Margaret Boss battle on NG+ - Why does using the Omnipotent Orb cause her to spam 9999 damage Megidolaon

[MasTa]

Hi,
Sorry for this noob question, but this is my first ever Persona game.
So I just finished a Persona 4 Golden New Game + run and I did beat Margaret, however I required 3 tries to do so, as in the first 2 tries Margaret spammed Megidoloan with her Oberon that always did 9999 damage no matter what, and I always ended up losing in the end because Rise and Endure won't last forever for obvious reasons. I did check on the Internet why, and apparently it is because I equipped Yukiko with the Omnipotent Orb, which makes the character equipped with it immune to all types of attacks except Almighty.I did found strange that, during my 1st try when Rise revived me, she stopped spamming that and instead was attacking me with a regular attack and apparently that was because Yukiko was dead at that time, as after I revived Yukiko Margaret started spamming 9999 Megidoloan again.

I would understand Margaret's AI's logic of spamming Almighty if 1 party member is immune to everything except it, however Margaret had another Persona with Megidoloan that wasn't Oberon (it was Ardha I think), and even after a Mind Charge that Megidoloan only did like 200 damage, so why did she not spam that instead? That Oberon's Megidoloan that did fixed 9999 damage shouldn't be restricted to every 50 turns, and can only be blocked by Rise or endure? I ask this because, after the 1st try, I thought the fight was bugged, but then I saw on the Internet that no character can have the Omnipotent Orb or even full immunity to everything except almighty (apparently the player can't even have a Persona with full Null/Drain/Repel everything).

Basically I am curious about why does bringing full immunity to the Margaret fight will make the fight basically impossible to beat, as I was really upset I couldn't use the Omnipotent Orb as I had spent hours grinding the reaper for the absolute best equipment for every character I used.

[nico_zip]

They want it to be a challenge and the omnipotent orb make it a tutorial battle. Beating your velvet room asisstant is the ultime challenge in any persona game. So it would be boring if you do it in that way

[KuroLionheart]

Because its supposed to be a challenging fight and that's the developer's way of telling you "fight for real".

Besides, you can just make a Persona that's immune to everything and the fight becomes trivial.

[John Johnson]

To make it a challenge, you can't just cheese it. You can still make a persona which drain / nulls everything except dark / light, though.

[Cheezystix]

Margaret knows your trying to cheese her so she punishes you for it

[1337Walrus]

Publicado originalmente por John Johnson:

To make it a challenge, you can't just cheese it. You can still make a persona which drain / nulls everything except dark / light, though.

It's still comically easy to fuse a Helel that nulls/drains everything including dark/light, same with Yoshitsune.

[Terra]

Publicado originalmente por 1337Walrus:

Publicado originalmente por John Johnson:

To make it a challenge, you can't just cheese it. You can still make a persona which drain / nulls everything except dark / light, though.

It's still comically easy to fuse a Helel that nulls/drains everything including dark/light, same with Yoshitsune.

Yeah, but it requires *slightly* more thought and preperation to fuse that than to throw on a lucky drop.

...that said, it also requires slightly less thought to program it so that if you have a specific accessory equipped, it casts the enrage spell than to keep a running tally of your immunities and have it activate once they hit a threshold.

[CPT Chthonbeard the Pirate]

Publicado originalmente por Terra:

Publicado originalmente por 1337Walrus:

It's still comically easy to fuse a Helel that nulls/drains everything including dark/light, same with Yoshitsune.

Yeah, but it requires *slightly* more thought and preperation to fuse that than to throw on a lucky drop.

...that said, it also requires slightly less thought to program it so that if you have a specific accessory equipped, it casts the enrage spell than to keep a running tally of your immunities and have it activate once they hit a threshold.

Um... wasn't Margaret all about "fuse this for me"? Why would she complain that you used fusion to overcome her instead of said lucky drop? I'd think that would be completely in character with her.

[KuroLionheart]

Fusions are allowed because one, you actually have to put some thought into it and the core gameplay of the game is fusing Personas and using your results to fight. Limiting that would be a nonsensical design choice at the very end of the game. Two, because having a Persona that's immune to everything has actual downsides. You often give up 3-5 skills slots to achieve a fully immune Persona. Yoshi for example has 4 elements you need to cover to be fully immune, plus you're more than likely going to want some support skills leaving you with not much in the way of attack diversity. My Yoshi literally only has Hassou Tobi, meaning if the target is immune to physical he is completely stonewalled. At that point you're going to want some other Personas to cover his downsides and more often than not, they're not going to be super immune to everything Personas like your main guy is which leaves you a little vulnerable. Three, because your Persona only covers the main character.

Meanwhile the accessory is farmable, and can be used by every single party member. You give up your accessory slot, but that's barely a downside considering most of the accessories aren't even close to as useful. Plus it kind of diminishes the value of your party's social links, because one of the main reasons to go for max social link is to get the Evade Element skill for each member of your team. If you don't have that skill then Margaret is going to completely run through your whole party in a few turns.

Of course there's always fighting her solo, but that has its own disadvantages and makes the fight a lot longer. Basically, the accessory has no downside and breaks the game so its not allowed.

[Douchebag Extraordinaire]

People talking like the Orb is some super easy item to get. It's a very low chance and you either have to farm Reapers (who are formidable themselves) at Yukiko's, which means spending a ♥♥♥♥ ton of time getting nothing when it doesn't pop up, or constantly farming 21+ chests constantly. Breaking the game with Yoshi or any of the super tank Personas is easier.

But yes, it is to prevent cheaping her out with an accessory. They technically should have done the same for any Persona that has more than two null/drain skills, so the fight would force the player to have an actual team of Personas to fight her, instead of making one that pretty much ♥♥♥♥♥ on her countermeasure.

[MasTa]

Thank you guys for your answers :D.
I see, using the Omnipotent Orb is basically considered cheap for the developers of the game, and they punish the player for it. But still, I spent around 15 hours farming The Reaper in Yukiko's Castle trying to get the absolute best equipment for every character I used and to get the Omnipotent Orb, and not being able to use the Orb left me kinda of upset.

Outside of that, I did essentially beat Margaret on my first try without the Omnipotent Orb on Hard, she seems to love to use the signature moves of certain Personas like Loki to target the weaknesses of the player's party members to get 1 Mores, so the player has to rely on the Evade Spells from max Social Links in order to avoid her getting them. Overall, the battle against Margaret is definitely Hard, but definitely not too overwhelming, it just takes a while to beat ( I did waste 2 Somas on her fight thought). Chie's Dragon Hustle and Naoto's Shield of Justice helped me a lot in this battle. I definitely think that beating The Reaper early game (by the time of Yukiko's Castle) is much harder than beating Margaret.

[1337Walrus]

Margaret wasn't built around Third Awakenings. Having Naoto's Shield of Justice to completely stonewall her for a turn and Chie using her SP pool that she otherwise has no use for to cast Heat Riser on everyone makes things much, much simpler.

I think the 'intent' is to do it solo like Elizabeth forces you to in P3.