Sinnerman is the worst side quest in any game I have ever played in my entire life

[yolomancer]

The writing is unbelievably stupid, why in the world would I get in the car?

The gameplay just getting there is even worse though. It's completely scripted to make it as frustrating as possible, every light is red and the same cars JUST SO HAPPEN to be always turning and getting in the way one after the other just to make it even more frustrating.

The NCPD car doesn't obey the laws of physics and doesn't slow down, it is obviously on some BS unfair invisible track that is pulling it where it needs to go rather than actually driving like I have to, you can easily see this when it rams into trucks and doesn't even slow down and takes 45 degree turns going 70mph while my car spins out like soap on glass going 20mpg.

Then you get 40 meters away and the car is force stopped and I'm told I failed?

Then you finally get to it and you try to kill the guy (the thing you were hired to do) and it puts you into this BS scripted nonsensical interaction where you're supposed to let the client die and get in the car with the murderer instead? WHAT? How in the world does that make any sense at all?

None of this is related to a bad game engine, all of this is just extremely poor game design. And then the car itself and the cop are giving totally ridiculously inflated stats to stop V from being able to kill them in a reasonable way, and even if you do you instantly get 4 stars and the entire police force descends on you to stop you from killing the murderer.

The game would literally be better if this entire bad quest line was flat our removed. This is the WORST sidequest I have ever experienced in all my years in gaming. Nothing about it is redeemable. The game itself is made worse for it's presence. Absolutely horrendous.

[IL'dar]

Sinnerman is everything wrong with "AAA design" in Cyberpunk and in general.

So, before 2.0, you remember how disgusting the sinnerman "quest" was - railroad you into watching whatever the trash that was, despite the car chase segment. And after 2.0 it's even worse, now we have car combat and car hacking, but no, NO, you are not allowed to do it, because the devs want to show you something. Almost like if you want to show something to the player you should construct your quest in a different manner...
And this is the biggest problem of CP77, not the bugs, but this, why contradict your own game? Why have mechanics we cant use? Why railroad the player? Why so little world interactivity?
This is just bad taste plain and simple. I really, really do not mean to offend people, both players and developers, but if you inronically think that so called "AAA" and "cinematic" gameplay is good, you are wrong, just stating the facts.
I'm sorry Pawel, but "AAA" games are not the way, good desing is.

[Coldhands]

Originally posted by IL'dar:

I'm sorry Pawel, but "AAA" games are not the way, good desing is.

Yeah, can't have enough of that good good desing. : p

[envirovore]

It took you until Sinnerman to figure out you're playing a heavily controlled pace, story based driven game?

/Is of the opinion that Sinnerman is a fantastic quest.

[IL'dar]

Originally posted by envirovore:

It took you until Sinnerman to figure out you're playing a heavily controlled pace, story based driven game?

/Is of the opinion that Sinnerman is a fantastic quest.

No, but this is just a good example of it. CDPR is a Schrodinger's studio, yes, you have the ideas but at the same time gotta have the "appeal" or consumers will not consume.
Witcher 2 was experimental, cute in a weird way, with a horrible console ui and balance issues, but still lovely. You know what people say - "most "cult classic" games have some jank in them". On the other hand Witcher 3 was safe but plagued with "AAA" problems, and they lost something on the way to it, but people loved it. Lost even more in Cyberpenk and people still love.
Will lose even more in the next game, you just watch.
AAA is the bane of modern gaming.

[Zebedee]

It's fun you chose the mission which asks questions about a player's willingness to keep clicking 'yes' in dialogue options. (And you say you saw something you didn't like so you must have clicked on 'yes' a few times.)

To be a bit more constructive, I think CDPR are always going to go heavy on cinematic stuff which is, by necessity, going to be fairly railroaded. Expansion is more interesting in not feeling obliged to allow the player to see all the things just by clicking 'yes' every time.

[Korppi]

Out of all the missions you took sinnerman as your car combat argument?

Dude, that mission isnt even about car combat... and i guess you didnt listen to the briefing at all either, the npc youre helping literally wants to personally see you execute the target... or kill the target himself, if his dialogue is to be listened.

Blowing up a car is hardly good enough for someone wanting to see such a thing in person.

Also theres a big twist to the mission if you dont shoot...

[Bogmore]

To do that mission you have to do something that is only mentioned on the internet and nowhere ingame. It's the only mission in the game I truly hate.

And the car scripting, is dire.

[IL'dar]

Originally posted by Korppi:

Out of all the missions you took sinnerman as your car combat argument?

Dude, that mission isnt even about car combat... and i guess you didnt listen to the briefing at all either, the npc youre helping literally wants to personally see you execute the target... or kill the target himself, if his dialogue is to be listened.

Blowing up a car is hardly good enough for someone wanting to see such a thing in person.

Also theres a big twist to the mission if you dont shoot...

What. WHAT? The npc that wants to personally see you execute the target cannot witness you execute the target because he is scripted to die...

[Rabidnid]

Sinnerman is a very good quest that could only be written by a bunch of catholics and ex catholics.

I liked it a lot but now I just shoot him because I'm not going through that every playthrough.

[IL'dar]

Originally posted by Zebedee:

It's fun you chose the mission which asks questions about a player's willingness to keep clicking 'yes' in dialogue options. (And you say you saw something you didn't like so you must have clicked on 'yes' a few times.)

To be a bit more constructive, I think CDPR are always going to go heavy on cinematic stuff which is, by necessity, going to be fairly railroaded. Expansion is more interesting in not feeling obliged to allow the player to see all the things just by clicking 'yes' every time.

What's wrong with clicking yes in the dialog options? If you want to give player a hit mission do it, if you want "deep, philosophical blah blah blah" do it. Question is - why railroad the player into it?
If they want us to nail a guy to the cross, or his bollocks to Red Square fine, but maybe don't start it with a scripted chase and combat scene?

[Zylo the Wolfbane]

Honestly, I would have less of a problem with it if the game just let me gun down Vasquez when he pulls iron on you. Instead he's pseudo-immortal and will always kill the guy who hired you. But yes, the actual car chase bit is annoying, mostly cuz the truck you're stuck in is garbage.

[Peter B]

Someone at CDPR thought it funny to mess with the players I guess. And I agree. It's a bad quest.

[Mjr.Death]

Lol every vehicle in the game you’re a passenger of or supposed to follow in the game is on rails. Gets real fun when a car manages to get in front of the train where it isn’t supposed to be. But yeah, sinnerman is particularly bad.

[kripcision]

the worst part of the mission is after you get to the first house. lol. i would have left but it fails the mission if you do.

[Nooneyouknow]

Originally posted by Zylo the Wolfbane:

Honestly, I would have less of a problem with it if the game just let me gun down Vasquez when he pulls iron on you. Instead he's pseudo-immortal and will always kill the guy who hired you. But yes, the actual car chase bit is annoying, mostly cuz the truck you're stuck in is garbage.

You can absolutely drop him using a sandevistan before he kills Jablonsky.