Why the story "lied" to us?

[udtojan95]

Why the game didn't tell that it was Militech and Morgan Blackhand and not Johnny who did blew up the arasaka tower?

[Tokenn]

More to the point is that _Johnny_ is lying about doing it. It's the old Unreliable Narrator literary device.

Since I knew nothing about the Cyberpunk 'lore', it doesn't bother me at all.

[Bisexual Offender]

Johnnys memories is altered. Be it heavy PTSD and cyberpsychosis or Arasaka ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ him into oblivion we don`t really know. Neither do we know how his engramm ended in sakas hands. Game did not lie, game presented knowledge as it is known in the world.

[wb3jma]

missed this on my first play through where/how is it revealed?

[Bisexual Offender]

Originally posted by wb3jma:

missed this on my first play through where/how is it revealed?

In game? It is not. It`s meta knowledge from a sourcebook.

[Zebedee]

Like Sand Guardian says, a lot of the detail needs you to dig into Pondsmith's work about the setting. But Alt does tell you that Johnny's memories are at best partially true and Maximum Mike also gives hints towards it (even if it's buried in all the conspiracy stuff - it is conspiracy stuff... isn't it?...).

edit: from 20:25 here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KMgLhFQGHcM

[Utopian]

They kinda destroyed the lore for "muh wholesome Keanu", at least that's what I think. The game is incosistent even with Cyberpunk RED, which is supposed to be altered to fit 2077's lore.

[Zebedee]

Originally posted by BeeTheImmortal:

They kinda destroyed the lore for "muh wholesome Keanu", at least that's what I think. The game is incosistent even with Cyberpunk RED, which is supposed to be altered to fit 2077's lore.

Pondsmith is writing both (with CDPR's Patrick Mills for the game specific stuff) and seems pretty confident it all fits together. I think some people get unreasonably obsessed with Keanu Reeves to the point they miss that Johnny Silverhand is an unreliable narrator. Although to be fair I think almost everyone realises that Alt wasn't kidnapped in some bizarre Arasaka attempt to get at him.

[r.linder]

Originally posted by Sand Guardian:

Originally posted by wb3jma:

missed this on my first play through where/how is it revealed?

In game? It is not. It`s meta knowledge from a sourcebook.

It is in the game. Alt says that Johnny's memories are inaccurate because they're just his subjective view of the events that took place.

Johnny being very narcissistic viewed himself as way more important than he actually was, and his memories are full of inconsistencies that you can notice throughout the game if you have a pretty good memory.

[egg fu]

Originally posted by BeeTheImmortal:

They kinda destroyed the lore for "muh wholesome Keanu", at least that's what I think. The game is incosistent even with Cyberpunk RED, which is supposed to be altered to fit 2077's lore.

not really, its pretty intentional. especially with how alt recalls that johnny is selfish and remembers the past quite differently.

plus pondsmith doesn't want to mess with blackhand rn since he has plans for that character apparently.

[r.linder]

Originally posted by abolishbananas:

Originally posted by BeeTheImmortal:

They kinda destroyed the lore for "muh wholesome Keanu", at least that's what I think. The game is incosistent even with Cyberpunk RED, which is supposed to be altered to fit 2077's lore.

not really, its pretty intentional. especially with how alt recalls that johnny is selfish and remembers the past quite differently.

plus pondsmith doesn't want to mess with blackhand rn since he has plans for that character apparently.

fun fact: blackhand was pondsmith's character in the original tabletop game before he was personified as maximum mike

[NorthernDavid]

You know the game kinda hinted that most if not all characters will be somewhat unreliable in what they tell you. T-bug has a quote early on that kinda shows this, when she claims to quote Marcus Aurelieus (I think) with "Everything you hear is an opinion not a fact".

If you think about it every character in the game is giving you information filtered through their own perspectives and knowledge. And also Silverhand deluding himself to make himself look good in his own memories, (which is where V gets the story of the raids on Saka tower) is actually very consistent with his character.

[Leynx & Fenrir]

But for a player not aware of the lore of Cyberpunk, it is not obvious.

In the game there are not hints Silverhand did not blow the Arasaka tower. Yeah, he was not as glorious and cool as he thinks he was. But that is because the player can compare and confront both Silverhand's memory and what his former acquaintances and friends could say about him. But other NPC confirm the nuke thing and the assault.

Tell me if I have skipped something.

To be sincere, I was disappointed by the story. I thought that at the end we would learn that Johnny has never been real. That he was a AI created by Arasaka and went rogue ending with Arasaka tower being blown up. And that cyberpsychosis was linked to all that...but meh.

IMHO, CDPR should have talk with Mike Pondsmith and consider that things like GITS (and Appleseed) or Serial Experiment Lain, Bubblegum Crisis, AD police and Matrix really pushed the genre quite far.

[Zebedee]

I posted the Maximum Mike discussion of what happened on Arasaka tower which is on Morro Rock radio station. There's also a shard which plays with the competing theories

https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/What_Really_Happened_in_Arasaka_Tower%3F

It is there but it's something which can be missed.

[Leynx & Fenrir]

Originally posted by Zebedee:

I posted the Maximum Mike discussion of what happened on Arasaka tower which is on Morro Rock radio station. There's also a shard which plays with the competing theories

https://cyberpunk.fandom.com/wiki/What_Really_Happened_in_Arasaka_Tower%3F

It is there but it's something which can be missed.

Thank you. Interesting lore.

Anyway, the game failed hard to play with the fact that nothing can't be trusted à la GITS Innocence.

[Zebedee]

Originally posted by Leynx & Fenrir:

Thank you. Interesting lore.

Anyway, the game failed hard to play with the fact that nothing can't be trusted à la GITS Innocence.

I think it's a persistent secondary theme they play with, rather than a primary driver to the arc of V's story, yeah. It's constantly there in the background while V passes through other people's stories and maybe the player pieces some things together, maybe they don't.