Error messages are useless

[Adler]

To say the least. They should tell you exactly what the conflict/problem is. I have 300+ mods and some of them are clearly broken because of conflicts with other mods, but I can't find out how to fix them because error messages that constantly pop up provide no information about the issue.

[Beard]

The error messages are saved in the console.txt file found in C:\Users\YourUserName\Zomboid

[Adler]

Originally posted by Beard:

The error messages are saved in the console.txt file found in C:\Users\YourUserName\Zomboid

The error messages should be displayed in-game, like literally every single other game out there.

[Ruin]

Originally posted by CEO:

Originally posted by Beard:

The error messages are saved in the console.txt file found in C:\Users\YourUserName\Zomboid

The error messages should be displayed in-game, like literally every single other game out there.

Ummm... No they don't... Every other game I've modded has never reported conflicts or errors during gameplay, and usually just crap themselves by crashing to desktop, and leave you scratching your head as to the cause, in my experience...

Some might have a mod manager which indicates a conflict in the load order, but that's it... They won't tell you much else...

Is it really so hard to check the error log immediately after seeing one?

[a123456]

Originally posted by Ruin:

Originally posted by CEO:

The error messages should be displayed in-game, like literally every single other game out there.

Ummm... No they don't... Every other game I've modded has never reported conflicts or errors during gameplay, and usually just crap themselves by crashing to desktop, and leave you scratching your head as to the cause, in my experience...

Some might have a mod manager which indicates a conflict in the load order, but that's it... They won't tell you much else...

Is it really so hard to check the error log immediately after seeing one?

actually, it does display error messages if you turned on debug mode.

[Ruin]

Originally posted by a123456:

Originally posted by Ruin:

Ummm... No they don't... Every other game I've modded has never reported conflicts or errors during gameplay, and usually just crap themselves by crashing to desktop, and leave you scratching your head as to the cause, in my experience...

Some might have a mod manager which indicates a conflict in the load order, but that's it... They won't tell you much else...

Is it really so hard to check the error log immediately after seeing one?

actually, it does display error messages if you turned on debug mode.

Hmmm... Well, there you go... I had no idea, and this would be the first game I've played that actually gives in-game reports like that...

I've always just looked at the error logs, personally...

[a123456]

Originally posted by Ruin:

Originally posted by a123456:

actually, it does display error messages if you turned on debug mode.

Hmmm... Well, there you go... I had no idea, and this would be the first game I've played that actually gives in-game reports like that...

I've always just looked at the error logs, personally...

well if you have that many mods in which they might have the same conflict to each other, it's going to be very hard to fix such problem, or almost impossible to resolve such issue.

[Ruin]

Originally posted by a123456:

Originally posted by Ruin:

Hmmm... Well, there you go... I had no idea, and this would be the first game I've played that actually gives in-game reports like that...

I've always just looked at the error logs, personally...

well if you have that many mods in which they might have the same conflict to each other, it's going to be very hard to fix such problem, or almost impossible to resolve such issue.

I'm not the OP, I was just pointing out that his claim that every other game gives in-game reports on errors was kinda BS and I've never played another game that does... Usually the first thing you know about a mod conflict is a CTD in my experience... PZ is surprisingly stable when it comes to mod conflicts, just chucking up error notices instead, allowing you to then stop and check the logs...

[a123456]

Originally posted by Ruin:

Originally posted by a123456:

well if you have that many mods in which they might have the same conflict to each other, it's going to be very hard to fix such problem, or almost impossible to resolve such issue.

I'm not the OP, I was just pointing out that his claim that every other game gives in-game reports on errors was kinda BS and I've never played another game that does... Usually the first thing you know about a mod conflict is a CTD in my experience... PZ is surprisingly stable when it comes to mod conflicts, just chucking up error notices instead, allowing you to then stop and check the logs...

I mean even if you can see the error messages, do you have the capability to fix them? like do you know Lua language?

it's a mission impossible from player side, so it doesn't really matter if they show it or not, just like the OP.

And the reason for you to feel the game stable is because most error messages were hidden behind the scene.

[Ruin]

Originally posted by a123456:

Originally posted by Ruin:

I'm not the OP, I was just pointing out that his claim that every other game gives in-game reports on errors was kinda BS and I've never played another game that does... Usually the first thing you know about a mod conflict is a CTD in my experience... PZ is surprisingly stable when it comes to mod conflicts, just chucking up error notices instead, allowing you to then stop and check the logs...

I mean even if you can see the error messages, do you have the capability to fix them? like do you know Lua language?

it's a mission impossible from player side, so it doesn't really matter if they show it or not, just like the OP.

And the reason for you to feel the game stable is because most error messages were hidden behind the scene.

I'm by no means an expert, but can piece enough Lua code together to identify obvious errors and conflicts... Enough to have been able to figure out conflicts on quite a few occasions when seeing the error popup appear, anyway...

As for fixing them, it usually boils down to one of three things...

1. Look for a compatibility patch
2. Swap the load order around
3. Decide which of the two mods you want more, and remove the one you want least, if the above two prove fruitless

And when I say the game is pretty stable, it's because it is... I very rarely, if ever, get CTD's, unlike other games when even running a handful of mods...

[Adler]

Originally posted by EnigmaGrey:

Oh boy, I've had some awful experiences with modding in other games. All of them certainly aren't clear about what's going on.

And just like it boggles my mind that people think we can somehow build a system that can parse and sort through 300+ mods, I'm sure it'd melt most developer's brains to be told it's actually their problem that someone chose to do that to their game. Like I get why people would do that, but it's basically going to a buffet and walking out with the entire serving counter then telling us it doesn't fit in your car and your stomach hurts? Some self-control and moderation is needed on your part — we can only, like, put up a sign (like the one already present when you open the mods screen).

For us, a lot of the problems seem to stem from those Mod Options and Mod Manager mods, which doesn't help matters. Modders should not be changing filenames at runtime after load or inserting special characters that might not play nice on certain OSes.

Letting players see verbose error messages in-game would be a great place to start.

[Death]

Originally posted by CEO:

Originally posted by EnigmaGrey:

Oh boy, I've had some awful experiences with modding in other games. All of them certainly aren't clear about what's going on.

And just like it boggles my mind that people think we can somehow build a system that can parse and sort through 300+ mods, I'm sure it'd melt most developer's brains to be told it's actually their problem that someone chose to do that to their game. Like I get why people would do that, but it's basically going to a buffet and walking out with the entire serving counter then telling us it doesn't fit in your car and your stomach hurts? Some self-control and moderation is needed on your part — we can only, like, put up a sign (like the one already present when you open the mods screen).

For us, a lot of the problems seem to stem from those Mod Options and Mod Manager mods, which doesn't help matters. Modders should not be changing filenames at runtime after load or inserting special characters that might not play nice on certain OSes.

Letting players see verbose error messages in-game would be a great place to start.

Or you could not use 300+ mods and then complain that ♥♥♥♥ is messed up. Or you could just look at the damn logs that it already creates. Having error messages with long strings of ♥♥♥♥ in game seems kind of stupid from the average players perspective. The fact is that there are already multiple ways for you find out what you need to know to the point that making it appear in game is pointless.

[Greb]

The error logs are a pain to read, definitely. However, you can quite literally make a thread and ask for help with an issue you are having and a dev will most likely show up and ask you to post a crash log for them to look at and troubleshoot for you.

Even though I reckon 99% of the time it's a mod problem and a not a vanilla game engine problem which means it's usually a waste of their time

[Adler]

Originally posted by Death:

Originally posted by CEO:

Letting players see verbose error messages in-game would be a great place to start.

Or you could not use 300+ mods and then complain that ♥♥♥♥ is messed up. Or you could just look at the damn logs that it already creates. Having error messages with long strings of ♥♥♥♥ in game seems kind of stupid from the average players perspective. The fact is that there are already multiple ways for you find out what you need to know to the point that making it appear in game is pointless.

Or they could just make it convenient for players to view error messages and you could stop fanboying and trying to justify the devs' laziness.

[Ruin]

Originally posted by CEO:

Originally posted by Death:

Or you could not use 300+ mods and then complain that ♥♥♥♥ is messed up. Or you could just look at the damn logs that it already creates. Having error messages with long strings of ♥♥♥♥ in game seems kind of stupid from the average players perspective. The fact is that there are already multiple ways for you find out what you need to know to the point that making it appear in game is pointless.

Or they could just make it convenient for players to view error messages and you could stop fanboying and trying to justify the devs' laziness.

Or you could just stop being so lazy and just read the error logs... Modding has always been a case of User Beware, so if you wanna run 300+ mods, you should be able to read an error log and fix the conflicts yourself...

But hey, apparently preferring the devs spend their time actually adding new game features, rather than catering to your laziness (because the errors would not be there were you not running over 300 mods) is "fanboying" now, apparently... Go figure...

[Adler]

Originally posted by Ruin:

Originally posted by CEO:

Or they could just make it convenient for players to view error messages and you could stop fanboying and trying to justify the devs' laziness.

Or you could just stop being so lazy and just read the error logs... Modding has always been a case of User Beware, so if you wanna run 300+ mods, you should be able to read an error log and fix the conflicts yourself...

But hey, apparently preferring the devs spend their time actually adding new game features, rather than catering to your laziness (because the errors would not be there were you not running over 300 mods) is "fanboying" now, apparently... Go figure...

There's nothing wrong with the devs adding more QoL features to the game, but if you feel like opening 100 folders every time you need to read an error message, go ahead. The rest of us will keep asking them to make it more convenient.