A quick thought on badwater source

[JCHamels]

Badwater source is always on. Meaning you can exploit it for endless hydro power for cheap. As it makes windmills, engines and batteries obsolete.

IMO there needs to be some kind of balance. How about, high concentration of badwater would erode the water wheel thus reducing efficiency of water wheels in badwater. Or completely destroy the water wheel over time making you have to rebuild it every so often.

[QueenPixxa]

This is not a bad idea at all. Or they could make special waterwheels that cost a lot more (made of metal or something even more expensive to create a bit of an obstacle).

[JCHamels]

Originally posted by QueenPixxa:

This is not a bad idea at all. Or they could make special waterwheels that cost a lot more (made of metal or something even more expensive to create a bit of an obstacle).

Yes! That would work to for an endgame goal. Because right now it is just too easy to exploit easy power for low cost resources.

[brown29knight]

Originally posted by QueenPixxa:

This is not a bad idea at all. Or they could make special waterwheels that cost a lot more (made of metal or something even more expensive to create a bit of an obstacle).

This would make sense, since badwater pumps require metal.

[QueenPixxa]

It would be even better to have a different resource for things that can be corroded, like titanium.
Titanium is "present in igneous rocks and the sediments derived from them", that's what google tells me.
It also tells me that "Pure titanium does not rust or tarnish like iron metals, allowing for prolonged exposure to water without the worry. In addition, titanium is even fully resistant against the corrosion effects of saltwater", which seems perfect. Well, I'm pretty sure that it would be a safe bet against badwater.
We already have the mining system in place, so nothing drastically new would need to be added.

[Swat__Raptor]

I noticed that water dumps have the option of dumping bad water. Currently no use but maybe bad water only agriculture could be interesting.

[Metadigital]

Seems like badwater already has drawbacks and this use gives you something in return for having to deal with it.

[Firephoenixx456]

I've had the though of occasionally having droughts apply to badwater sources.

[Darganis]

Why is this a problem? It helps to have a reliable power source in the early game and rush the materials needed to deal with badtides. After that I still need windmills for the most power-consuming buildings.
Before this update, the first droughts froze progression, forcing me to do nothing until they ended. That wasn't hard, just boring

[brown29knight]

Originally posted by Darganis:

Why is this a problem? It helps to have a reliable power source in the early game and rush the materials needed to deal with badtides. After that I still need windmills for the most power-consuming buildings.
Before this update, the first droughts froze progression, forcing me to do nothing until they ended. That wasn't hard, just boring

I'm getting 12k power at all times with waterwheels on badwater sources only. And that's just me diverting the badwater off the map, not creating large aqueducts to allow for extra wheels.

So while I agree with you about it making the early game easier, it also snowballs into massive late game power if properly harnessed. At that point, it is pretty excessive in how much it helps.

[Wakko]

Originally posted by JCHamels:

Originally posted by QueenPixxa:

This is not a bad idea at all. Or they could make special waterwheels that cost a lot more (made of metal or something even more expensive to create a bit of an obstacle).

Yes! That would work to for an endgame goal. Because right now it is just too easy to exploit easy power for low cost resources.

They could combine both ideas:
Badwater will deteriorate the condition of the water wheel, reducing efficiency, until it gets destroyed and remains in a broken state, doing nothing.
A new "maintenance" checkbox will be added to each water wheel. If checked, builders will go to the water wheel with logs and repair it. The maintenance checkbox can also be used to repair broken water wheels. They should add an HP bar to each water wheel, so we'll know if it's worth checking the maintenance checkbox.
The water wheel's HP shouldn't go down too fast, because we don't want our builders occupied 24/7 around the water wheels while building nothing.
This is for both the wheels that are constantly in badwater, and the ones that are in clean water, only occasionally in badwater during that season.

Then, they could also add a special, expensive water wheel that do not deteriorate.
With this idea, water wheel in badwater will produce a lot of energy, but drain a lot (but not too much) logs, and occasionally occupy a builder.
We would also have to build platforms around our normal water wheels so our builders could repair them from a safe location above the badwater, and if not? They'll have to jump into the badwater.

[Swat__Raptor]

Originally posted by brown29knight:

Originally posted by Darganis:

Why is this a problem? It helps to have a reliable power source in the early game and rush the materials needed to deal with badtides. After that I still need windmills for the most power-consuming buildings.
Before this update, the first droughts froze progression, forcing me to do nothing until they ended. That wasn't hard, just boring

I'm getting 12k power at all times with waterwheels on badwater sources only. And that's just me diverting the badwater off the map, not creating large aqueducts to allow for extra wheels.

So while I agree with you about it making the early game easier, it also snowballs into massive late game power if properly harnessed. At that point, it is pretty excessive in how much it helps.

Its very much not in line with the previous power economy

Water wheels require flow which was inconsistant and had to be built where there is water flow. It's also dependant on season.

Windmills could be built anywhere but didn't work for parts of days to also required advanced resources.

Furnaces could work all the time but required fuel, so much that you needed a extra Forester or two to keep them supplied.

Gravity batteries could store power and balance out the weaknesses of water wheels and windmills. They require iron blocks

The manual beaver wheel could give you consistent power but requires labor and doesn't give you very much power.

Putting a water wheel down stream of a bad water source has no inherent downsides and in return gives you a good amount of baseline power.

[Alcator]

Guys, stop opening Experimental Branch threads in the main discussion forum!

[Flamegear]

Badwater definitely needs to be able to damage wooden structures in some way (if that's not too hard to code), or at least not allow water wheels to be built in it. I'd be very sceptical that infinite, cheap, easy energy from early game was intended in this way.

Originally posted by QueenPixxa:

This is not a bad idea at all. Or they could make special waterwheels that cost a lot more (made of metal or something even more expensive to create a bit of an obstacle).

This should be implemented, but only for the Iron Teeth. Meanwhile, Folktails should get a late game way to cleanse or purify the badwater that Iron Teeth don't get. Badwater provides a good way to split/differentiate the two factions in their Late-End Game goals.

[Naryar]

I agree that is IS free power for just a bit of wood (aka : infinite, easily accessible resource) almost nothing, but I disagree on it making engines and windmills obsolete.

Badwater flows are limited by the map, and making long power chains is tedious and takes some precious space away. Power doesn't transmit very well vertically either. In that case, engines and windmills are better for getting power to a remote or inaccessible corner of the map.