Spoilers! Takemura: Friend or Foe

[Old Man Gamer (OMG)]

Takemura's personality is done really well, but you can easily miss it. If you skip conversations, quests or overlook his comments, you might miss the depth of Takemura's character.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2405487291

I see Takemura as an enemy, and someone who is your most dangerous ally. However, the ends justify the means, right? The thing that sticks out most, is how much Takemura despises anything that is not Arasaka. He spends most of his time with V, criticizing and looking down on everything and everyone. If you were able to get him to talk about his past, you would see that he is a great example off someone who forgot where he came from, or you could say that he is also someone that carries great pride in how he is no longer there.

Takemura is someone that I love to hate, and love for it. He scoffs at the food, criticizes the people and judges others actions and moralities, and just looks down at everyone but his acceptable circle. From the berating of the cook when sitting and eating with V, to his very harsh statement of saying there is no beauty in Night City, when observing and scouting for the next step in plans, for example. There are many times in between, before and after these, in which Takemura shows that he sees himself above all others that are not of his culture.

The thing I like most about Takemura, is he is unbending of his opinion, no matter the circumstances. I know people like this, who would cut off the nose to spite the face. They get their objective done, but in the end, they are still ruined. Takemura is doing just that with V, the entire time. I believe he knows this, and considers this the honorable outcome of his situation. He also shows that he has a glimmer of hope for salvation as well, in his discussions with Hanako.

In short, I see Takemura as someone taking advantage of V, regardless if V deserves it or not. I consider him a fantastic example of the enemy of my enemy is my friend. However, to define what that enemy is exactly would be a whole different subject.

For those that have played the game and formed their own thoughts, I would like to see if your take on Takemura is different or aligned with mine. Different perspectives could add a lot.

[['w']]

the enemy of my enemy is just someone else who is going to backstab me

PS: outstanding assessment and work for this forum

[FableBlaze]

I pretty much agree with your assessment.
I would add that Takemura is very much driven by his loyalty to Arasaka and also his sense of honour which drives him to find V with the hope of setting things right in Arasaka.
But he is very much a follower. You can see it in the Arasaka ending when he tells you that it is not up to us to judge the messed up Arasaka family.

[Old Man Gamer (OMG)]

Originally posted by EtOmniaVanitas:

the enemy of my enemy is just someone else who is going to backstab me

PS: outstanding assessment and work for this forum

That is an excellent way of putting it. He would not even consider it a bad thing to stab V in the back, from how I see him treating V. Thank you for your kind words.

Originally posted by FableBlaze:

I pretty much agree with your assessment.
I would add that Takemura is very much driven by his loyalty to Arasaka and also his sense of honour which drives him to find V with the hope of setting things right in Arasaka.
But he is very much a follower. You can see it in the Arasaka ending when he tells you that it is not up to us to judge the messed up Arasaka family.

Thank you, and indeed. He even states several times that he values honor above all else. He is very far from an independent thinker, which makes him perfect for his role. He will not question morality, but simply do as he is told. As your example illustrated very well.

[Andrea Honeybee]

i havent read anything in here, for fear of spoilers, just wanna add my prediction, i am barely going to meet with the man for his first mission, no real interaction with him so far other than he needs me for something. Based on this, and the fact he was in the room when the ♥♥♥♥ hit the fan in the beginning, i feel like he saw you when you and jackie were hiding behind the tv.... i am pretty sure he is going to try and ♥♥♥♥ me over. ill find out soon enough.

[proci85]

Takemura is a ronin. His master was killed, therefore he became an outcast, still clinging to its old samurai self.

Takemura despises Night city because he associates the city with his downfall. He says he is homesick, but actually being homesick has a double meaning here, both missing Tokyo and being part of Arasaka. The later is also being seen with Corpo V during Nocturne OP55N1 with one of the dialogue options. Note also that Arasaka is a Japanese company, and for old timers, that meant that the company takes care of you.

Takemura also has difficulties to adjust with the situation. It is visible on the outside, the smell and how he extrapolates his self-hatred towards everyone. His loyality is unquestioned, which also blinds him. It is completely obvious that there is a takeover and he is nothing but a pawn with no control over his own destiny. V remarks this at the end of the "Devil" ending too ("I have a choice", which also reflects over the fate of Evelyn and even Vs dialogue with Johnny during the "suicide" ending ).

As a side note, the Devil ending mostly only makes sense from a Corpo V point of view, where it can be interpreted as an act of grace, independent if the player stays in Mikoshi or leaves back to Night City, see the final video from Hanako.

Also, Takemura isn't the only one using others, remember the remark from Johnny at the restaurant.

Oh, and his remark during the "Sun" (if applicable) is completely hilarious :D.

[FableBlaze]

Originally posted by Andrea Honeybee:

i feel like he saw you when you and jackie were hiding behind the tv....

That would make a lot of sense actually.

[Old Man Gamer (OMG)]

Originally posted by Andrea Honeybee:

i havent read anything in here, for fear of spoilers, just wanna add my prediction, i am barely going to meet with the man for his first mission, no real interaction with him so far other than he needs me for something. Based on this, and the fact he was in the room when the ♥♥♥♥ hit the fan in the beginning, i feel like he saw you when you and jackie were hiding behind the tv.... i am pretty sure he is going to try and ♥♥♥♥ me over. ill find out soon enough.

The story is a lot of fun. by the time you read this later, you will find that the depth of each character is not like your typical video game. Aside from River Ward, in my personal opinion. I hope that you enjoy it as much as I have and am.

Originally posted by proci85:

Takemura is a ronin. His master was killed, therefore he became an outcast, still clinging to its old samurai self.

Takemura despises Night city because he associates the city with his downfall. He says he is homesick, but actually being homesick has a double meaning here, both missing Tokyo and being part of Arasaka. The later is also being seen with Corpo V during Nocturne OP55N1 with one of the dialogue options. Note also that Arasaka is a Japanese company, and for old timers, that meant that the company takes care of you.

Takemura also has difficulties to adjust with the situation. It is visible on the outside, the smell and how he extrapolates his self-hatred towards everyone. His loyality is unquestioned, which also blinds him. It is completely obvious that there is a takeover and he is nothing but a pawn with no control over his own destiny. V remarks this at the end of the "Devil" ending too ("I have a choice", which also reflects over the fate of Evelyn and even Vs dialogue with Johnny during the "suicide" ending ).

As a side note, the Devil ending mostly only makes sense from a Corpo V point of view, where it can be interpreted as an act of grace, independent if the player stays in Mikoshi or leaves back to Night City, see the final video from Hanako.

Also, Takemura isn't the only one using others, remember the remark from Johnny at the restaurant.

Oh, and his remark during the "Sun" (if applicable) is completely hilarious :D.

This is a great term, Ronin. Such a title is very fitting for Takemura. While I find myself fascinated with the many cultures around the world, some traditions can be self-destructive. Takemura seems to have fallen into this category, whether he knows it or not. He truly does seem a pawn in the story, and even Hanako uses him with the intentions to discard him after.

This reminds me of his message to V after the Fear the Reaper ending, selecting to stay as V. I will not say more, to avoid spoiling for anyone who has not done that yet.

[Andrea Honeybee]

for sure i will enjoy it, i already love the premise of whats going on with johnny, and i promise that IF takemura tries to pull anything on me, he'll end up like good ol dex. period lol.

[talemore]

I realize that the scene was staged. The emperor killed by his son to take the body of his son. Takemura had nothing to prove. The plot behind him finding V was just to recover the chip. But even without the chip. Takemura still has no reason why to prove any honor. Once the emperor would reveal himself he wouldn't be a Ronin anymore.

[EddystoneM17]

Takemura's loyalty to Arasaka knows no bounds. I didn't like him one bit. Every interaction I had with him seemed like he had an ulterior motive. He doesn't want or need V, he only needs V to [spolier] tell Honako what he witnessed [/spoiler]......
Arasaka do not really need V's chip either. Unless they want to create a chip that takes over the neurology of a person. They created it originally, they can do it again.

This is a bit of a plot hole for me. Because all through the game we are seeing braindances to catch criminals. So why doesn't Takemura get judy (V's friend) to edit a braindance of that day? Then he could take the brain dance to Hanako and leave V alone. Or was it mentioned that they couldn't get a braindance of the day from V for some reason?


Now I feel sorry for River...... ha ha ha

[Old Man Gamer (OMG)]

Originally posted by EddystoneM17:

Takemura's loyalty to Arasaka knows no bounds. I didn't like him one bit. Every interaction I had with him seemed like he had an ulterior motive. He doesn't want or need V, he only needs V to tell Honako what he witnessed .....
Arasaka do not really need V's chip either. Unless they want to create a chip that takes over the neurology of a person. They created it originally, they can do it again.

This is a bit of a plot hole for me. Because all through the game we are seeing braindances to catch criminals. So why doesn't Takemura get judy (V's friend) to edit a braindance of that day? Then he could take the brain dance to Hanako and leave V alone. Or was it mentioned that they couldn't get a braindance of the day from V for some reason?


Now I feel sorry for River...... ha ha ha

If you get the ending with Arasaka, it explains why they want the chip. The doctor speaks to her notes about how this is all experimental, a first and how it is a great success. This is then implied, via the new that you watch, that this is the research they needed to put Saburo into Yorinobu's body.

Takemura also knows nothing about Judy. He did not even know V, and only found him because of leads that took him to Dex, most likely through the body of T-Bug. This also explains why if you send Jackie to Mama Welles, you get a funeral, but if you send him to Victor, Arasaka comes and takes the body.

[proci85]

Originally posted by EddystoneM17:

Takemura's loyalty to Arasaka knows no bounds. I didn't like him one bit. Every interaction I had with him seemed like he had an ulterior motive. He doesn't want or need V, he only needs V to [spolier] tell Honako what he witnessed [/spoiler]......
Arasaka do not really need V's chip either. Unless they want to create a chip that takes over the neurology of a person. They created it originally, they can do it again.

This is a bit of a plot hole for me. Because all through the game we are seeing braindances to catch criminals. So why doesn't Takemura get judy (V's friend) to edit a braindance of that day? Then he could take the brain dance to Hanako and leave V alone. Or was it mentioned that they couldn't get a braindance of the day from V for some reason?


Now I feel sorry for River...... ha ha ha

V doesn't have a BD recording implant. Takemura doesn't have any tech to extract memories either.

Originally posted by Old Man Gamer (OMG):

This is a great term, Ronin. Such a title is very fitting for Takemura. While I find myself fascinated with the many cultures around the world, some traditions can be self-destructive. Takemura seems to have fallen into this category, whether he knows it or not. He truly does seem a pawn in the story, and even Hanako uses him with the intentions to discard him after.

This reminds me of his message to V after the Fear the Reaper ending, selecting to stay as V. I will not say more, to avoid spoiling for anyone who has not done that yet.

Yep, Takemura reminded me of Kurosawa movies in that sense.

You get the same message from him both if you go alone (Reaper), with Rouge ("Sun") or if you go with Panam ("Star"). I'm unsure what happens if you leave Johnny in V's body ("Temperance"). All of these endings result in the fall of Arasaka and Takemura eventually performing a harakiri as a way to redeem himself. Note that for Takemura it is harakiri and not just suicide, as for everyone else, even that is a choice (Judy is explicit about this if you say "I'm not good with words" at the rooftop and some others also spell this out during the videos), whereas Takemura has none at that point.

---

The cultural aspect of the game is actually spot on. I'm fluent in English and can understand some Spanish, French and German, additionally I can catch some things even in Japanese and Russian. There are some very elaborated language jokes, like the "Zeig Dich" announcement: It translates literally to "show yourself" from German, although with the image, it has the "Bück dich" (bend over) vibe to it too, besides that even "Zieh dich" (put on some clothes, also dress up). Or the "Totentanz" (Dance macabre), I had a great laugh when Tinnitus was playing.

[PsychoBush]

Originally posted by EddystoneM17:

This is a bit of a plot hole for me. Because all through the game we are seeing braindances to catch criminals. So why doesn't Takemura get judy (V's friend) to edit a braindance of that day? Then he could take the brain dance to Hanako and leave V alone. Or was it mentioned that they couldn't get a braindance of the day from V for some reason?

Now I feel sorry for River...... ha ha ha

Not everyone has the braindance upgrade implanted. And it seems it can be switched on and off too. So it's not something recording 24/7.

[EddystoneM17]

ARGHHHHHHH........ Thank you for clearing that up. I haven't done the Arasaka ending yet..
I gave Jackie to family first run, and gave him to victor second. Thats why Dex is shot when you wake up in the dump, he would have taken Takemura to the site he dumped V at ....... Cool....

Then Saburo into Yorinobo's body makes it clear to me now Cheers!!



Did you ever find the highwayman mission, whereby you end up with a green bike with skull on it?

Does anyone here have the guide? I pre ordered it for December, it's now Feb with no ETA.......

I'd like to get a list going of the hidden missions. I think I read 3x and did 1x..........

[Old Man Gamer (OMG)]

Originally posted by proci85:

Yep, Takemura reminded me of Kurosawa movies in that sense.

You get the same message from him both if you go alone (Reaper), with Rouge ("Sun") or if you go with Panam ("Star"). I'm unsure what happens if you leave Johnny in V's body ("Temperance"). All of these endings result in the fall of Arasaka and Takemura eventually performing a harakiri as a way to redeem himself. Note that for Takemura it is harakiri and not just suicide, as for everyone else, even that is a choice (Judy is explicit about this if you say "I'm not good with words" at the rooftop and some others also spell this out during the videos), whereas Takemura has none at that point.

---

The cultural aspect of the game is actually spot on. I'm fluent in English and can understand some Spanish, French and German, additionally I can catch some things even in Japanese and Russian. There are some very elaborated language jokes, like the "Zeig Dich" announcement: It translates literally to "show yourself" from German, although with the image, it has the "Bück dich" (bend over) vibe to it too, besides that even "Zieh dich" (put on some clothes, also dress up). Or the "Totentanz" (Dance macabre), I had a great laugh when Tinnitus was playing.

Ah, my first playthrough, I did not know to save Takemura, and on my second, I did the Arasaka endings.

From my travels, while in the military, I can confidently say that they did the cultural aspects exceptionally well. One of my Japanese friends, who was half Japanese, would tell me horror stories of how his family is treated in Japan, due to his family not being pure Japanese. Granted, he did well in the Army, and we became very good friends. He also introduced me to anime. We first watched Cowboy Bebop.

I feel that Takemura would have made a great boss fight, and fittingly so, at some point. Fear the Reaper ending would have been perfect for it, I think. However, his parting words are epic, and I found them to be brilliantly places with the rolling credits.

Originally posted by EddystoneM17:

ARGHHHHHHH........ Thank you for clearing that up. I haven't done the Arasaka ending yet..
I gave Jackie to family first run, and gave him to victor second. Thats why Dex is shot when you wake up in the dump, he would have taken Takemura to the site he dumped V at ....... Cool....

Then Saburo into Yorinobo's body makes it clear to me now Cheers!!



Did you ever find the highwayman mission, whereby you end up with a green bike with skull on it?

Does anyone here have the guide? I pre ordered it for December, it's now Feb with no ETA.......

I'd like to get a list going of the hidden missions. I think I read 3x and did 1x..........

That bike is the only vehicle I do not have. I have done everything else, but I am trying to do it without looking things up. As such, I missed it for a third time. eventually, I will have them all. I also have all but one weapon for the iconic wall. The psalms one, which did not drop, because he was using mantis blades. Maybe we will get a new game plus, which would make this far easier to get things missed in a single play through.