Is there a legitimate reason why manual saving isn't an option?

[ureaditwrong]

Is it because of a technical issue or just because the game is "realistic?" In the case of the former, I can understand but if it's the latter, that's ridiculous. This game is clearly way more of an RPG than a simulation and even in RPGs much more realistic than this (such as Mount and Blade), there is an option to enable manual saving.

What's more, there's a massive amount of content to be enjoyed in this game, but because of the lack of manual save, experimentation and/or grinding is actively discouraged, in favor of formulaic "safe" gameplay. I can think of only a couple of areas that are actually viable as permanent bases in this game but if we were allowed to manually save, you could set up pretty much anywhere on this ginormous map indefinitely. Indeed, what is the point of such a large map with no incentive to explore it?

I want to see manual save if possible in the next update.

[Puppers]

I doubt i would have kept playing this game as long as i have if it didnt have permadeath. Was one of the first games i ever played with permadeath. There is something addicting about it.

And being able to create characters on the same world os good enough for me.

Like someone mentioned skill journal mod if you dont like losing your skills. I have a friend who doesnt like dying and losing her skills so i get it for her and makes her happy.

[KrummLuck]

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

What's more, there's a massive amount of content to be enjoyed in this game, but because of the lack of manual save, experimentation and/or grinding is actively discouraged, in favor of formulaic "safe" gameplay.

With mods you can add even MORE content, and there's definitely mods that can do what you'd like. Imo the only thing you could lose permadeath wise is just skills. You can make a new character in the same game you started and go back to get all of your stuff. Skills aren't entirely THAT hard to grind back, unless it's something more niche like nimble and mechanics which you can speed up most of the skills with books, but either way, sandbox option to your specific wants is your best bet for longevity which everyone encourages or that one mod someone talked about, for keeping skills. Plus, this game is a pure sandbox game with literally no real end goal and even if you modded it to all hell and turned all zombies into anime models, go right ahead no one thinks it's "wrong" lol. Want absolutely EASY zombies, low strength, no infection, low population, the world is yours friend. In the future there might be an end goal, but as of now it's pure sim/sandbox. Typical RPGs have a full story and an ending, scripted events etc, there's only RNG events meant to throw a challenge at you. There is no ending but death in this game. I like to to think of this game as an "RP" game vs an "RPG" if that make sense. Make your own stories and be creative with how you see yourself playing, it's what simulators are meant for.

[Legion]

Lack of manual save does not mean there is no incentive to explore or experiment. That is solely a you problem, not the game's problem.

Secondly, you are requesting a change to the CORE gameplay loop of a game sold as a permadeath survival game. It's clearly not the game for you, thus making it a you problem.

Thirdly, you can make any location viable with patience and time. That is, once more, a you problem.

[Beltneck]

Nomadic の投稿を引用：

Lack of manual save does not mean there is no incentive to explore or experiment. That is solely a you problem, not the game's problem.

Yeah, skill issue.

Plenty of people have cleaned out the prison, or setup in louisville without the need to save scum.

[ureaditwrong]

Razorfish の投稿を引用：

it is good precisely because there is no save option...

with a save option , it just becomes another 2d game from the 90's

That is a very funny and telling take since it implies this playerbase basically has no faith in the game's mechanics other than permadeath lol.

[ureaditwrong]

Danson の投稿を引用：

You're kinda missing the point if you'd like to save so that your choices are inconsequential. Dying and trying again as someone else is the gameplay loop. This game would be so boring without the threat of permadeath. I'm not even sure why you'd play it, honestly. You just really love doing jumping jacks and looting stuff you don't even need?

If it's an RPG, as this game appears to be, then yes, because that's how RPGs work. RPGs are about looting, leveling, base building and stuff like that. If this game is a hardcore survival game, then it should change it's systems to reflect that.

[Legion]

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

Danson の投稿を引用：

You're kinda missing the point if you'd like to save so that your choices are inconsequential. Dying and trying again as someone else is the gameplay loop. This game would be so boring without the threat of permadeath. I'm not even sure why you'd play it, honestly. You just really love doing jumping jacks and looting stuff you don't even need?

If it's an RPG, as this game appears to be, then yes, because that's how RPGs work. RPGs are about looting, leveling, base building and stuff like that. If this game is a hardcore survival game, then it should change it's systems to reflect that.

Change the systems how? By adding manually saving for handholding which goes against the spirit of being a hardcore survival?

[Legion]

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

Razorfish の投稿を引用：

it is good precisely because there is no save option...

with a save option , it just becomes another 2d game from the 90's

That is a very funny and telling take since it implies this playerbase basically has no faith in the game's mechanics other than permadeath lol.

Except the permadeath is part of the glue that holds the systems in place. Without the foundation of what this game is, which is permadeath, it's just every other game out there. I'm not quite sure you are making the argument you think you're making. The playerbase does have faith in these working systems, including and not limited to the permadeath that is the very foundation of the game.

You want handholding via save scumming. This game will not give that to you. You either need to learn how to play and adapt or move on to a game that is more your speed, because it's pretty clear that Zomboid is not for you. To be frank, that's plenty okay. Not every game is made for every player.

[ureaditwrong]

Armagenesis の投稿を引用：

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

If this game is not an RPG, then they should get rid of skill leveling, skill books, traits, pretty much all the RPG aspects and implement aspects from all those games you just mentioned, such as non-tank controls, common loot spawns, an FOV slider, god mode and, funnily enough, saves. They should also cut out the exaggerated RPG status effects such as injury from stepping on glass with shoes on, getting bored from sitting around for two seconds, getting tired of a CD after only listening to it once, etc. etc.

We both know they won't do this because we both know this game is 1000% an RPG at its core.


You can have the easiest settings on in sandbox but you will still be discouraged from trying out that rare M16 or trying to find that car you like when it could very well mean a permadeath for your character.

Guns blazing is def not an option when the game spawns two rounds every two blocks.

You need manual saves to set up in places that aren't sustainable, like the middle of Louisville. No one would do this because it's essentially a waste of time with permadeath. But with saves, you could just save and if you die or it gets destroyed, you can just revert and its still there.

Skill leveling and traits don't belong exclusively to RPGs. A lot of RPGs don't even have this game's form of skill leveling and trait system. Instead, simulation games do. This game is closer to The Sims with zombies than The Witcher or Dying Light if anything.

Being injured and having bleeding "status effect" aren't exclusive to RPGs either.

I've never seen an isometric and/or top-down games with FOV slider either. God mode and common loot exist in this game. And none of the games I mentioned have manual save feature. They all only save your progress when you exit the game and none of them allow save scumming other than you manually doing file manipulation.

If using firearms and refusing to go out because you might die when you do is your excuse, then you might as well never play a game that doesn't allow save scumming. If you want to go meta with this game, having multiple characters for cannon fodders is a viable method of playing. Your superhuman character with all level 10 skill can stay cowering inside their bedroom while the cannon fodders go do all the work and nothing is lost.

Every single tile in this game can be both sustainable and unsustainable base depending on what you are doing. Setting up a base in the middle of Louisville is difficult, but not unsustainable. Especially when you can literally stop zombies from spawning by walling off a neighborhood.

What simulation game has this skill system? I've never played the Sims but that game looks casual. I have played many realistic games though and most of them have no RPG mechanics at all. And even when they do, their systems are way more efficient than PZ.

Status effects in the way PZ does it are indeed exclusive to RPGs. Realistic games don't make you lacerated just for stepping on glass. They don't use percentage values to determine what injury you get or if you got infected. They don't make you bored and depressed over standing around for two seconds. None of that is realism.

Yeah, all that is available in sandbox mode, not the regular game, so why not just add a save feature there too?

The question was whether or not using firearms was a viable way to play. If the likelihood of death from using firearms is too great in a permadeath game, then it simply becomes an un-viable way to play, rendering a large part of the content moot. It's not really about "save-scumming" which implies it's about difficulty. It's about saving to keep your progress while seeing what guns have to offer, carefree. It's a matter of convenience, simply put.

Because your character has such a massive amount of needs brought on by arbitrary reasons, I'm gonna have to disagree. If nothing else, you will run out of entertainment and gas eventually and be railroaded into fighting hordes of zombies.

[ureaditwrong]

Nomadic の投稿を引用：

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

If it's an RPG, as this game appears to be, then yes, because that's how RPGs work. RPGs are about looting, leveling, base building and stuff like that. If this game is a hardcore survival game, then it should change it's systems to reflect that.

Change the systems how? By adding manually saving for handholding which goes against the spirit of being a hardcore survival?

Again, this game is clearly not a hardcore survival. It has way more RPG aspects than survival aspects.

[Heart 🎕]

MadDan の投稿を引用：

It's a permadeath game. Permadeath games never, or very rarely allow manual saves. It's not too hard to circumvent and backup your saves if you feel like it, but adding a save option just takes away from what the game is. Everyone would survive forever, there'd be no risk in doing anything because you'd just reload your save after dying. The game is about your eventual downfall and how you die. You explore because you get comfortable in your base, that's your incentive. See what's out there, what you can find (albeit, that'll be more refined once the game is feature complete). There's still lots of interesting areas and reasons to explore.

It does what most other permadeath games do: Save when you sleep/exit the game.

This.

[Legion]

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

Nomadic の投稿を引用：

Change the systems how? By adding manually saving for handholding which goes against the spirit of being a hardcore survival?

Again, this game is clearly not a hardcore survival. It has way more RPG aspects than survival aspects.

You really have no clue what you're talking about. Because everything that you claim isn't viable in Zomboid is viable in every way. You claim you essentially cannot do anything because manual saving isn't present in the game, yet any Zomboid vet will flat out tell you that you are wrong.

Except it clearly is a survival game, and a hardcore one at that even at base settings. You think because it has RPG elements that it invalidates anything else? It checks everything that all three of those genres require.

You've made it known that you don't have a competent argument to make. You will not receive the echo chamber you desperately crave. I'll take my nigh 858 hour expertise over your 57 hour amateur take.

[Puppers]

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

Yeah, all that is available in sandbox mode, not the regular game, so why not just add a save feature there too?

MadDan already gave a good explanation as to why there is no save feature in the game. Besides that skilljournal does its job as a mod and should stay as a mod only. Have you tried the mod?

In my little eyes what makes the replay value so is the risk vs reward. I just wouldn't have dunked 2800 hours into the game if I could save it. I wouldnt bother trying to do better my next playthrough or try different routes, etc. This game is easily one of my top 10 games of all times. I have played many survival games but there is something about this one that makes pz different from others and its mainly because of the permadeath. I want to be punished for any stupid mistake I make.

[ureaditwrong]

Nomadic の投稿を引用：

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

That is a very funny and telling take since it implies this playerbase basically has no faith in the game's mechanics other than permadeath lol.

Except the permadeath is part of the glue that holds the systems in place. Without the foundation of what this game is, which is permadeath, it's just every other game out there. I'm not quite sure you are making the argument you think you're making. The playerbase does have faith in these working systems, including and not limited to the permadeath that is the very foundation of the game.

You want handholding via save scumming. This game will not give that to you. You either need to learn how to play and adapt or move on to a game that is more your speed, because it's pretty clear that Zomboid is not for you. To be frank, that's plenty okay. Not every game is made for every player.

Why? Why does permadeath glue this game together? Without it, you would be encouraged to try out loads of different character builds. I've never tried to play the game seriously as a deaf, nor as a gunman, nor as a mechanic. It's too much time investment for what are un-viable builds. You're basically saying none of this variety matters without permadeath which implies the playerbase has no faith in this system as a standalone game. You say it will be generic. But I have faith. How many games allow you to play as a deaf? How many games have a map this large? How many games have a faithful modding community like this? Indeed it is the permadeath holding the game back imo.

You guys love to act like this game is some hyper realistic simulator and that this is a skill problem when that is very clearly false. It's not about scumming, it's about convenience. I'm surprised you guys allowed this game to have a sandbox at all lol.

[ureaditwrong]

Nomadic の投稿を引用：

ureaditwrong の投稿を引用：

Again, this game is clearly not a hardcore survival. It has way more RPG aspects than survival aspects.

You really have no clue what you're talking about. Because everything that you claim isn't viable in Zomboid is viable in every way. You claim you essentially cannot do anything because manual saving isn't present in the game, yet any Zomboid vet will flat out tell you that you are wrong.

Except it clearly is a survival game, and a hardcore one at that even at base settings. You think because it has RPG elements that it invalidates anything else? It checks everything that all three of those genres require.

You've made it known that you don't have a competent argument to make. You will not receive the echo chamber you desperately crave. I'll take my nigh 858 hour expertise over your 57 hour amateur take.

If you dumped some of those hours into other realistic games, you would easily realize that this is way closer to an RPG than simulation. What simulation has tank controls? What simulation has a draw distance of like 10 feet away (and LESS in a car lol)? What simulation forces you to miss M16 shots from 2 feet away? I could go on for literally hours.

Clearly PZ has an echo chamber of its own.