Silent zombies

[Guybrush Threepwood]

From what I percieved so far about B42 Unstable, the game is taking a direction to be more challenging, hence muscle strain, loot tables, crafting requirements and the darkness at night, paired with the new lights.

And I think is the right dev direction, since is adding more depth to this already deep system.

The problem is that it could get pretty grindy, and this innovations dont really translate to action - killing zombies. Which is probably the most you gonna do.

To pair with some of the grindiness, I think it would be cool to have some zombie mechanics, like ones that cant really hear you, and you cant really hear them. They would be in the sitting down position, and would try to bite if the player stumbles on it.

The only queue the player would have is that it moves slightly.

It would prevent the effectivness of the "default" strategy that is to lure all of zombies outside the building, while making the action of clearing said building more engaging.

This zombies should be really rare, so you wouldnt have a bunch of them sitting down in towns.

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

.

To pair with some of the grindiness, I think it would be cool to have some zombie mechanics, like ones that cant really hear you, and you cant really hear them. They would be in the sitting down position, and would try to bite if the player stumbles on it.

zombie hearing can range from dead to pinpoint hearing.
same with sight, like really almost blind zombies, to eagle eyes. So not sure what you are asking that is not in the game:)
In B41 many times you could get attacked from behind by silent zombies, most found this very annoying.
And if you fight a number of them in the current version you might not be able to realize some of those moans come from behind your char, so again not sure what is really needed.
(Though i honestly cant tell if there are silent zombies or not in the current version since
i always take keen hearing.)

What you say about the grinding is correct.
Sadly most of the changes merely made the game more about grinding, and this can get quite tedious, especially since many of the new systems can actually synergize well in this regard. (I mean many of the new systems synergize so well that all they do is actually increase the grinding levels:D)

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

.

To pair with some of the grindiness, I think it would be cool to have some zombie mechanics, like ones that cant really hear you, and you cant really hear them. They would be in the sitting down position, and would try to bite if the player stumbles on it.

zombie hearing can range from dead to pinpoint hearing.
same with sight, like really almost blind zombies, to eagle eyes. So not sure what you are asking that is not in the game:)
In B41 many times you could get attacked from behind by silent zombies, most found this very annoying.
And if you fight a number of them in the current version you might not be able to realize some of those moans come from behind your char, so again not sure what is really needed.
(Though i honestly cant tell if there are silent zombies or not in the current version since
i always take keen hearing.)

What you say about the grinding is correct.
Sadly most of the changes merely made the game more about grinding, and this can get quite tedious, especially since many of the new systems can actually synergize well in this regard. (I mean many of the new systems synergize so well that all they do is actually increase the grinding levels:D)

As far as I can tell, you can hear all zombies in the game, and even those deaf zombies can still see you and be lured out of buildings in my experience.

I was suggesting something like a near death type of zombie that just sits and grabs if stumbled upon by the player, with a visual queue to recognize it instead of an audio one.

But my point overall is that if the goal is to make a more challenging zomboid experience, I would like to see more diversity in combat, with enviromnent at play and more types of zombies that fits.

[Chilli Dog Dave]

the pulling all zombies out of a building isnt even 100% foolproof because zombies only really spawn when you have vision into a room (even if you dont see as long as the camera LoS saw in they spawn) so you get instances of zombies in bathrooms and closets even if you have a car siren going off next to the building, kill them all THEN go inside.
theres a mod to fix it.
but back to the point dealing with zombies is ment to be hard they are the main threat, even if there dumb as rocks, until NPC's, bears, etc are officially in the undead are the apex hunter

[Armagenesis]

I mean, whether it's intentional or just a bug, it's already a thing right now.

I have been bitten twice by a zombie that was charging at me without making any noise. Not the groan, not even the footsteps.

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Originally posted by Chilli Dog Dave:

the pulling all zombies out of a building isnt even 100% foolproof because zombies only really spawn when you have vision into a room (even if you dont see as long as the camera LoS saw in they spawn) so you get instances of zombies in bathrooms and closets even if you have a car siren going off next to the building, kill them all THEN go inside.
theres a mod to fix it.
but back to the point dealing with zombies is ment to be hard they are the main threat, even if there dumb as rocks, until NPC's, bears, etc are officially in the undead are the apex hunter

Yes, I agree with you.

But at least in my playthroughs, there is a point that when they stop coming, and specially when you dont hear them in the building anymore, you think you are safe right?

Not with - SILENT ZOMBIES -

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Originally posted by Armagenesis:

I have been bitten twice by a zombie that was charging at me without making any noise. Not the groan, not even the footsteps.

That is strange, I have been able to hear every zombie behind me so far, even while fighting hordes.

Maybe thats just me being lucky, but if you didnt hear not even footsteps, then maybe bug.

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by Armagenesis:

I mean, whether it's intentional or just a bug, it's already a thing right now.

I have been bitten twice by a zombie that was charging at me without making any noise. Not the groan, not even the footsteps.

Yes is what i was referring to as the silent zombie from B41. I have not noticed or encountered any but that is due to keen hearing. Thanks for confirming that they are present in B42.

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

my blah blah

As far as I can tell, you can hear all zombies in the game, and even those deaf zombies can still see you and be lured out of buildings in my experience.

I was suggesting something like a near death type of zombie that just sits and grabs if stumbled upon by the player, with a visual queue to recognize it instead of an audio one.

But my point overall is that if the goal is to make a more challenging zomboid experience, I would like to see more diversity in combat, with enviromnent at play and more types of zombies that fits.

So let us differentiate a bit with hearing to be 100% we are on the same page.
There is the hearing system, which means you can hear zombies normally that are within an aboug 3.5 tile range. It extends to about 6 or 7 tiles if you have keen hearing.
This is the "notice or hear" the zombies.

There is also groan and moan, which you can "hear" as a player. The first one is just how the hearing system works, and the latter is the zombies making sounds that the player can pick up, and turn around or look around. ->I was under the impression you meant this, in regards to silent zombies. And ArmaG confirmed they are still in B42.

About the sitting zombies...i think you just never encountered the sudden death they can cause:)
They can also be completely silent, so if you turn around a corner it is completely possible to walk into them. And if they are already in the animation of "standing up" when you enter the tile they are on, you get an instant bite attack:) Which usually means an actualy instant bite/neck wound of which you die either fast or slowly due to infection. Very rarely you can survive this. If they are not standing up already, they can also do a lunge like attack which can get you on the ground.

I just think you never encountered these scenarios. I did in B41, and this behaviour likely is present in B42, and it is why i am taking turns around a corner while keeping a 3 tile distance of the corner. And if i walk on the northern or western side of the building also 3 tiles. Because it was harder to notice sitting zombies that sat down by these walls.

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

Originally posted by Chilli Dog Dave:

the pulling all zombies out of a building isnt even 100% foolproof because zombies only really spawn when you have vision into a room (even if you dont see as long as the camera LoS saw in they spawn) so you get instances of zombies in bathrooms and closets even if you have a car siren going off next to the building, kill them all THEN go inside.
theres a mod to fix it.
but back to the point dealing with zombies is ment to be hard they are the main threat, even if there dumb as rocks, until NPC's, bears, etc are officially in the undead are the apex hunter

Yes, I agree with you.

But at least in my playthroughs, there is a point that when they stop coming, and specially when you dont hear them in the building anymore, you think you are safe right?

Not with - SILENT ZOMBIES -

I answer to this separately. Usually you can encounter such silent zombies. Even worse if they are silent AND deaf:) They are usually on the higher floors. So it is entirely possible to run into them. It is because of them you should never assume that a building is safe.

Again i just think dear wannabe pirate from the monkey island, you did not run into them yet.

[Guybrush Threepwood]

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

I answer to this separately. Usually you can encounter such silent zombies. Even worse if they are silent AND deaf:) They are usually on the higher floors. So it is entirely possible to run into them. It is because of them you should never assume that a building is safe.

Again i just think dear wannabe pirate from the monkey island, you did not run into them yet.

But they are not also blind! I dont think I have ever encountered a sitting zombie inside a building if I remember correctly.

That would represent more of what im trying to convey, as in a near "dying" zombie you know?

Trying to keep zeds types "simple" so it doesnt fall in the cliches of zombie design can get kinda specific.

But im willing to admit I never noticed this silent ones.

But from what you are saying, they are still no quite what I suggested, even if its a bad suggestion lol.

Ahoy!

[Nordil(Hun)]

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

Originally posted by Nordil(Hun):

I answer to this separately. Usually you can encounter such silent zombies. Even worse if they are silent AND deaf:) They are usually on the higher floors. So it is entirely possible to run into them. It is because of them you should never assume that a building is safe.

Again i just think dear wannabe pirate from the monkey island, you did not run into them yet.

But they are not also blind! I dont think I have ever encountered a sitting zombie inside a building if I remember correctly.

That would represent more of what im trying to convey, as in a near "dying" zombie you know?

Trying to keep zeds types "simple" so it doesnt fall in the cliches of zombie design can get kinda specific.

But im willing to admit I never noticed this silent ones.

But from what you are saying, they are still no quite what I suggested, even if its a bad suggestion lol.

Ahoy!

Yep, sitting zombies dont occur in houses. Not sure about the "fake dead" zombies but i think they also dont happen in houses.
However those deaf and silent zombies i mentioned, you can run into blind ones as well, worse is when they are both deaf, blind and silent zombies. And you just found this house to be empty, psst-ed around did not encounter anyone, you did not have a flashlight and even your cat's eyes was not that good at revealing them...and then you just walk into their backs.:D (Happened to me twice, then i realized i should just use the outline trick:P)

Some of the things are harder to notice because and it is especially so in B42 the zombies are a bit more agressive, i think it is though usually to the terrible "leader" trait distribution. As in usually if a leader has either eagle eyes or pinpoint hearing, it will drag its whole group toward you. :) It might be possible that there is an issue with their trait distro hearing and sight wise.

You probably should elaborate a bit more on what you are thinking about, or provide a bit more exact examples. That way perhaps we could be a bit more constructive in the debate. (Instead of our current constant counterarguments:P)

[ultra]

You not encountered them much, just loot more houses, and walk around building very close to walls, and simply they arrive how you want :)
Ahh, and open more bathrooms too
Honestly they not too rare (41)
Keen hearing always with me

[[Censored]]

Originally posted by Guybrush Threepwood:

From what I percieved so far about B42 Unstable, the game is taking a direction to be more challenging, hence muscle strain, loot tables, crafting requirements and the darkness at night, paired with the new lights.

And I think is the right dev direction, since is adding more depth to this already deep system.

The problem is that it could get pretty grindy, and this innovations dont really translate to action - killing zombies. Which is probably the most you gonna do.

To pair with some of the grindiness, I think it would be cool to have some zombie mechanics, like ones that cant really hear you, and you cant really hear them. They would be in the sitting down position, and would try to bite if the player stumbles on it.

The only queue the player would have is that it moves slightly.

It would prevent the effectivness of the "default" strategy that is to lure all of zombies outside the building, while making the action of clearing said building more engaging.

This zombies should be really rare, so you wouldnt have a bunch of them sitting down in towns.

everything mentioned and be adjusted in the settings to make it how you want - you dont have to play on the default settings - there are perks that make things like the darkness not bad (cats eyes)

[Punknaught]

I think the heat seeking zombs are the worst right now, you can go around one building through another and into a 3rd, crouched , lightfooted, inconspicuous...go upstairs and hide in a room, and they will still find you no matter what and be waiting outside the door.