Leveling maintenance 0-1 B42

[Bowa]

How am I suppose to level up maintenance from 0-1 without any crafting receipts.

What is the best method in B42?

[Phade]

Originally posted by Morbs:

Originally posted by ★Rainmaker★:

Holy shih-tzu is there anything they DIDN'T nerf lmao.

Yeah that's why I am not happy with this update. B42 seems like the grind update where they just wanted to make it more annoying to level up or do anything in the game. I assume this is because they are going to add NPCs in the future so there's going to be less focus on maxing out all stats and instead more focus on specializing but considering that we don't currently have NPCs (and it'll likely be years before we do) and we also don't have multiplayer, the game just is needlessly grindy. Had they added NPCs first and then increased the grind, I'd be fine with it but rn, playing single player PZ just feels like a chore more than anything.

Its really not a chore. I haven't levelled up maintenence because you need actual weapons, but the fact is levelling up your weapon skills will be just as effective.

[dustbiter]

I'm playing a repairman that starts with maintenance 2, I can beat down a lot of zombies with poor weapons like plungers before they completely break.
Found a spade with nearly depleted condition in the trash, killed around 5-10 zombies with it before it broke, then I killed around at least another 30 zombies with the handle.
Used a hammer with perfect handle and low condition head for some zombie killing, condition is unchanged. Used a metal bat when I found a second one, it's also undamaged after some zombie killing.
Maintenance was only at 2, short blunt at 1-2, long blunt at 0. My point is the game's pretty easy at apocalypse with only the first few skill levels in weapons and maintenance. I estimate a player can go from 0 to 1 maintenance in about two weeks of low intensity zombie killing.

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by dustbiter:

I'm playing a repairman that starts with maintenance 2, I can beat down a lot of zombies with poor weapons like plungers before they completely break.
Found a spade with nearly depleted condition in the trash, killed around 5-10 zombies with it before it broke, then I killed around at least another 30 zombies with the handle.
Used a hammer with perfect handle and low condition head for some zombie killing, condition is unchanged. Used a metal bat when I found a second one, it's also undamaged after some zombie killing.
Maintenance was only at 2, short blunt at 1-2, long blunt at 0. My point is the game's pretty easy at apocalypse with only the first few skill levels in weapons and maintenance. I estimate a player can go from 0 to 1 maintenance in about two weeks of low intensity zombie killing.

Hm for me usually the handle also broke for cleavers and the like. I am guessing you use long handles?
I just hit maintenance 3 on day 8 or 9. Started with 1. Screwdriver, ratchet and wrench are my main weapons. If i find a cleaver that as well.

[dustbiter]

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

Originally posted by dustbiter:

I'm playing a repairman that starts with maintenance 2, I can beat down a lot of zombies with poor weapons like plungers before they completely break.
Found a spade with nearly depleted condition in the trash, killed around 5-10 zombies with it before it broke, then I killed around at least another 30 zombies with the handle.
Used a hammer with perfect handle and low condition head for some zombie killing, condition is unchanged. Used a metal bat when I found a second one, it's also undamaged after some zombie killing.
Maintenance was only at 2, short blunt at 1-2, long blunt at 0. My point is the game's pretty easy at apocalypse with only the first few skill levels in weapons and maintenance. I estimate a player can go from 0 to 1 maintenance in about two weeks of low intensity zombie killing.

Hm for me usually the handle also broke for cleavers and the like. I am guessing you use long handles?
I just hit maintenance 3 on day 8 or 9. Started with 1. Screwdriver, ratchet and wrench are my main weapons. If i find a cleaver that as well.

I was playing like B41 for some days, pull a zombie and push to stomp when possible, then I started using the junk weapons first to train skills. Also I was in Echo Creek which was pretty chill.

[a three-colored carp]

Originally posted by Morbs:

Originally posted by ★Rainmaker★:

Holy shih-tzu is there anything they DIDN'T nerf lmao.

They are going to add NPCs in the future so there's going to be less focus on maxing out all stats and instead more focus on specializing

I worry about this game design decision because it sounds painfully un-fun. There's nothing wrong with a character that's good at everything and forcing everyone to trade off 'oh I can catch a big fish which means I can't change the window of my car' is truly punishing.

[Ronin]

Originally posted by Morbs:

Originally posted by ★Rainmaker★:

Holy shih-tzu is there anything they DIDN'T nerf lmao.

Yeah that's why I am not happy with this update. B42 seems like the grind update where they just wanted to make it more annoying to level up or do anything in the game. I assume this is because they are going to add NPCs in the future so there's going to be less focus on maxing out all stats and instead more focus on specializing but considering that we don't currently have NPCs (and it'll likely be years before we do) and we also don't have multiplayer, the game just is needlessly grindy. Had they added NPCs first and then increased the grind, I'd be fine with it but rn, playing single player PZ just feels like a chore more than anything.

Why do you choose to ignore the sandbox settings? The game is sold as an apocalypse sandbox, the customisation is one of the main selling points. I've played Apocalypse mode once, didn't like it, felt too arcadey. Spent a while setting up a hardcore realistic sandbox, tweaked the settings over years and (until this update and learning new settings) I had the 'perfect' sandbox settings for myself. Anyone can do this. Willingly choosing to ignore the vast customisation options, willingly choosing to ignore the fact you can give yourself an exp boost of 5, 10, 50 or 100x and then complaining about how grindy you've chosen to make the game for yourself, is wild.

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by dustbiter:

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

Hm for me usually the handle also broke for cleavers and the like. I am guessing you use long handles?
I just hit maintenance 3 on day 8 or 9. Started with 1. Screwdriver, ratchet and wrench are my main weapons. If i find a cleaver that as well.

I was playing like B41 for some days, pull a zombie and push to stomp when possible, then I started using the junk weapons first to train skills. Also I was in Echo Creek which was pretty chill.

I know i tried out Echo creek too, is really chill and easily manageable. Only thing that annoyed me is i could not get into the upper part of the diner( i did not want to destroy the window:P).

Originally posted by Ronin:

Originally posted by Morbs:

Yeah that's why I am not happy with this update. B42 seems like the grind update where they just wanted to make it more annoying to level up or do anything in the game. I assume this is because they are going to add NPCs in the future so there's going to be less focus on maxing out all stats and instead more focus on specializing but considering that we don't currently have NPCs (and it'll likely be years before we do) and we also don't have multiplayer, the game just is needlessly grindy. Had they added NPCs first and then increased the grind, I'd be fine with it but rn, playing single player PZ just feels like a chore more than anything.

Why do you choose to ignore the sandbox settings? The game is sold as an apocalypse sandbox, the customisation is one of the main selling points. I've played Apocalypse mode once, didn't like it, felt too arcadey. Spent a while setting up a hardcore realistic sandbox, tweaked the settings over years and (until this update and learning new settings) I had the 'perfect' sandbox settings for myself. Anyone can do this. Willingly choosing to ignore the vast customisation options, willingly choosing to ignore the fact you can give yourself an exp boost of 5, 10, 50 or 100x and then complaining about how grindy you've chosen to make the game for yourself, is wild.

zombie spawn is currently bugged. Also it will requrie some time for folks to figure out what does what and it is entirely possible things will still be tweaked:)
But yes all can use the sandbox if they wish, however they can still complain about the default settings for the three default "games" if they feel things are off:)

[Zenopus]

Originally posted by Ronin:

Originally posted by Morbs:

Yeah that's why I am not happy with this update. B42 seems like the grind update where they just wanted to make it more annoying to level up or do anything in the game. I assume this is because they are going to add NPCs in the future so there's going to be less focus on maxing out all stats and instead more focus on specializing but considering that we don't currently have NPCs (and it'll likely be years before we do) and we also don't have multiplayer, the game just is needlessly grindy. Had they added NPCs first and then increased the grind, I'd be fine with it but rn, playing single player PZ just feels like a chore more than anything.

Why do you choose to ignore the sandbox settings? The game is sold as an apocalypse sandbox, the customisation is one of the main selling points. I've played Apocalypse mode once, didn't like it, felt too arcadey. Spent a while setting up a hardcore realistic sandbox, tweaked the settings over years and (until this update and learning new settings) I had the 'perfect' sandbox settings for myself. Anyone can do this. Willingly choosing to ignore the vast customisation options, willingly choosing to ignore the fact you can give yourself an exp boost of 5, 10, 50 or 100x and then complaining about how grindy you've chosen to make the game for yourself, is wild.

I'm aware that I can do that and typically play on sandbox settings. My point was that I felt the apocalypse game mode, which the developers want feedback on, felt off. I also can't change the aiming system or the other various changes to combat (other than combat fatigue which can be reduced). Basically, my point was that I didn't like the direction the game is going and was offering feedback because that is literally what the devs are asking for with an unstable build. Why you would not understand something like that is strange to me.

[djames666]

I see a bunch of "craft & actively maintain" weapons as the strategy for leveling Maintenance. However, I see it as a major hurdle to go from 0 to 1. Unless you hit RNG with getting an actual "weapon" to get xp, or go into major risks to get either a Carving or Gardening Fork, there are not a lot of opportunities to gain Maintenance xp. I have crafted a number of Wooden Spears and Stakes. All of them have had 2 condition and none of them have survived 2 strikes. The only way I've seen to *craft* a weapon without maintenance is to take your starting pistol and hunt down a deer, remember to pick up something sharp to field dress it. Then level carving once. Then carve a Knapping Tool from the antlers. Then use the Knapping Tool to make Crude Blades that can be used for maybe a stone spear or some sort of crude knife that has a chance to not break? My opinion is that too much is gate kept behind Lv 1 Miaintenance. (like a hammer that can also start Knapping, or a freaking axe)

[djames666]

Apparently I cannot edit my previous post. But to correct myself the only craftable weapons before Maintenance 1 are: Fire Hardened Spear (need a sharp implement and, I think, a fire source); a bone knife (still needs hunting something with that pistol); and a Crafted Spear made specifically with Duct Tape. Other crafted spears require levels of Maintenance.

[Loonessia]

Amateur coder here. Used to debug Hydrocraft.
Alright, here's the weird part:
I've been looking through some of the code, it looks like Crowbar wasn't specifically tagged as "NoMaintenanceXp" directly. I'll edit if I can trace how IS did it.
Edit: I probably can't because it's in the java code somewhere. While searching through Lua code I found this: https://i.imgur.com/q6CJxAV.png so someone smarter than me needs to decomp the java files to see what they're doing

Also to note, Golf Clubs are apparently not tagged as such, but a Chair leg with nails in it is?
Items specifically tagged are:
1 Handled - Bowling Pin, Bowling Pin - Nail Spiked, Broken Branch, Broken Branch with Nails, Brass Nameplate, Chair Leg, Chair Leg - Nails, Broken Hockey Stick, Flint Nodule, Griddle Pan, Handle, Handle with Nails, Iron Bar, Iron Rod, Iron Rod Half, Lead Pipe, Broken Long Handle, Broken Long Handle - Nails, Broken Long Stick, Metal Bar, Metal Pipe, Frying Pan, Broken Plank, Broken Plank - Nails, Plunger, Rolling Pin, Saucepan, Copper Saucepan, Steel Bar (+ half), Stone, Broken Table Leg, Broken Table Leg with Nails, Tree Branch, Stick, Broken Stick, Broken Stick W/ Nails

1 Handed Axes - Metal Pipe Railway Spike

2 Handed - Long Handle, Long Stick, Plank, Sapling, Table Leg,

2 Handed Axes - None

Heavy: Railroad Spike Puller

Long Blade: None

Spears: None

Stab/Knives: Pens, Bread Knife, Dull Bone Knife, Butter Knife, (Gold + Silver) , Fork (Gold + Silver + Bone), Letter Opener, Pencil, Railroad Spike, Scalpel, Spoon (Gold + Silver + Bone),



Based on the tagging so far especially for the 1 handed it's pretty nonsensical. I thought the whole point of this was to make it so that we're forced to make improvised weapons, but now we learn driving nails through things doesn't make it maintenance expable. What are they even attempting to do? I'd give them a few more unstables to explain this all or change some of this

[Silamon]

I was kinda surprised to see even making a stone hammer requires maintenance 1.

Seems a level in maint is *very* good in character building now.

[Alex]

Well, you could do, y'know, maintenance :)
Meaning, find ALOT of dull knives and a whetstone (cafe kitchens, etc or get a file from sheds if desperate) and sit comfortably. (Worn) knives cannot be sharpened though.

[D3st]

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

Originally posted by dustbiter:

I was playing like B41 for some days, pull a zombie and push to stomp when possible, then I started using the junk weapons first to train skills. Also I was in Echo Creek which was pretty chill.

I know i tried out Echo creek too, is really chill and easily manageable. Only thing that annoyed me is i could not get into the upper part of the diner( i did not want to destroy the window:P).

Originally posted by Ronin:

Why do you choose to ignore the sandbox settings? The game is sold as an apocalypse sandbox, the customisation is one of the main selling points. I've played Apocalypse mode once, didn't like it, felt too arcadey. Spent a while setting up a hardcore realistic sandbox, tweaked the settings over years and (until this update and learning new settings) I had the 'perfect' sandbox settings for myself. Anyone can do this. Willingly choosing to ignore the vast customisation options, willingly choosing to ignore the fact you can give yourself an exp boost of 5, 10, 50 or 100x and then complaining about how grindy you've chosen to make the game for yourself, is wild.

zombie spawn is currently bugged. Also it will requrie some time for folks to figure out what does what and it is entirely possible things will still be tweaked:)
But yes all can use the sandbox if they wish, however they can still complain about the default settings for the three default "games" if they feel things are off:)

Hi Nordil,i won't derail the post but i am curious about the zombie spawn bug you mention.Can you explain it please?

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by D3st:

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

I know i tried out Echo creek too, is really chill and easily manageable. Only thing that annoyed me is i could not get into the upper part of the diner( i did not want to destroy the window:P).




zombie spawn is currently bugged. Also it will requrie some time for folks to figure out what does what and it is entirely possible things will still be tweaked:)
But yes all can use the sandbox if they wish, however they can still complain about the default settings for the three default "games" if they feel things are off:)

Hi Nordil,i won't derail the post but i am curious about the zombie spawn bug you mention.Can you explain it please?

D3st it means that if you touch zombie population settings then whatever you do, the zombie number will increase instead of being adjusted to the selected population.
So even if you lower it say 0.5(just a random number), you will likely encounter more zombies than on base apoc settings. At least that is what i read in the Bug reports/Support. (cannot remember which but read multiple times there that there is currently a bug with this) So adjusting zombie pop is currently not an option. (I don't know if any other settings under the zombie settings are bugged, but it might be possible, or some other settings. Needs testing:D It is what we do:P) So currently telling folks to use sandbox to adjust zombie population is counterproductive:P

Loon:
Nice find. For the code without the getMaintenanceMod() function, and knowing what the getConditionLowerChance() function is we can only make educated guesses.
But i think the getConditionLowerChance() is tied to each individual weapon's chance to get into lower condition ah...whats it called...let us go with tag/variable for now. (soz just woke up)
The getConditionLowerChance() function is likely a way to make it calculate and the getMaintenanceMod() is likely based on your current maint modified. However the ==0 confuses me, as in so far seems only when it checks if the two together and it "exactly" 0 will the weapon degrade. Whereas it should entirely be possible to get a positive and negative value(or maybe not, but that can only be checked if we know the other two functions i mentioned). And one of those should also trigger the condition lowering.