Max resilience and I still get one shotted by sniper rifles in PvP!!!

[Duukar]

Is this a joke? Why is the even in the game????? Four out of six players I fight in the crucible is able to pull out a sniper rifle and one shot me from incredible range. Why bother playing a Titan? Why bother maxing out resilience?

What a joke.

Fix this straight away.

[Forrest Gimp]

A bit unrelated question, but still curious, do different classes and builds have different melee damage (discounting stuff like Monte Carlo)? Most Titan hits seem to OHK on full hp, while Hunters less so, and Warlocks almost never. Even with Fissure, delayed explosion rarely kills target with full hp. That seems odd.

And yes, agree with poster above, slower TTK usually raises skill ceiling, and in general, more fun IMO.

[luxon001]

Origineel geplaatst door Sundr:

A bit unrelated question, but still curious, do different classes and builds have different melee damage (discounting stuff like Monte Carlo)? Most Titan hits seem to OHK on full hp, while Hunters less so, and Warlocks almost never. Even with Fissure, delayed explosion rarely kills target with full hp. That seems odd.

And yes, agree with poster above, slower TTK usually raises skill ceiling, and in general, more fun IMO.

Most titans in pvp still use bottom tree striker, though its ult isnt as op anymore they still have their knockout perk, which gives them higher melee range and damage (and is procced pretty much all the time), any sort of damage increase makes it a one hit kill

[Anti Homeless Rock]

Origineel geplaatst door Sundr:

And yes, agree with poster above, slower TTK usually raises skill ceiling, and in general, more fun IMO.

I'm not all too sure most of the player base wants to go back to Year 1 ttk values, where very few things were under a 1 second optimal ttk

[Ryze]

I completely agree. But yes, its sad... half the ♥♥♥♥ in the game doesnt mean anything and probably doesn't do anything. :/

[Sidewinder]

Origineel geplaatst door Sundr:

slower TTK usually raises skill ceiling

Don't get me wrong but coming from Rainbow Six Siege which has INSANELY low TTK (as in less than 0.25 of a second for a vast majority of the guns), I never understood that sentiment.
Even my friends who play CS:GO find longer TTK to be annoying as ♥♥♥♥ and one headshot kills to be better.
To me it seems the problem with that in D2 would be bullet magnetism (I can get why its there in PVE but not PVP) and crappy hitboxes (and these suck quite a lot) instead.

Edit: I mean I am aware that these are vastly different genres and the only thing in common is that they're all FPS games but I've heard similar stuff said by Battlefield players (BF5 and the complaints that its TTK is too short) and even CoD players (again, Modern Warfare supposedly has too short of a TTK) and yet, both are beaten in popularity by R6S (don't look at the Steam stats as that's only half of the community, there's a lot of people on just Uplay too, probably even more than on Steam) and CSGO in both regular numbers of players AND esports (name anything that isn't DOTA 2 or LOL that's more popular than CSGO, go ahead).

[TheVoidSpirit]

Origineel geplaatst door 2PLY:

What Light Level is your gear? Light Level is also maybe more important than maxing stats as you're gearing up.

Say you have max Res but only like 900~920 Light Level vs players at 960+? You're gonna be tore to shreds regardless of your stats (and do next to no dmg back to them).
Atleast from what I understand it's a big factor, but not much of a pvper.

There is no Light Level advantage in regular Crucible.

[76561197988918266]

Origineel geplaatst door Splort:

The issue is the TTK from basically hunters hunters and more hunters often blows through your defense a little to quickly..

Ironic.

Hunters are the only ones who do not have a damage boost. (titans and warlocks are the ones who can get that 1.2x damage boost to bodyshot with arbalest...etc.)

[Floppy]

Origineel geplaatst door BOKU Haram:

Origineel geplaatst door Splort:

The issue is the TTK from basically hunters hunters and more hunters often blows through your defense a little to quickly..

Ironic.

Hunters are the only ones who do not have a damage boost. (titans and warlocks are the ones who can get that 1.2x damage boost to bodyshot with arbalest...etc.)

Titans need to proc a perk for the dmg boost or use ward of dawn, warlocks can get the dmg boost a lot more reliably via stag and emp rift.

[76561197988918266]

Origineel geplaatst door Floppy:

Origineel geplaatst door BOKU Haram:

Ironic.

Hunters are the only ones who do not have a damage boost. (titans and warlocks are the ones who can get that 1.2x damage boost to bodyshot with arbalest...etc.)

Titans need to proc a perk for the dmg boost or use ward of dawn, warlocks can get the dmg boost a lot more reliably via stag and emp rift.

Titans can get it by just sliding over ammobox(no cooldown as far as I know), or just shouldercharge. (let's ignore sunspots because that's a lot more setup/random)

So yes, Warlocks do get it on-demand but there's at least a bit of cooldown, and it requires one to be sitting in a small area.
Titans pretty much always can get one after a kill(or friendly kill).

[Forrest Gimp]

Origineel geplaatst door Sidewinder:

Origineel geplaatst door Sundr:

slower TTK usually raises skill ceiling

Don't get me wrong but coming from Rainbow Six Siege which has INSANELY low TTK (as in less than 0.25 of a second for a vast majority of the guns), I never understood that sentiment.
Even my friends who play CS:GO find longer TTK to be annoying as ♥♥♥♥ and one headshot kills to be better.
To me it seems the problem with that in D2 would be bullet magnetism (I can get why its there in PVE but not PVP) and crappy hitboxes (and these suck quite a lot) instead.

Edit: I mean I am aware that these are vastly different genres and the only thing in common is that they're all FPS games but I've heard similar stuff said by Battlefield players (BF5 and the complaints that its TTK is too short) and even CoD players (again, Modern Warfare supposedly has too short of a TTK) and yet, both are beaten in popularity by R6S (don't look at the Steam stats as that's only half of the community, there's a lot of people on just Uplay too, probably even more than on Steam) and CSGO in both regular numbers of players AND esports (name anything that isn't DOTA 2 or LOL that's more popular than CSGO, go ahead).

Had an argument with buddy of mine on that subject a while ago. Few of my favorite mp games are Red Orchestra and Insurgence. They have short TTK (I bet even less than Siege) and he said it is more skilled that way, but in fact it isn't, because even if you can't aim, you can get kills on target simply because it would be a game of who shot first.

Several arena shooters of old, say UT, had higher TTK, and even if you get shot first, with enough movement and aiming skill you could pretty much always win 1on1. It's widely not the case in games with short TTK. And to be absolutely clear, it's not necessary in all genres. In realistic shooters it would be awkward otherwise, but D2 falls very hard under arena shooter category, and Bungo made TTK that way (with all the supers and powerful stuff) so newbies could get kills too and not feel bad about losing to better players constantly. Probably intent was to tilt game mode to casual, but it never works like that, another design flaw right there...

[Epicsurvivor]

Origineel geplaatst door Splort:

Is this a joke? Why is the even in the game????? Four out of six players I fight in the crucible is able to pull out a sniper rifle and one shot me from incredible range. Why bother playing a Titan? Why bother maxing out resilience?

What a joke.

Fix this straight away.

Resilience is a joke in destiny 2 to be honest, if it wouldve been able to stop 1 hits from snipers the crucible wouldve been pure hell for any ordinary gun like a side arm or SMG

[Floppy]

Origineel geplaatst door BOKU Haram:

Origineel geplaatst door Floppy:

Titans need to proc a perk for the dmg boost or use ward of dawn, warlocks can get the dmg boost a lot more reliably via stag and emp rift.

Titans can get it by just sliding over ammobox(no cooldown as far as I know), or just shouldercharge. (let's ignore sunspots because that's a lot more setup/random)

So yes, Warlocks do get it on-demand but there's at least a bit of cooldown, and it requires one to be sitting in a small area.
Titans pretty much always can get one after a kill(or friendly kill).

Inertia override requires a special ammo drop + only lasts for 2-3 seconds, its great but hard to plan around for mid fight and what shoulder charge gives a dmg boost? I dont remember any of them doing so.

[Prostate Puncher]

Resilience is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and you're ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ if you don't know how to approach a fight properly. Stop charging in the open.

[Floppy]

Origineel geplaatst door Prostate Puncher:

Resilience is ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ and you're ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ if you don't know how to approach a fight properly. Stop charging in the open.

Resilience has its uses, but its not useful past 4 or 5 except against a handful of guns and situations.

[Sidewinder]

Origineel geplaatst door Sundr:

Origineel geplaatst door Sidewinder:

Don't get me wrong but coming from Rainbow Six Siege which has INSANELY low TTK (as in less than 0.25 of a second for a vast majority of the guns), I never understood that sentiment.
Even my friends who play CS:GO find longer TTK to be annoying as ♥♥♥♥ and one headshot kills to be better.
To me it seems the problem with that in D2 would be bullet magnetism (I can get why its there in PVE but not PVP) and crappy hitboxes (and these suck quite a lot) instead.

Edit: I mean I am aware that these are vastly different genres and the only thing in common is that they're all FPS games but I've heard similar stuff said by Battlefield players (BF5 and the complaints that its TTK is too short) and even CoD players (again, Modern Warfare supposedly has too short of a TTK) and yet, both are beaten in popularity by R6S (don't look at the Steam stats as that's only half of the community, there's a lot of people on just Uplay too, probably even more than on Steam) and CSGO in both regular numbers of players AND esports (name anything that isn't DOTA 2 or LOL that's more popular than CSGO, go ahead).

Had an argument with buddy of mine on that subject a while ago. Few of my favorite mp games are Red Orchestra and Insurgence. They have short TTK (I bet even less than Siege) and he said it is more skilled that way, but in fact it isn't, because even if you can't aim, you can get kills on target simply because it would be a game of who shot first.

Several arena shooters of old, say UT, had higher TTK, and even if you get shot first, with enough movement and aiming skill you could pretty much always win 1on1. It's widely not the case in games with short TTK. And to be absolutely clear, it's not necessary in all genres. In realistic shooters it would be awkward otherwise, but D2 falls very hard under arena shooter category, and Bungo made TTK that way (with all the supers and powerful stuff) so newbies could get kills too and not feel bad about losing to better players constantly. Probably intent was to tilt game mode to casual, but it never works like that, another design flaw right there...

I've thought about it a lot recently and came to some conclusions really.

I wouldn't say that having a low TTK makes a game less skill based. I'd say the skills simply differ than say, Destiny or CoD and here's why.
Yes, you do lose a lot of battles depending on who shot first, but that's where the different set of skills come in. In say, CoD (it's better of an example because Destiny has a distinct issue of being an MMO-like game with vastly imbalanced equipment, while CoD strives for balance between many of its weapons, even if it fails in that regard) the skill comes from being able to aim and position yourself better than your enemy. For Destiny character skills are also important and knowing how and when to use them is essential. Same goes for say, Quake, Overwatch and many, MANY of the other games.
On the other hand, you've got CSGO and R6S which require a different skill from you. Namely high accuracy combined with quick reaction time. You still need to control the gun you use (hence why say, Scorpion used by the Polish defence operator Ela in Siege isn't popular even on PC) but to a lesser degree since even weaker guns can kill you in 4-5 hits (which at ROF between 600-1100 can be either a lot or very little) or 1 headshot, so sometimes you just neeed that lucky hit. Siege does have character specific skills (equipment more specifically) to use, but those are besides the point.
And then the realistic games that require an even different set of skills.
All in all, I would argue that quick TTK doesn't mean "less skill" but that it rewards people with faster reaction times and better eye-hand coordination more, which doesn't seem to be the target audience of Destiny.

Edit: Oh, one more thing I want to mention. Siege has this funny way to balance things, where the defenders are able to use the area they spawn in to their advantage by reinforcing walls, placing traps, etc. which is balanced out by having "weaker" guns and therefore they should lose most of the time in a 1v1 standofs. This isn't always the case, depending on many other aspects such as positioning, possible defensive points, etc.
In fact I have a recording of me being shot at, surviving that because the other guy couldn't control his gun, then positioning myself so I could see literally just a couple of pixels of his head and then killing him via headshot. In that same match (different round) another enemy surprised me by firing through a hole in the wall. He missed all his shots and I managed to hide behind cover and return fire at him killing him instantly. So no, it's not always "whoever shot first wins".

Also, as a side note and as a trivia, I happen to know one of the ex-top 100 CSGO players in Poland (I honestly do not remember what spot was he at exactly, top 50, top 5, top 20, no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ idea, my memory fails me at this) and he wrecks in almost any and all FPS games he plays. Granted a pro Quake player would wreck him in Quake I presume he'd still be better off than say, a pro Destiny player would be in Quake. Or how he'd be better at Battlefield than a pro-BF player would be in CSGO. Why do I think that? Because I've seen him shoot. His recoil control, his aim and reaction times. It's all superior (edit from this point) so while he'd have to learn the skills of each character/class (depending on the game) and map designs (and possibly guns), going the opposite way you've got to learn not just the map design but also improve your reaction times, accuracy AND learn the guns.
But that's just my opinion.

Thank you for your honest and sincere reply mate. I wish you the best.