Is necromancy evil ?

[Sc0p10n]

I was learning spells with Gale, when suddenly I realized that maybe he wouldn't want to touch anything related to necromancy.
Because necromancy usually is inherently evil or is just considered evil by some religions and cultures.
I am naive when it comes to the forgotten realm lore so i call forth the lore masters of D&D

[mayrc]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

Originally posted by Manimal:

Why a necromancer should be more evil than an evoker who rains meteors in villages for example

Because the creation of undead is an objectively evil act within the D&D / Pathfinder universe. No matter what noble purpose you turn it towards, creating any form of undead is considered evil in accordance with the laws of the universe.

Not only is it inherently evil, but the art of raising the dead within Forgotten Realms was developed by Orcus, who happens to be a Demon Lord.

Absolutly correct even lorewise.... however the "DnD-universe" doesnt exist anymore. Its recreated with DnD5e. So forget all of the Lore and rules.

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by GrandMajora:

Originally posted by His Divine Shadow:

As a paladin/cleric of the good aligned god of death in whatever medium I can be, the answer is a simple yes.

Kelemvor is the god of graves, and is the one responsible for judging the souls of the dead.

The god of Necromancy is Myrkul, and you've seen what he's about in BG3.

Right so if I made a cleric I’d worship Kelemvor or Lathander and they don’t like necromancy

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by Toblm:

Necromancy isnt evil because magic isnt evil.
Necromancy isnt evil if it isnt used for evil. Full stop.

What I was pointing out is that isnt relevent what Pathfinder says about necromancy. Only what 5e and the DM, Larian, say about necromancy. Pathfinder is a separate game, with separate lore.

I will repeat, the undead are fueled by Negative Energy, which is the antithesis to life itself.

Anything powered by negative energy is infused with a fundamental hatred for life that goes down to the instinctual level. A mindless undead who has not been bound into service will attack and kill any form of life they come across. While even the intelligent, free thinking undead can only suppress their hatred of the living through a great deal of willpower.

And unlike conjuration spells, the minions created through necromancy don't vanish when the spell's duration wears off, or their master is slain. In the event that their master is not around to continuously recast the spell every 24 hours, the undead becomes unbound and is free to run rampant attacking everything in sight.

[Sephiroth]

Necromancy is like a term used to villain the magic imo. Is the magic itself evil noo its how you use it.

Jesus brought the dead back to life.... he wasn't portrayed as evil.

[Trolleur_Durden]

Some aspects of the school of necromancy aren't inherently evil, like sending necrotic bolts of energy towards something. In this case, it's a tool, so the way it's used defines if it's evil or not, much like in the case of a fireball, an arrow, a sword slash and so on.

However, I guess we are talking about the kinky stuff here, namely playing with corpses. This is much more sulfurous. It's what could be called a "victimless crime" since the corpses aren't alive anymore, and is arguably less evil than a murder. However, playing with corpses is definitely immoral in almost every culture, existing or fictional, and that's certainly the case in most parts of Faerun too, Baldur's gate region included.

For me, raising a corpse to do your bidding as a zombie is more or less the same degree of evil as eating a corpse for sustenance. It's disgusting and immoral on various degrees and more often than not evil, but it's possible to find fringe cases when it's not the case.

[Trolleur_Durden]

Originally posted by Sephiroth:

Necromancy is like a term used to villain the magic imo. Is the magic itself evil noo its how you use it.

Jesus brought the dead back to life.... he wasn't portrayed as evil.

False equivalence fallacy, resurrection and raising the dead are two very different things.

[GrandMajora]

Originally posted by mayrc:

Absolutly correct even lorewise.... however the "DnD-universe" doesnt exist anymore. Its recreated with DnD5e. So forget all of the Lore and rules.

I disagree on the 'recreated' bit, because the old planar cosmology still exists.

Until WotC pulls their head out of their ass and rebuilds the planar cosmology from the ground up, I will never accept any claims or arguments about alignment being irrelevant or non-existent in 5th edition.

[Toblm]

Originally posted by Trolleur_Durden:

Originally posted by Sephiroth:

Necromancy is like a term used to villain the magic imo. Is the magic itself evil noo its how you use it.

Jesus brought the dead back to life.... he wasn't portrayed as evil.

False equivalence fallacy, resurrection and raising the dead are two very different things.

And yet both are equally necromancy and both can equally be used for good or ill.

[soul like that be capable of]

I think its evil since you call something that is dead and want a rest to perform . you can see pain when you talk to the dead even in this game. so not so good imo also prob most people in D&D would fear you

[AIR]

In Dungeons & Dragons, Mages usually had to denounce a school of magic while having a one that they would specialize in. It was a "fair" trade. They added this subtle detail to his lore, so it would ressonate with old fans of Baldur's Gate 1 and 2.

[Brady4444]

I've always assumed that since most cultures have a respect for the dead, that necromancy is going to be taboo in those cultures. Also, zombies and such are gross, so using them as a cheap labor force for housecleaning or farming might not be a welcome sight to most people.

[Toblm]

Originally posted by XAru:

I think its evil since you call something that is dead and want a rest to perform . you can see pain when you talk to the dead even in this game. so not so good imo also prob most people in D&D would fear you

Animate dead doesnt inherently involve souls.
Its an animation spell.
The most 'evil' thing about animate dead is a propensity for graverobbing. Which is unlawful rather than evil.

Fear also isnt a good gauge of good or evil. Any awesome demonstration of power can inspire fear. Most spells over a cantrip can easily inspire fear.

[Elazul]

Would I consider raising a deceased corpse back to life against it's will evil? Probably. After all, you're screwing with the balance of life and death and taking someone from their rest without them having any say in it. Doesn't really matter if it's for good or evil when the act itself is a perversion. /shrug

[Trolleur_Durden]

Originally posted by Toblm:

Originally posted by XAru:

I think its evil since you call something that is dead and want a rest to perform . you can see pain when you talk to the dead even in this game. so not so good imo also prob most people in D&D would fear you

Animate dead doesnt inherently involve souls.
Its an animation spell.
The most 'evil' thing about animate dead is a propensity for graverobbing. Which is unlawful rather than evil.

Fear also isnt a good gauge of good or evil. Any awesome demonstration of power can inspire fear. Most spells over a cantrip can easily inspire fear.

What about cannibalism or necrophilia then? It's quite close in the sense that you use corpses for some pragmatic purposes. Are those two not evil either?

[His Divine Shadow]

Originally posted by Toblm:

Originally posted by Trolleur_Durden:

False equivalence fallacy, resurrection and raising the dead are two very different things.

And yet both are equally necromancy and both can equally be used for good or ill.

Blasphemy. One subverts the natural order of life with disgusting dark magic, the other calls upon the soul itself to be restored by the grace of the gods.