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討論區規矩與守則
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Champion is one that needed a lot more ability wise as far as subclasses. The increased criticals don't make up for the enormous amount of things the other subclasses abilities provide.
Spellswords are good, but again, do not compete with a Paladin able to cast Fireball at 8th level.
Perhaps the real bonus that would help the Fighter subjobs are bonus feats at a certain level. The majority of the Fighting feats of Solasta are pretty incredible. That would go a long ways to helping them.
The Fighter with higher crit range is probably the best of them, especially if you're always attacking with Advantage, which you should be to make the most of it. But for reasons you mentioned, they still generally pale in comparison to Pallies.
Also only needs strength and constitution or dexterity and constitution to be good, Paladin also needs charisma which of course is less of a problem if you can't keep rerolling stats.
I mean, I did my first playthrough with a high elf paladin, a race with zero relevant ability points for that.
But there's two things currently holding the fighter back which makes them a very viable class in Pen and Paper:
-Lack of good feats.
Getting more feats than anyone else is a big benefit of the fighter, and lets you customise them in many ways making them a very versatile class.
As it is, there are few feats in the game. No mage slayer, sentinel, pole arm master, crossbow expert, alert, mage apprentice and other feats that could really boost them.
-No variant human.
This is more something that we really need to make humans a worthwhile choice because that extra ability point is meaningless when you can keep rerolling stats.
But either way, getting a feat here + more feats later only increases the fighter's potential further.
The fighter is a fine class to have in the game and probably was the easiest for them to add so I would not be quick to say they should have done something else. You wouldn't have gotten another class for that, at most maybe two extra subclasses for the other five classes in the game. I'd rather have the fighter then.
Better feats is all they need to get fixed. I know they can't use most of the official ones, but that does not mean they can make up their own stuff and could even add things that are especially great for the fighter or exclusive to them.
Like getting an additional action surge as a feat. Two action surges that you only need a short rest to get back would already make a big difference. They could link it to picking an additional fighting style.
I seriously feel fighters should get more fighting styles than a paladin regardless of chosen subclass.
fighter get his stuff back in short rest paladins don't. extra stats = better hit change or feat, and ability that are consistance and don't need rest to get but. ez crits, or better shove.
the spell blade is different because he is even more of a thank then the mountaineer.
On Cataclysm, you'll probably just be using Pass Without Trace ranged stealth attacking with the whole group to conserve resources whenever you can. Fighters and Pallies are on equal footing here, as you don't want to short rest when concentrating 1 hour or less spells if you can help it.
Then for the one fight per rest where you're actually spending all your resources, Pallies will generally outperform Fighters.
And on fights where you keep one party member away from the rest and closer to enemies while using Pass Without Trace, if that's between Fighter and Paladin... you're probably better off with a Paladin with the Shield spell and possible emergency healing. (You know, so that enemies only discover one of your party members instead of all 4 and the remaining 3 can still attack with Advantage every turn).
The problem is once the paladin runs out of smites, spells, channeling and lay on hands, he is the Fighter. Not an inferior Fighter, just the Fighter. We can have this conversation with the Ranger instead of the Paladin and it's the same thing. Fighters are just entirely useless in this game and 5e.
You don't need to spend all spell slots in one battle. I generally only smite if I get a crit (which also increases the smite damage significantly) and the best tanking ability in the game right now is the shield spell. So if you don't waste your lvl1 slots your pally is a better tank with a 2 handed weapon (as it can cast spells while using a 2 hander).
I say paladin is better than a fighter in almost all roles (and yes even better than spellblade fighters because oath of the motherland simply makes you a mage casting fireballs).
But the better role would be tanking. Because your mage, ranger/rogue is mostly the nuker in cataclysm difficulty. Just max out intelligence, pop greater invisibility and activate arcane fury. Then use scorching ray, magic missile, fire ball, fire wall, ice cone etc whatever you have in your arsenal to nuke even bosses down within 2-3 turns.
None of the classes in the game have comparable damage to a shock arcanist at the moment. They just make cataclysm a piece of cake.
This setting also makes human race bonusses useless...
So I always use the 27 points purchase system which is fair. I think the devs should disable characters created with dice rolled attributes in catacylsm difficulty. Or they can add an ironman difficulty (with achievements) disabling the dice rolled attributes (and maybe keeping only 1 save with seeded/deterministic dice).
I've opened this post considering a pally and a fighter created using the 27 point system anyway.
Currently you can easily get a 16 str, 14 const, 16 cha pally with a human or a half elf. There are no +2 str giving races in the game so attribute wise the best fighter you can get will be a dwarf having 16 str, 17 const and perhaps some wisdom for saves. But the difference will be minimal compared to a pally attribute wise.
of course you are gonna do it on the fighter.
1. Paladins need multiple attributes - Doesn't apply is you roll for high stats. If you use point buy then this comes into play.
2. Limited Spells slots - Weather it's divine smite or casting spells this is a significant limiting factor. - In this game you know what the encounters are and the tough enemies and can pretty much long rest whenever you want so it's a non issue for Paladin's in this game.
2. Fighter Subclasses add a lot of power to the Fighter class - eliminated because the subclasses in game are not very good.
3. Fighters get 2 extra bonus abilites score/feats - basically pointless if you don't use point buy and the feats are weak.
4. Fighter main feature is extra attacks which don't come in to play until level 11 and then 20 - not included in the game.
The only good feature is Action Surge but by itself its not enough. So yes the fighter is weaker than the paladin but it's not totally useless.
You can have both Protector and Champion (fighting style and subclass). My dwarf fighter has both, and does quite a bit of damage. Of course I do have a Paladin as well in my party for 2-handed smite-ness.