an absurd play time... like 13.3 hours a day

[AnonymousGamer79]

Originally posted by Phantom:

1% chance to learn
1.5% chance to get a loose mod

800 hours in 2 months is an absurd play time... like 13.3 hours a day

I just checked Steam and it says 827 hours. It IS an absurd amount of time, I feel they have erred somehow and it should be more around 600 hours, but it is still a lot of time. Spooky scorched started around the time I started playing. Anyway, how would one expect a new CASUAL player to the game to function under such a regime? The chances are insufferably light, and as you learn the grind gets worse as you have fewer and fewer possible unlocks to make. I do find it almost malicious as well that I "happened" to unlock almost exclusively worthless or undesirable legendaries. The game literally throws items at you, and yet almost every day you will scrap every one of them and get absolutely nothing aside from a few scrip for dozens of items. It feels like a humiliation ritual instead of a game.

[lockwoodx]

It's pure RNG. I learned like 10 recipes in the first hundred scraps. 300+ more scraps later and nothing.

[lockwoodx]

Originally posted by AnonymousGamer79:

I just checked Steam and it says 827 hours. It IS an absurd amount of time, I feel they have erred somehow and it should be more around 600 hours, but it is still a lot of time.

A bunch of time is wasted looking at menus and loading. Besides destiny 2, this game is one of the worst offenders. Makes their numbers look good "look at how high our engagement is!" but it sucks for us.

[intlgunmonkey]

Originally posted by AnonymousGamer79:

…The game literally throws items at you…

I think that part is the fundamental answer to your question. After the first few levels, you’re never really at a want for gear… even GOOD gear. Perfect gear, or rather the ability to make perfect gear, at will, on the other hand, is meant to be a (very) long term pursuit.

If a player were to start fresh, and never craft a single item, Legendary or otherwise, they’d be able to function well through all the content we’ve seen so far, just with pick-up/award gear. If the crafting system didn’t exist, we’d all probably spend more time adjusting our build and trying new ones to suit random pieces of good gear we find in the world… and it might be more fun.


I don’t know how many hours I have in, but I’m somewhere around lv 790. Without “grinding”, beyond my initial stash-up to scrap the first day of the new Legendary system, I know a lot of the Legendary plans.

Not counting the new 4-stars, the only “desirable” effect plans I don’t know are:
(Weapons) Quad
(Armor) Overeaters, Intelligence, and Ammo Weight Reduction.

Interestingly, I’ve found/bought enough mod boxes of all of those that I can still generally build whatever I want, even without being able to make those boxes yet myself.

[NIkto Barada]

20 is more than me.

[Mooman]

That's all part of the hook and carrot trick. The longer you play, the less 'lucky' you become.

I can only offer anecdotal advice but in my experience my characters have had their best 'luck' early in their creation. My oldest characters, timewise, are far less lucky with new additions.

This theory has only been further cemented in my mind after creating my fifth character recently. That character is in their low 100s but has acquired so many rare plans and event drops already it can't be a coincidence. I noticed a similar pattern when playing my fourth, now not so lucky.

Knowing a bit about gambling psychology it makes sense (though evil) from a companies perspective. A few wins early on hook gamblers for bigger losses later, cement in that sunk cost fallacy. A player (character due to how the 'saves' work) that has many hours is more likely to continue and tolerate disappointment.

Using the OP as an example, they had some early wins but put in a lot of time in a short period. They are now in that 'sucker' phase where the game will string them along because that is what the algorithm says to do.

Online gaming is just gambling without government restrictions after all...

[beagle]

Welcome to the club. It's a stupid system. Should be based on skill and earned, not luck. Some players get very lucky with little effort, others bust theur bums and don't get squat.

[DocBravo]

I know I've scrapped at least 150 with Quad and Medic's between 2 characters and only box mods and a few of each at that.

[AnonymousGamer79]

Originally posted by Mooman:

That's all part of the hook and carrot trick. The longer you play, the less 'lucky' you become.

Knowing a bit about gambling psychology it makes sense (though evil) from a companies perspective. A few wins early on hook gamblers for bigger losses later, cement in that sunk cost fallacy. A player (character due to how the 'saves' work) that has many hours is more likely to continue and tolerate disappointment.

Using the OP as an example, they had some early wins but put in a lot of time in a short period. They are now in that 'sucker' phase where the game will string them along because that is what the algorithm says to do.

I'm not quite as much of a sucker as you would have me to be. I did make the mistake of shelling out for the yearly sub because I got the bundle of all of the series for almost nothing. I do understand people, and corporations, need to make money. I've certainly lost more in time wasted than in money spent. Let it be a cautionary tale to anyone who is looking to take up this game and may be reading. While you have absolutely zero leverage over this corporation, you have even less if you aren't on a month to month plan. And Steam of course, is an unindicted co-conspirator in this matter; they will happily sell you ♥♥♥♥ on a platter and call it prime rib.

As far as being "hooked" on the game, rest assured I have already decided to never do business with Beth again. That's it, done, finished, jokes on me. There will be no cash purchases from the Atom shop. I still do play because, well I've paid for it, and there are things I enjoy about the game. A legion of bugs and absolutely mind boggling goofy ♥♥♥♥; I just did the Steel Reign line and had to walk backwards through the tunnels to attempt to hear Shin and Rahmani's convo because of the idiot design of having to face the audio source to hear it no matter your proximity. Meanwhile, leveled super mutants are eating me up. But yea, some of the events are real gems and a lot of fun. It is a pity to look at the game and see that at one point someone cared and the potential that largely went unrealized.

In closing though, back to the legendary issue. I really feel like Beth has an unrelenting hate for it's customers, and I know that is psychotic; but it really starts to feel personal when you run around all day and "work" at a game for a goal and you get zilch out of salvaging a few dozen 3 stars and all the associated lesser items. Safecrackers box anyone? I mean you can't even sell them to get caps to go buy 40k boxes from player vendor gangsters.

[いか]

I dunno man it just basically dropped as an outside system years after the game launched.
Maybe I'm just the schill here but really.... It's nice we can even learn em.

Everybody remember what they'd do with their stack of legendaries after the reached cap?

Yeah Donation box. Now I can at the least get something out of em.
You have tilted hours condensed man.

I'd be getting grumpy too. But yeah atleast we can salvage a chance and those are legendary mods dude. Like the things that make a weapon worth using.

[Phantom]

Old system was
32+ years for an armour set
12.5+ years for a single weapon
Assuming a minumum 4+ hours a day playing non stop


With 4 stars it would have been
7.8 generations for an armour set
2.2 generators for a single weapon

Yes we had to change the timescale to your life + the life of your children and their children
And not like you play then your kid takes over
You play, your kid helps, your grandchildren help, your great grandchildren etc eventually you die and your distant future descendants get the items

The old system was garbge

The new one is infinitely better

1% isn't terrible when you realize its 1% per star too

So a 3* is 3 independent chances at 1% plan AND 3 independent chances for a 1.5% loose mod

[beagle]

Whatever. Game is still in death throes. got a lot of angry players between the Gleaming Depths and the new legendary system. Doesn't work for way too many players.

[intlgunmonkey]

Originally posted by beagle:

Whatever. Game is still in death throes. got a lot of angry players between the Gleaming Depths and the new legendary system. Doesn't work for way too many players.

Sure, there probably are a bunch of “angry players” who are butthurt that they can’t just join a team and AFK through the Gleaming Depths raid and claim all the rewards the new system has to offer in a few hours of watching their mouse-wiggler.

Likewise, there’s TONS of math-challenged folks, like yourself, that don’t realize that the new legendary system takes a tiny fraction of the amount of time to get the gear that you want compared to the old system. What can I say? They’ve offered remedial classes and Special Ed programs since my grandparents were kids. You lowest-common-denominators clearly aren’t being bred out of the species fast enough.

As far as it dying; I mean, Season 2 of the TV show is in production, and the trend line for the user base has shown a steady incline. I’ll pretend to cry and play along, so you don’t have to feel alone in your butthurt, if that’ll make you feel better, but that’s the best I can offer. FO76 is pretty strong, even for all its flaws.

[shadow49]

compared to how it used to be, it's extremely easy to get whatever roll you want now. You didn't used to get legendary mods or recipes.