Level 12 cap?

[T-Dax]

Love the game, but I'm near the end of the campaign and found out about the level 12 cap, which feels like a kick in the junk. Are there more campaigns or expansions that let you get to level 20?

[Aluvian Darkstar]

Check nexusmods community expansion has level 20 option if you want it, along with additional feats, spells, fully customisable

[Grumpy Old Dude]

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

[tm0Lif3]

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Love the game, but I'm near the end of the campaign and found out about the level 12 cap, which feels like a kick in the junk. Are there more campaigns or expansions that let you get to level 20?

level 20 i would say the problem would be no appropriate content. based on latest news from TA there would be new warlock, bard and monk classes. i hope for DLC that add new campaign and increase the level cap.

i'm playing community expansion mainly for the multi-class. it's alot of fun. swiftblade/hoodlum and paladin/barb definitely my favorite by far.

for latest DLC my only issue is that even at late game it has very low weapon/armor/item recipe. in crown of the magister, prime items are a problem but TA make it that in Lost Valley recipe is the problem. not sure if any monster i can farm for book recipes though.

[T-Dax]

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

[LJ-the-brave]

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Don't think they gave up. They just need the resources. If you checked the latest survey they threw for us, it asks what priority to give in raising the level past 12. Also, it is a ton of work to add content past level 12 as users need higher level spells, upcast old spells with higher level, new weapons, new armor, new monsters, new animations for high level spells and the list goes on... With enough support from us they can do it.

[Dallas S]

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Then Baldur's Gate 1 was also incomplete cus it only went to level 8.

[jeffreybatchelor]

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Have you looked at crafting of items? That is how I ended up getting most of my magical armor or if you are playing in the original campaign than ensuring you have high enough rep with the factions as some of them have magical armor (dwarven plate is +2).

And you can craft some nice weapons that might only be +1 but also have secondary effect like frostburn does an extra +1d6 cold damage I think.

[Grumpy Old Dude]

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

If you are near the end, and the lvl 12 cap is not a hindrance; explain, in detail, the issue WITH the cap?

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Where do you get the notion that every DnD game must by definition, go to lvl 20? Have you ever looked into published modules FOR DnD? lvl 1-4, lvl 5-7, lvl 7-9.....NO PLACE exists, where the devs said the lvl cap went past 12. In fact, originally, the game was set to be and was, capped at lvl 10.

[T-Dax]

Originally posted by Grumpy Old Dude:

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Where do you get the notion that every DnD game must by definition, go to lvl 20? Have you ever looked into published modules FOR DnD? lvl 1-4, lvl 5-7, lvl 7-9.....NO PLACE exists, where the devs said the lvl cap went past 12. In fact, originally, the game was set to be and was, capped at lvl 10.

Just an assumption, am I not free to be disappointed by a game? It's frustrating that there's 2 expansions with additional class features, but the game is capped at level 12. If I were the devs I would focus on the campaign and level cap before adding new features.

Originally posted by Psychotron69666:

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Then Baldur's Gate 1 was also incomplete cus it only went to level 8.

Yes, but at least Baldurs Gate put more effort into the campaign and story. The story and especially the dialogue in Solasta are pretty bad.

[T-Dax]

Originally posted by jeffreybatchelor:

Originally posted by JustinCredible:

Honestly it feels like an incomplete game. Since it's based on D&D rules I just assumed level 20 would be the cap, and I'd get to play with level 9 spells. I didn't get nearly as much cool loot as I would expect for a level 12 party either. I still have characters wearing non-magical armor, and my best weapon is a +2 staff. If feels like they just gave up half way through.

Have you looked at crafting of items? That is how I ended up getting most of my magical armor or if you are playing in the original campaign than ensuring you have high enough rep with the factions as some of them have magical armor (dwarven plate is +2).

And you can craft some nice weapons that might only be +1 but also have secondary effect like frostburn does an extra +1d6 cold damage I think.

Sadly I sold a most of the primed items I found because I didn't know what they were for, and now I can't find anymore.

[Nephtem]

I think your expectations are misled by some previous DnD based games you played; this is not an accusation, I was in a similar situation at least. My knowledge was limited to those video games, so level 20 sounded like a normal thing.
However, after talking with a friend playing tabletop and looking it up on google, the overwhelming majority of tabletop campaigns are low level. It was a few % only of players/campaigns going to 20. So level 20 is a huge anomaly rather the norm in DnD, which kind of makes sense because level 20 is on the realm of superhuman, fighting gods, demons and things like that.

For magic items, this is also in fact a result of following DnD ruleset. In 5th edition, the design is to go with a lot less of the looter gameplay/magic equipements on every slots. Which is where the attunement system also comes in. As well as many other changes to limit powercreep and min/maxing; You can look up "bounded accuracy" on google if that topic interest you.
I agree I'd like to see more fun toys but it's not a simple discussion. If the will is to get as close as possible to the tabletop, then Solasta is in the right way. Now of course, this is a video game so it is possible to go for a more arcade-ish system with more exciting loots but it's not necessarily the vision of the devs and some people may also enjoy it more the current way.

[T-Dax]

Originally posted by Nephtem:

I think your expectations are misled by some previous DnD based games you played; this is not an accusation, I was in a similar situation at least. My knowledge was limited to those video games, so level 20 sounded like a normal thing.
However, after talking with a friend playing tabletop and looking it up on google, the overwhelming majority of tabletop campaigns are low level. It was a few % only of players/campaigns going to 20. So level 20 is a huge anomaly rather the norm in DnD, which kind of makes sense because level 20 is on the realm of superhuman, fighting gods, demons and things like that.

For magic items, this is also in fact a result of following DnD ruleset. In 5th edition, the design is to go with a lot less of the looter gameplay/magic equipements on every slots. Which is where the attunement system also comes in. As well as many other changes to limit powercreep and min/maxing; You can look up "bounded accuracy" on google if that topic interest you.
I agree I'd like to see more fun toys but it's not a simple discussion. If the will is to get as close as possible to the tabletop, then Solasta is in the right way. Now of course, this is a video game so it is possible to go for a more arcade-ish system with more exciting loots but it's not necessarily the vision of the devs and some people may also enjoy it more the current way.

Yeah, for sure I went into it with certain expectations. I've played tabletop D&D a ton, and I get that almost no campaign ever spans all 20 levels, but the option is there at least, and you can always start at a high level if you want to do a high level campaign. I don't think it makes a whole lot of sense to compare tabletop to video games though. The reason why tabletop campaigns rarely level all the way up is almost always a problem with your group breaking up, which obviously isn't an issue for a video game.

I haven't played 5E, but are there no interesting weapon modifiers, like keen, or flaming, holy, etc? So far the only weapon enchantments I've found are just +1 or +2. There's a few cool magic items, but the weapons and armor seem super bland.

[Soteria]

I haven't played 5E, but are there no interesting weapon modifiers, like keen, or flaming, holy, etc? So far the only weapon enchantments I've found are just +1 or +2. There's a few cool magic items, but the weapons and armor seem super bland.

There are a few others, mostly adding elemental damage. Staff of Metis gives +2 to int checks and a 1/day cast. There's a mace that has an extra die of damage, and the doomblade greatsword has an on-hit effect, but yes, in general, the enchanted weapons are less remarkable than some other games. I think the armor and rings are more interesting in general than the weapons.

Personally I'm kinda fine with that. Some games have too much power creep coming from gear, and it can really affect class balance.

[T-Dax]

Huh, sounds like 5E just isn't my jam.

[Nephtem]

I agree that in video games, we can afford long sessions and won't rely on scheduling with other people, so you can go to level 20. However, my thinking was more along the lines of: if most of DnD players only play at low level, the more efforts and content are likely to be dedicated to low level. In that sense, doing a low level campaign like solasta is probably easier to start off, there are probably more source material, general experience/knowledge and options for low level.
For instance, the list of enemies available in the SRD is quite low for high CR/lvl, compared to the diversity at low level (there are more enemies for CR 0 or CR1 than CR 15 to 20 combined for instance, only 17 or so enemies for CR 15 to 20 in SRD). Solasta can and has done homebrew ones, but initially they had to cut on the number of classes too so, yeah there was also the limited budget factor to account for I suppose.

Well this is more of a guess than a fact. In any case we had a survey too, and they look like they have more freedom to add new type of contents. We may be seeing a high level campaign next based on the poll results.

As for magic weapon, I believe keen no longer exists in 5e, probably because critical threat range/crit confirm are also no more. It is bland but on purpose, so that players don't have to rely on getting some powerful items, or make builds centered around them. That's my understanding of the bounded accuracy, less min-max and power fantasy.