Kerenzikov

[Дремора Лорд]

I'm building a samurai build with extreme speed (time dilation). But it seems this implant is more of a hindrance than a help. Basically, we fight against people with firearms, we also never do tackles and dodging strikes, since it's not convenient on the keyboard. Should I choose other deceleration implants?

[charly4711]

Hmm, I can't claim to be very experienced with melee builds ... actually trying to play one for the first time, right now, and man do I have coping issues ... ahem ... but ...
The time dilation stuff via blocking while sliding is something I haven't really mastered, but the dodging thing seems fairly easy and has saved me a couple of times, already. Waiting around a corner from 3 Maelstromers shooting, one comes my way, double-tap D to move out of cover, slow down time and slash the one up, slide back around the corner, like nothing happened.

[Graf Erik]

Just finished a Kerenzikov-Katana playthrough, worked really good.
Triggering with sliding requires some training though. I did this for an hour on the roof of the parking deck of my appartment. Also I paired it with an double-jump implant.

Jump-Jump-Sprint-Aim-Duck-Shlash-Shlash-Jump-Jump-Away.
Takes some time until its fluent, but once it works firearms arn't eally a problem anymore. You don't stay long enough to get shot at.

Kerenzikov has the advantage that you can use it together with a deck. So first distribute somer optical reboot, a sonic shock, a bit of distract enemies and then I jump-jump in.
If you don't want to take advantage of that, better get a Sandevistan, thats stronger.

Finaly, consider getting the Advanced Kerenzikov mod. Early Kerenzikovs are fine as by as they are, but the legendary is a bit stupid regarding the balance of strength and duration. 90% slow down but only 3.5s duration, means you only have 0.35 real-seconds available. Thats, like, one strike. (I reduced the strength to 70%, thats 3 times faster and still more than enough, but now it lasts effectivly 3 times longer, so 1.2 seconds).

[Дремора Лорд]

Originally posted by charly4711:

Hmm, I can't claim to be very experienced with melee builds ... actually trying to play one for the first time, right now, and man do I have coping issues ... ahem ... but ...
The time dilation stuff via blocking while sliding is something I haven't really mastered, but the dodging thing seems fairly easy and has saved me a couple of times, already. Waiting around a corner from 3 Maelstromers shooting, one comes my way, double-tap D to move out of cover, slow down time and slash the one up, slide back around the corner, like nothing happened.

But after dodging, it takes a mandatory hit to slow down, and this is precious time.

[Дремора Лорд]

Originally posted by Graf Erik:

Just finished a Kerenzikov-Katana playthrough, worked really good.
Triggering with sliding requires some training though. I did this for an hour on the roof of the parking deck of my appartment. Also I paired it with an double-jump implant.

Jump-Jump-Sprint-Aim-Duck-Shlash-Shlash-Jump-Jump-Away.
Takes some time until its fluent, but once it works firearms arn't eally a problem anymore. You don't stay long enough to get shot at.

Kerenzikov has the advantage that you can use it together with a deck. So first distribute somer optical reboot, a sonic shock, a bit of distract enemies and then I jump-jump in.
If you don't want to take advantage of that, better get a Sandevistan, thats stronger.

Finaly, consider getting the Advanced Kerenzikov mod. Early Kerenzikovs are fine as by as they are, but the legendary is a bit stupid regarding the balance of strength and duration. 90% slow down but only 3.5s duration, means you only have 0.35 real-seconds available. Thats, like, one strike. (I reduced the strength to 70%, thats 3 times faster and still more than enough, but now it lasts effectivly 3 times longer, so 1.2 seconds).

Thanks for the advice, I practiced for an hour and got better at it. But I don't understand about the double jump module, since the jump doesn't work for slowing down, but only dodging/sliding + hitting

[Graf Erik]

Originally posted by Иерарх Артанис:

Thanks for the advice, I practiced for an hour and got better at it. But I don't understand about the double jump module, since the jump doesn't work for slowing down, but only dodging/sliding + hitting

Yes, jumping doesn't trigger it, thats why I do the jump-jump-slide. The sliding is to trigger the Kerenzikov and move in to attack, the double jumping is to close in over a large distance (since I use close combat and most enemies have firearms), and to get out afterwards to cover the Kerenzikov cooldown.
While mid air you're almost impossible to hit.

[Дремора Лорд]

Originally posted by Graf Erik:

Originally posted by Иерарх Артанис:

Thanks for the advice, I practiced for an hour and got better at it. But I don't understand about the double jump module, since the jump doesn't work for slowing down, but only dodging/sliding + hitting

Yes, jumping doesn't trigger it, thats why I do the jump-jump-slide. The sliding is to trigger the Kerenzikov and move in to attack, the double jumping is to close in over a large distance (since I use close combat and most enemies have firearms), and to get out afterwards to cover the Kerenzikov cooldown.
While mid air you're almost impossible to hit.

Thanks, got it

[Darkaiser]

Don't forget that there is also a piece of cyberware (I forget the name) that will slow you down for a couple of seconds when someone sees you. The effects don't stack so what you might do is simply run in, which allows you to be seen and triggers the first dilation, ride that one out (it's enough for a couple of attacks), then when it drops do a dodge or slide to trigger the other one for another couple of hits.

I did something similar to this on my pistol build and it worked pretty well.

[shoopy]

Easy Kerenzikov trigger is just hold block then dodge.

Block first, then dodge while blocking. The main use of it is buffs and covering ground while evading attacks. Yes you can only hit once or twice while it is active, but if you have the Jinchu Maru for example, those hits will always be criticals. This is often enough for one-hit decapitations.

Also it may not seem like much but the extra long dodge is actually useful. It makes the boxing matches trivial because the opponent can't hit you and you have a long window to square up and beat the crap out of them.

[Дремора Лорд]

Originally posted by Darkaiser:

Don't forget that there is also a piece of cyberware (I forget the name) that will slow you down for a couple of seconds when someone sees you. The effects don't stack so what you might do is simply run in, which allows you to be seen and triggers the first dilation, ride that one out (it's enough for a couple of attacks), then when it drops do a dodge or slide to trigger the other one for another couple of hits.

I did something similar to this on my pistol build and it worked pretty well.

thanks

[Дремора Лорд]

Originally posted by ardiel:

Easy Kerenzikov trigger is just hold block then dodge.

Block first, then dodge while blocking. The main use of it is buffs and covering ground while evading attacks. Yes you can only hit once or twice while it is active, but if you have the Jinchu Maru for example, those hits will always be criticals. This is often enough for one-hit decapitations.

Also it may not seem like much but the extra long dodge is actually useful. It makes the boxing matches trivial because the opponent can't hit you and you have a long window to square up and beat the crap out of them.

thanks

[dmfan79]

Sandevistan is better imho, you never risk to fire it when you don't want to. Also, there's a combination of cyberware/mods that practically lets you stay under the slowmo effect as long as you want (you lower the downtime to 3 seconds)

[shoopy]

Originally posted by dmfan79:

Sandevistan is better imho, you never risk to fire it when you don't want to. Also, there's a combination of cyberware/mods that practically lets you stay under the slowmo effect as long as you want (you lower the downtime to 3 seconds)

Sandevistan is amazing and pairs well with scalpel and bleed perks. Kerenzikov still has its place because you don't have to give up hacking to use it. For that reason it's not necessarily better because they're two different types of cyberware.

[charly4711]

One thing I'm wondering ...
when I trigger Kerenzikov, I cannot move? Like run forward or jump?
Is that normal? Is that what they did to disable the Kerenzikov bunny-jump?

[shoopy]

Originally posted by charly4711:

One thing I'm wondering ...
when I trigger Kerenzikov, I cannot move? Like run forward or jump?
Is that normal? Is that what they did to disable the Kerenzikov bunny-jump?

You can move, it just has a lot of inertia. I'm often zig-zagging and circling behind people with it. Not sure why you can't.

[charly4711]

Originally posted by ardiel:

Originally posted by charly4711:

One thing I'm wondering ...
when I trigger Kerenzikov, I cannot move? Like run forward or jump?
Is that normal? Is that what they did to disable the Kerenzikov bunny-jump?

You can move, it just has a lot of inertia. I'm often zig-zagging and circling behind people with it. Not sure why you can't.

ok, yes, I should have phrased that more precisely. I specifically noticed hitting space to jump or even double-tapping or W+SHIFT don't seem to do much.
I distinctly remember Kerenzikov + jump used to do a LOT ... wondering if it's been overcompensated. Seems like I need to position myself well _before_triggering Kkov ... what exactly do you press to zig-zag?