The school we never got

[Mesond]

I consider the college map the worst mission in the entire game. There's a number of reasons for this.

Home made bombs. Short timers. Few suspects. Just basically rushing through the map. It's dull, it's boring, it doesn't get me thinking.

Compare this to the hospital map. Sure, it's a harder map, but that's why it's a good map. There's bombs but the timers are more resonable. The suspects are dangerious and that presents a challenge, yet it can be countered. The environment has more of a horror vibe to it as well with the red flashing lights. This is a much better map with bombs.

So why do we get a half baked college map instead of the school that the devs wanted to put in? Because steam and epic games went "Boo hoo, that's too much". it's the same reason we don't see the baby in that boss fight in Dark Souls 3. Frankly, stupid people are trying to coddle the gamers instead of letting the gamers decide for themselves what they want.

So if steam and epic games won't play ball then what's a solution to this problem? DING! have your own website where there's a mod to download the school map. Even none devs could mod it in. This works around steam and epic games. They can't blame the base game then. People already put mods on the game so a map made by the devs themselves makes sense.

But if you back down and cave in to "compromise" (which, be honest, is giving up in this case) then how much can it matter? If you want something in the game that badly then find a way. Otherwise it doesn't matter enough. The devs wanted something different. The players do. So why not stick to the plan and go through with it by working around the problem where steam and epic games is concerend with a download for it from a website that doesn't involve them?

[🆂🆈🅽🅿🅰🆃🅷🆈]

Dude...the fact that there a suspects is already a huge WTF....

Most people unalive themselves when they do that stuff the second the cops show up

[MP]

This game is clearly not made for people like you .
Go find another hobby.

[Tyrant (My Vision is Augmented)]

Originally posted by 🆂🆈🅽🅿🅰🆃🅷🆈:

Dude...the fact that there a suspects is already a huge WTF....

Most people unalive themselves when they do that stuff the second the cops show up

This is technically true, and brings up an interesting point.

We keep asking for the game to be "more realistic" - from AI to maps to scenarios and NPC behavior. But it's worth remembering, for about 90% of the missions in the game, the situation would likely be resolved before SWAT ever made entry, or SWAT's role would be standing by while a negotiator did what they do best. And the remaining 10% of the missions would likely fall to the feds, or be handled by the first officers on scene - not SWAT. The fact we are playing these missions at all is already fairly unrealistic.

Of all the missions in the game, the only one that feels remotely true-to-life is Ends of the Earth, and I don't see it being anyone's stand-out or favorite (though it is one of mine).

The game was always trying to be an episode of True Detective, not a true crime procedural. I think we need to meet it half-way in that regard with our requests. The AI needs fixing. The weapons need tweaking. Some levels could absolutely use fewer suspects, my lord. Missing animations, missing voice lines, missing models, and a host of other bugs absolutely need to be addressed. Friendly AI needs work in almost every regard. The list goes on.

But they aren't going to completely re-tool 18 (mostly-awesome-looking, very thematic, highly-atmospheric, tactically challenging) maps to make them more real (read: boring). And I don't think they should.

[Gonzo850]

It's a game. It's a fun level imo. I like the part where you rant about mods. I support that. Make the levels you want to play. Show the devs how it's done.

[krzychuzokecia]

Originally posted by Veldaz:

Compare this to the hospital map. Sure, it's a harder map, but that's why it's a good map.

Uh, no. Hospital is harder map, but it isn't a good map. In fact it's yet another "5 SWAT vs sixty hundred terrorists" level, with a thousand rooms laid out in a way that makes SWAT AI rush without cover to far ends where they get blasted (the dreaded overextending). I'd say it's prime example of failed level design philosophy that RoN has, which can be summarized in a one word: "MOAR".

College, with it's four suspects and action confined to a single building, is a breeze, and makes sense from tactical point of view too since you're not going against an army of baddies. The bombs are lazy part of design, that's true, but that's because you would never get "S" rank if active shooters were... actively shooting civilians. Note however that Relapse (hospital) suffers from the same problem - terrorists are not hunting down remaining civvies.

Bombs in both levels thus are added to make player act fast (which should happen in a real active shooter scenario), without punishing him by having perps kill every hostage (making player unable to get a good score or even pass the level). The problem is that in hospital the bombs are placed in easily reachable places so you just don't really feel the need to rush, while you're fighting Al Queda's best in the caves of Tora Bora. And in college map the bombs (due to being placed in random, and sometimes hidden places) are slowing you down - neutralizing perps can be done in 5 minutes or less. You could remove the bomb threat from both maps and it wouldn't affect hospital at all, while college would end quicker.

Originally posted by Tyrant (My Vision is Augmented):

Of all the missions in the game, the only one that feels remotely true-to-life is Ends of the Earth, and I don't see it being anyone's stand-out or favorite (though it is one of mine).

I love that map (for both it's lore/story and how it's a proper SWAT mission) and a number of guys I play with also hold it in high regard. Heck, some of the smaller mod maps are also favorites in our rotation, because we don't feel the dread of "playing Arma without vehicle support" lol.

Thinking about this now, I came to realize that it's exactly what RoN feels like - Arma or Squad but you're alone, don't get big guns and you have to take enemies alive. Instead of being an original experience it plays out like many other games, but with handicaps. I'd say it's almost like 6 Days in Fallujah, with the difference that in 6 Days you get AAVP support, and you can kill the enemies. They even behave quite similiarly, with that lack of regard for their own life (except that Fallujah insurgents ain't so aimbot'ty).

[LCpl Nubcake]

Originally posted by Tyrant (My Vision is Augmented):

Of all the missions in the game, the only one that feels remotely true-to-life is Ends of the Earth, and I don't see it being anyone's stand-out or favorite (though it is one of mine).

Dunno about that. I see a lot of people mentioning Ends of the Earth as a very stand-out mission or it affecting them in some way, I think it's a sleeper hit.

But back to the topic, I expected the school map to be a little bigger. I know it's a college campus with separate buildings and such but the scaling seems a bit off, like they chopped half the building off. They should double the size of the building or have multiple buildings to search in. I also think that there should be at most 2 active shooters, like the situation with Columbine, four shooters seems like overkill in such a small space. Have at most 2 bombs with longer timers, the current map can have up to 3 which I also think is overkill.

Presentation of the situation could be better, there's no real sense of urgency. Have NPC police establish a cordon with NPC bystanders looking on. Have more students and staff fleeing the exits, that can also provide the player a clue as to the direction of the active shooters.

It does not have to be tactical challenge, just a narrative driven mission like Ends of the Earth, though you can make it more challenging with the hostage-taking mechanic.

[Mesond]

Originally posted by MP:

This game is clearly not made for people like you .
Go find another hobby.

Did you not read the topic? The devs themselves intended to have a SCHOOL map. Not a college map. The reason we don't have a school map is because of steam and epic games taking issue with it.

The game was very much intended for "people like me". And others that wanted the school map when the devs intended to add it in.

Consider the graves in SWAT 4 in that one spooky house mission. Did it make people feel disgust and anger and fear? Yes. GOOD! That's the POINT of games, films and art. To make people FEEL something. For better and worse alike.

[grant]

I don't think it's that big of a deal but understand what you are saying. Why don't you mod one together then?

[CloudPiercer]

Honestly, you should be grateful we have any educational active shooter map/mission. With all the flak they've been getting, they could've left one out entirely. I do feel the school map should be bigger though, especially if it's a college.

[Prussian Wolf]

I a mix of smaller and longer maps. I like varied objectives, like Campus has with bombs and suspects who will kill if you take too long.

The biggest criticism I have of it, is really one of the game at large, which is that it barely gives you any usable info about damage, etc... Does anyone who plays the level the first time, or even the 10th time, realize that the suspects there have the best armor in the game? It's the kind of thing you have to look out spreadsheets about. Which is silly.

[FatalErection]

the map doesent even appear for me and im doing the beta, i know im late but did they remove it?

[𝒞𝒶𝓈𝓊𝒶𝓁 Sinner]

Locked cause necro

It is in the game towards the end of the map list. If it is not visible, you have not unlocked it or need to replay the mission prior to it. You can find the map order online.