There’s really no options for Holy Paladins

[Gønzö]

Every companion choice beyond maybe Halsin is just terrible. And druids aren’t what I’m looking for as a 4th. Astarion and Gale are obvious “No”. I’ll take Sir Fuzzalump and Asian ninja woman tyvm. Shadowheart is a cultist for an evil God so not really a viable choice. And Lae’zel is Githyanki. Weirdly the Githyanki are at least lawful evil so we share some things in common but they are so one dimensionally evil you can’t even side with them. I wanted to ride a badass dragon over the shadowlands but nope, thats not an option. She also has some of the worst advice. Karlach is devil spawn so again no. The “dream visitor” has major mary sue plot armor so no real choice there but honestly why would a Paladin follow their advice?. I guess the writing isn’t so deep and surface level is what you get. I really wish there could be a “Good” option to progress the story and have options for getting the old BG companions earlier on. Bummer.

[Gønzö]

Messaggio originale di kblaze13:

Messaggio originale di Gønzö:

Yeah I heard that before. Thats not how paladins work. You take an oath and keep it. Lawful Good and Lawful Evil don’t mix. Thats sort of the point. Gandalf didn’t try to ”save” Sauron.

and depending on the Oath, you would in fact work with evil characters.

Oath of Vengeance, and Oath of Conquest would both work with Evil alignments as long as the end goal aligned and it didn't prevent them from doing what they do.

Oath of Peace would work them as well depending on the situation.

Oath of Ancients would try to "convert" them back to good.

Oath of Devotion is really the only one that would be like "No sir you are a villain and thus i must smite thee".

so YOU are misunderstanding how Paladins work in 5e DnD. they aren't the "stick up the ass boyscout". Honestly they never were either (as it was more dependant upon the God they served) it's just dumb players and ♥♥♥♥♥♥ DMs that treated them that way.

Thats great. My oath is buttkicking for goodness.

[fmalfeas]

Paladins of Torm aren't even the holy that people think of, because Torm and Mercy are not words that go together. You draw the hostile attention of a paladin of Torm, and they won't ask any questions, they'll just smite. And Torm will approve firmly.

[Rex is back, baby!]

Messaggio originale di Gønzö:

Every companion choice beyond maybe Halsin is just terrible. And druids aren’t what I’m looking for as a 4th. Astarion and Gale are obvious “No”. I’ll take Sir Fuzzalump and Asian ninja woman tyvm. Shadowheart is a cultist for an evil God so not really a viable choice. And Lae’zel is Githyanki. Weirdly the Githyanki are at least lawful evil so we share some things in common but they are so one dimensionally evil you can’t even side with them. I wanted to ride a badass dragon over the shadowlands but nope, thats not an option. She also has some of the worst advice. Karlach is devil spawn so again no. The “dream visitor” has major mary sue plot armor so no real choice there but honestly why would a Paladin follow their advice?. I guess the writing isn’t so deep and surface level is what you get. I really wish there could be a “Good” option to progress the story and have options for getting the old BG companions earlier on. Bummer.

Oh honey, well, you're role playing the classic lawful stupid paladin :b.
True Good is all about redemption. Take the flawed characters, and lead by example, SHOW them how to be good.

There's way more to Shadowheart than what you see on the surface level. Understand she's brainwashed, they forcefully removed her memories. She's gaslit, she's indoctrinated. Treat her like you're rescuing her from the cult. Selune would be proud ;). Also Shart is good based on the approval you get from her. She just has some mischieviousness about her, being a shadow domain cleric.

Karlach (as a Paladin), I agree with you. I killed her in my paladin playthough >.> (Wyll spoiler: Cause I didn't want Demon Wyll).

Gale's... okay, he's a wizard, he behaves like a wizard. If you can't stand him, yea you get Wyll who's a bit hypocritical but a hero complex and tries to be good!.

The only utility you really have is Astarion, and yes, he is evil, but more in the selfish hedonistic way. Knowing his backstory, he's a victim, he's PERFECT for a redemption story.

Lae'zal, same boat. She's young and naive and only knows the teachings of her lawful evil race. become her mentor, an older sibling, set her on the right path!


BG3's central theme, I've come to learn, is about destiny, and going against destiny--forging your own path. IF your companions follow their "destiny" yea, they're "evil." If you influence them to forge their own path, there's some gold beneath the mud.

[Morgian]

Well, there is no saving Astarion. You can make him a more horrible monster or leave him as he is. But he always remains a blooddrinker preying on others.

[Weekend]

for real! someone in another thread was arguing with me that Astarion was just misunderstood. I'm like wtf? he is blatantly evil every step of the way. They said I obviously didn't get it???

[Morgian]

Well, he approves of bad things, and did them himself for 200 years. He is a heartless egocentric and does not change, unless making him Dracula is an improvement.

[GrandMajora]

Halsin is a Druid.

Jaheira is, or at least WAS a Druid / Fighter multiclass in BG 1 and 2.

Minsc is a Ranger.

So apparently, if you want a good aligned companion (who's not Karlach), you've gotta take on a bunch of tree huggers.

[fmalfeas]

I played a Dark Urge game where I was just giving in from the word go. Every character that approved of it is basically irredeemable.

[GrandMajora]

Messaggio originale di Morgian:

Well, there is no saving Astarion. You can make him a more horrible monster or leave him as he is. But he always remains a blooddrinker preying on others.

If you leave him as he is, he drinks blood because he has to.

If you make him worse, he drinks blood because he wants to.

[カミナ]

I romance shadowheart as oath of ancients because my character saw good in her and I turned her to the light. It was quite cute. Not like there are lots of options though shes the only normal decent looking girl in the game.

[Arrwmkr]

Stay celibate, that's very paladin like :)

[GrandMajora]

Messaggio originale di kblaze13:

and depending on the Oath, you would in fact work with evil characters.

Oath of Vengeance, and Oath of Conquest would both work with Evil alignments as long as the end goal aligned and it didn't prevent them from doing what they do.

The Oath of Conquest is all about enslaving and oppressing people. They have the phrase "douse the flames of hope" seared into their own flesh. I think the Oath of Conquest is practically required to side with evil characters.

[fmalfeas]

There are several oaths that would be fine with Bane and his followers, because they have absolutely zero tolerance for breaking the law (of their church and the nations it controls).

[Incantus]

What the actual...

Karlach is perhaps the single most GOOD aligned character you can get as a companion!?

Wyll is neutral at best (Spoilers: Him being a hero for the people is for pretty selfish reasons when it all comes down to it.) , Gale while annoying, is ultimately a good guy.

Shadowheart might try to act evil but nearly all her approvals are good guy options, she is thorny but has a heart of gold.

Asterion is just... ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, if you let him. Lae'zel is text book Lawful Evil.

Seems to me you judged all characters after two sentances and would make for a very poor paladin.

[Incantus]

Messaggio originale di GrandMajora:

Halsin is a Druid.

Jaheira is, or at least WAS a Druid / Fighter multiclass in BG 1 and 2.

Minsc is a Ranger.

So apparently, if you want a good aligned companion (who's not Karlach), you've gotta take on a bunch of tree huggers.

Asterion is the only downright evil companion. And even he can change his tune pretty quickly if you encourage it enough.

But they are all pretty thorny at first, its a pretty stressed situation they find themselves in after all.