Stealth is dead as a netrunner. Please nerf tracing.

[xyrkies]

Listen, I'm not here to argue with people about how you "should" play the game. The style I like to play is a stealth netrunner who never enters active combat, and thanks to this ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ tracing system, that is impossible. Who or what is even tracing me? I've knocked out everyone in sight.

As a netrunner, shouldn't I have the ability to track where the trace is coming from? Shouldn't I have the ability to stop it?
What was the point of deleting this play style?

[Mad Max]

Sonic Shock Tier 3.

/thread

[kripcision]

its not that bad. you just have to be quick to get everyone in the area before your traced or use memory wipe before you do a combat hack. but the all around best for stealth with low ram usages is sonic shock, you will just have to finish them off yourself with a gun or sneak up behind them then grab them.

[kripcision]

Originally posted by xyrkies:

As a netrunner, shouldn't I have the ability to track where the trace is coming from? Shouldn't I have the ability to stop it?
What was the point of deleting this play style?

well you can at least trace back to someone hacking you to counterhack them with a specific perk.

[the Literal Worst]

Originally posted by Seamus:

I dunno, I did my initial leveling for my 2.0 character with an int/cool build for hacking and throwing knives. So I have done early game hacking in 2.0.

It really isn't as bad as people are trying to make it out to be.

oh totally ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ agree, im tech int and i love it so much. i think hacking is great. for the most part i even agree with you

i just get wanting to play stealth and this game not facilitating it well in most ways. personally id rather have much less ram and be forced to get within a shorter range but be able to stealth hack and kill rather than how it is now, now its just wait till higher level then its dirt easy like in 1.0 (hell a silenced pistol is a meme since you have to kill in one shot)

[Hex: Onii-Chan]

Originally posted by kripcision:

its not that bad. you just have to be quick to get everyone in the area before your traced or use memory wipe before you do a combat hack. but the all around best for stealth with low ram usages is sonic shock, you will just have to finish them off yourself with a gun or sneak up behind them then grab them.

"You will just have to do non-netrunner things to play a netrunner" - I don't want to touch the opponent at all. I want to play a damn netrunner - sit on the other side of the street and sip a cup of tea while everyone falls over and has no clue what happened. That's what netrunners do.

Gonna have to wait for a mod, I guess, or just outgear the "balancing"

At this point I'm happy they didn't try to make Shadowrun. Would've had to do a triple-salto and send in 7 written forms to summon a spirit that disappears after 10 seconds.

[kripcision]

Originally posted by Hex: Onii-Chan:

Originally posted by kripcision:

its not that bad. you just have to be quick to get everyone in the area before your traced or use memory wipe before you do a combat hack. but the all around best for stealth with low ram usages is sonic shock, you will just have to finish them off yourself with a gun or sneak up behind them then grab them.

"You will just have to do non-netrunner things to play a netrunner" - I don't want to touch the opponent at all. I want to play a damn netrunner - sit on the other side of the street and sip a cup of tea while everyone falls over and has no clue what happened. That's what netrunners do.

Gonna have to wait for a mod, I guess, or just outgear the "balancing"

did you ignore the rest of my comment? you use memory wipe on the enemy then do a combat hack and your in the clear, NO TRACE.

[Hex: Onii-Chan]

Originally posted by kripcision:

Originally posted by Hex: Onii-Chan:

"You will just have to do non-netrunner things to play a netrunner" - I don't want to touch the opponent at all. I want to play a damn netrunner - sit on the other side of the street and sip a cup of tea while everyone falls over and has no clue what happened. That's what netrunners do.

Gonna have to wait for a mod, I guess, or just outgear the "balancing"

did you ignore the rest of my comment? you use memory wipe on the enemy then do a combat hack and your in the clear, NO TRACE.

So all you have to do is to use up all your RAM and voila, one opponent half-down! Yeah, great.

[oak]

Originally posted by Seamus:

Originally posted by the literal worst:

and i can be stealth killing much earlier outside hacking, or melee brawling, or pretty much any other style.

i think the disconnect comes in you are looking at the end state rather than how the player gets there. stealth in this game feels more like a chore to me at this point though, so who am i to judge lmao

I dunno, I did my initial leveling for my 2.0 character with an int/cool build for hacking and throwing knives. So I have done early game hacking in 2.0.

It really isn't as bad as people are trying to make it out to be.

Look, some people want full netrunner with no ballistic or martial arts.
You don't seem to be hearing them though and just accusing them of being ignorant.
They want something that isn't practical until later in the game. Not your fault. Not theirs either.

CDPR rejigged the game, much like someone would an MMO, around End Game.
Perks were reordered to aim towards high level end game builds.
Enemies scale now, to accommodate the fact that the perks support end game.
Clothing is virtually redundant, because...they want you to play into the crafting system that really unlocks full potential...towards end game.

Love it or hate it, that's a snip of the rebalancing they did for 2.0.
Within that though, some builds play nicer on the way to high level, others (stealth netrunner) do not.

Like the OP said in the beginning they're "not here to argue with people about how you 'should' play the game. The style I like to play is a stealth netrunner who never enters active combat".

So step back, take a breath, and read what the OP, and others chiming in, are saying.
They want full stealth, full netrunner. Not "stealth and then explosions" or "stealth and knives". The style of play they had for 3 years is now heavily gated by an aggressive (and quite possibly buggy) tracing mechanic, removal of perks and mechanics that existed pre 2.0 and a full tear down rebuild of the perks tree.

[the Literal Worst]

Originally posted by kripcision:

its not that bad. you just have to be quick to get everyone in the area before your traced or use memory wipe before you do a combat hack. but the all around best for stealth with low ram usages is sonic shock, you will just have to finish them off yourself with a gun or sneak up behind them then grab them.

if you are finishing with a gun, why not just use the gun to start. i think thats the crux of the issue, many people dont feel like a netrunner at that point. i think this is just a "mod in your experience" moment though

[Hex: Onii-Chan]

Originally posted by the literal worst:

Originally posted by kripcision:

its not that bad. you just have to be quick to get everyone in the area before your traced or use memory wipe before you do a combat hack. but the all around best for stealth with low ram usages is sonic shock, you will just have to finish them off yourself with a gun or sneak up behind them then grab them.

if you are finishing with a gun, why not just use the gun to start. i think thats the crux of the issue, many people dont feel like a netrunner at that point. i think this is just a "mod in your experience" moment though

Exactly. You only need one bullet with Overture anyway. May as well just save yourself the 20 attribute points and one-tap everything with no effort.

[the Literal Worst]

yeah i get you, i do remember 1.0 hacking being way to OP, but maybe they could do something to at least make it possible early game (the amount of ram you get just feels like 1.0 hacking was pushed to mid late game and its kinda silly)

edit
id rather it be challenging all the way through and possible early than playing 1/3 of the game different then stomping everything

[Hex: Onii-Chan]

Originally posted by Seamus:

yap

Again, go troll somewhere else.

[oak]

Originally posted by Seamus:

Originally posted by oak:

They want full stealth, full netrunner. Not "stealth and then explosions" or "stealth and knives". The style of play they had for 3 years is now heavily gated by an aggressive (and quite possibly buggy) tracing mechanic, removal of perks and mechanics that existed pre 2.0 and a full tear down rebuild of the perks tree.

And you can still do it.

It just takes slightly more effort to get off the ground.

It's still hilariously strong.

Start over. Level 1. Put your throwing knife away.
Report back in on how long it takes you, and how much the "slightly more" effort equates to, to get to a point where tracing doesn't ruin your full stealth full netrunner experience.

We'll wait.

Doable, sure. I think you'll find "slightly more effort" is very much subjective.

[Hex: Onii-Chan]

Originally posted by the literal worst:

yeah i get you, i do remember 1.0 hacking being way to OP, but maybe they could do something to at least make it possible early game (the amount of ram you get just feels like 1.0 hacking was pushed to mid late game and its kinda silly)

edit
id rather it be challenging all the way through and possible early than playing 1/3 of the game different then stomping everything

Yeah, no ♥♥♥♥, almost as if there might be a middleground between dealing 10k per bullet with Lv1 shock and dealing 300 damage for 20 RAM trying to play around the scuffed tracing mechanic.

[the Literal Worst]

Originally posted by Hex: Onii-Chan:

Originally posted by the literal worst:

yeah i get you, i do remember 1.0 hacking being way to OP, but maybe they could do something to at least make it possible early game (the amount of ram you get just feels like 1.0 hacking was pushed to mid late game and its kinda silly)

edit
id rather it be challenging all the way through and possible early than playing 1/3 of the game different then stomping everything

Yeah, no ♥♥♥♥, almost as if there might be a middleground between dealing 10k per bullet with Lv1 shock and dealing 300 damage for 20 RAM trying to play around the scuffed tracing mechanic.

i think trace is good, just might need a little tuned back or a way to preemptively stop it permanently, for that encounter obviously lol (if you are willing to put the work into set up like a netrunner would)