why are the gauntlets so painful to use

[Non-Lethal Gamer]

Ive tried all aspects at at least second level with titan blood at heat 2 and I already regret even gracing these foul excuses for a waste of space with titan blood. i used the right builds, tried doom, poison, crit, lightning, and i can barely go through heat 2 without god mode on.

what the hell is with these things and why do they suck so ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ much? I've watched videos on how people play with them and theorycraft builds with dio boons and i even got consecutive hit upgrades with daed hammers. what even are the point of these things when i have to max them out to have them be usable? I'd rather use an unupgraded eris exagryph. on any other weapon i've done up to at least 8 heat and the rest on 10 save for the bow which I avoid, that one's on 5 or so. I get to hades on 3 with fists and lose all my death defies to him every time on every run. on some runs I make it, on others he just kills me on 20% hp of his last hp bar.

I've tried dash attack spam, dash upper spam, special spam(not demeter), hammer enchanted movesets, dash combos. the only thing ive yet to test out with the fists is the final gilgamesh aspect.

I have no clue what I'm doing wrong with people hyping this pair of hand mounted ♥♥♥♥ to be the best weapon in game. do I have to actually max them out or is poison/doom/crit on everything i have and an occasional duo boon slapped on top not enough for a heat 3 run


[2/10/2020]

okay I've come back and read some of these.

apparently, a lot of people assumed the problem was that I had problems with Hades. which isnt the point of my inquiry, since I've basically done significantly better at higher heat on literally every other weapon.

I have come to the conclusion that using the guantlets on keyboard is trash.

although i still despise the playstyle, I have maxed out gilgamesh aspect and taken it up to heat 5. I understand the playstyle better now and using a controller with this specific weapon streamlines its gameplay, as it was designed around being played on controller as the game recommends.

Im sure this weapon fills the niche that alot of controller users build their playstyle around, but as a person who played 200 hours of hades since the time when the bone hydra was the "final boss" I prefer sticking to keyboard. I now fully understand its usage and capabilities, but I stand by the fact that this simply isnt for me. I'm not going to relearn the whole game on controller just to reliably go through the game with at least all 4 extreme measures active.

this isnt elitism, its just the approach I'm choosing to take towards finishing my save.

[GeminiEclipse]

For Hades specifically he has a timing between his attacks. If you're getting hit then you're committing too long to being aggressive or just dashing the wrong way to avoid getting hit.

You wont avoid every hit, but you can avoid the big swings at the very least.

[Fuligin]

The default binds of Q (Special) and RMB (Cast) are hot garbage, but even more so on fists due to how you’re expected to chain variations of Attack-Special or Dash-Special while your fingers are on WASD + Space. If you’re using the default binds, do yourself a favour and swap them. Might just be what you need.

[kekkuli]

Only thing that seems to work for me with the fists is the magnetic cutter thingy (can't remember the aspect name) just spamming special attack mainly.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Clear case of user-error; Fists are amazing.

[begulinggg]

If you are having trouble surviving with fist, I suggest you take Athena dash as soon as you get out of your chamber. IMO, the thing with fist is you should always focus on your dash-attack timing. Land 2-3 blows on enemies while anticipating their next movement and then dash when they are about to attack you.
As for builds, you can try one of these:
- Zeus on attack + his other second tier boons will melt anything fast
- Merciful End. I strongly recommend this. Put Ares on attack and make sure you add impending doom. Get Athena on special. With Athena on dash and special, you can rack tons of doom immediately before enemies could react.

[Evente]

You can kill Hades easy with Demeter's cast + Cast inflicts chill no matter what the weapon. It's almost easy mode for Hades, as with max chill he is slow enough so you have time to plop the beams when he starts his own beam attack. Then just hide and watch his health go down, and repeat. With full chill you can easily attack him too and get out of the way of his attacks in time.

There are other ways to make Hades really easy too (charm call that recharges fast enough). These two are from just 20 runs so there must be tons of builds to make Hades really easy. I did a 16 heat run with gauntlets and Hades was one of the easier encounters.

So if you can make it to Hades with the fists, Hades himself should not be a problem.

[Jean-Luc]

I finished a run in thirteen minutes using the gauntlets at 5 heat. I don't have the aspect maxed, but I personally love Demeter's aspect (though I've also had success with the Aspect of Talos) and Demeter's boons. If you have trouble getting away from Hades' attacks, try and get the extra dash(es) from Hermes' boons as well as Athena's cast and dash for the extra protection.

And don't rush damage, play safe. The encounter can take as long as you want, so long as you don't turn up the heat with the limited time debuff. First time I finished a run with my bow, the Hades fight took 15 minutes.

Good luck!

Edit: If you aren't getting the boons you want, always pick the HP+

[Washing Machine]

Bow and gun are more safe to use so you probably don't get hit quite as much and find it easier to get damage in. Melee weapons want you to play more aggro and dash in and stay in, so it's a bit more confusing to get the hang of it.

If you look at the speedrun leaderboards, Fist is the most popular weapon. You just have way less downtime attacking stuff.

[Heron]

Might be a keyboard vs controller thing. With a controller you can spam attack dashes at an incredible pace quite easily. I'm playing with controller and love the fists. With Athena boons the fists turn Zagreus into an unhittable whirlstorm of pure damage. Zeus and Aphrodite work fine as well.

On the other hand, the gun doesn't work at all for me because I can't quickly aim with the special with my controller.

[Fuligin]

From experience, the game is very clear about telling you that your build is about to fail at the following points:

1. Elysium bosses
2. Styx

Elysium bosses are what I've come to think of as a utility check, because you have to deal with one enemy in melee range and one enemy in spear range with a shield at the same time, and if you don't have enough DoT/CC/move speed/attack speed/damage mitigation in your boons, you will be punished for it. If you didn't meet the bare minimum of two debuffs for Privileged Status, you're in for a bad time.

Styx is just one massive DPS check for 4-6 antechambers and boils down to "can I kill these ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ rats and their satyr groupies in a very small space before they spew their green goo all over me".

This is doubly true for fists since you neither have the range nor special utility to help you close the distance. You didn't mention deflect in your post even once so I'll take it you've never considered it? Give it a shot, you need something to close distance and the iframes that deflect on Attack or Dash afford you are the difference between beating Hades and dying on your last DD.

[Silentstorm]

Clearly, you dont know how to use them... I have done my fastest run with the fist

[Howru]

Gloves with Aspect of Talos + Daedalus +2% ho on Special kill + all +% damage on cast + Demetra chill on cast = easy game.
Bonus points if you got Athena deflect on Special )

Just spam your Special, drag all enemies to you to die and get health back.
Hades with 10 stacks of Chill is moving like a zombie while you reflect his skulls back at him..

[HunterXCooL]

I once think fist is also the weakest weapon in the game... but I usually try to make something works everytime I play a game and fist is absolutely not the weakest lol... As a matter of fact it's one of my fun and strongest weapon now
The problem with fist in the beginning is it's ability to dish out single target damage and that's where call comes in... You need to get call that's very strong against single target like poseidon artemis and maybe athena
Later if you got the other aspect then fist becomes another beast entirely but the problem for dishing out single target still exist but mitigated

[BlueDragonXD]

I have ONLY really used the fists. I use the aspect that gives you a 5x Special Attack damage hit after 12 charges. It's my favorite weapon so far but to be fair I have not really tried any of the other weapons besides like 1 escape attempt each basically.

I can get to HEAT LEVEL 11 with Fists so far and that does not mean I cannot pass HEAT LEVEL 11 that's just the level I am currently on. So I don't think that is any right to brag or definitivaly say FISTS are good. I'm still far from being finished. But I was able to beat extreme measure level 4 using these fists. And no I have never touched god mode.

[Safavi]

Literally only use the gauntlets. Just spam dash and attack, your thumb can hit both at the same time and just aim with the joystick. It will tire your thumbs but the DPS is worth it.