New Waker Class

[omfgboom1]

So i am taken back at how awful the new class preview looks. it seems they took all the things i loved about the summoner class in pso2 and threw it down the drain to a weird clunky picture of a summon when using abilities might as well be a mage class take away the summons appearing rapidly over and over and thats all it is. not really understanding why it got changed from pso2 dont think anyone was asking for them to ruin the class.

[DLOZanma]

Originally posted by Prokaizer:

Originally posted by Rogue:

Why even whine before trying out the class?.... lol. It's called waker, not summoner after all and it's something new to play. Have to git gud and learn to evade boss damage instead of pet swapping to tank everything from far far away.

For me , it's just the 9th class to level to max. On my main and possibly on my alt.

If the animations had something like dragons / dark wolf or insert what ever cool animal i would like the class.
But a bird a monkey and a baloon?
I don't have to play a class to do not like it.
I prefer to use Houndooom, Charizard, Nidoking etc., than to use Mr. Mime, Hypno, Skarmory.

What an idiotic complaint. You're aware that the "baloon" is Maron from the base game right? THE most used pet in the game? And that the others were a cartoony dragon, two furries, a fairy bookworm waifu and a freaking female poodle? And the rappy. This is not even mentioning Pietro's entire character. NGS pets are way "edgier". You did not ever even SEEN a summoner and it shows.

[VanillaLucia]

For those who wanted far more up-to-date statistics (Global no longer has this page due to their website changing and not keeping old pages intact), there is this link[pso2.jp] that shows survey results during Phantasy Star Online 2's 9th Anniversary Web Panel event.

I do distinctly remember Global's statistics were far too skewed (there was something obnoxious like 40-60% Hunters which likely were obviously bots).

Originally posted by CatCloud:

People facetanked as a Summoner? lol, they have a nice dodge! why bother face tanking when the Pet has auto attack and you can just glide around evading ♥♥♥♥ :lunar2020thinkingtiger: :rfacepalm:

When you have Marron paired with Alter Ego Harmony the only way a Summoner can die is that they weren't a very good Summoner or that they intentionally tried to die. It's absolutely obnoxiously silly (videos were shared in another thread) what a well-built Summoner is capable of.

[Prokaizer]

Originally posted by DLOZanma:

Originally posted by Prokaizer:

If the animations had something like dragons / dark wolf or insert what ever cool animal i would like the class.
But a bird a monkey and a baloon?
I don't have to play a class to do not like it.
I prefer to use Houndooom, Charizard, Nidoking etc., than to use Mr. Mime, Hypno, Skarmory.

You did not ever even SEEN a summoner and it shows.

I mean you are right, i've never seen a summoner.

https://ibb.co/PCRTGzp

[VanillaLucia]

Originally posted by Prokaizer:

I mean you are right, i've never seen a summoner.

https://ibb.co/PCRTGzp

Do you mean that maybe people wanted a fantasy-esque class that tames and commands beasts/pets in combat that don't look like cute Pokemon knockoffs? (an obligatory "/s" here too, no hostility intended)

Part of the Summoner's gameplay that really put me off was the fact that their gameplay often times was so unintuitive as your character often times stood safely at a distance (and in the case of Episode 5 and onwards with complete safety/invulnerability) and waves their Takt around as the pet either automatically fights for you or has no visible kinds of tells of what you should and shouldn't be doing.

I was hoping for something "more" like Dark Blasts with the variety of the movesets the four forms have shown in the past - but what we were shown looks like even a watered-down version of that as well like as if Sega really didn't want to make this class stand out well.

[Fafnir]

Originally posted by omfgboom1:

So i am taken back at how awful the new class preview looks. it seems they took all the things i loved about the summoner class in pso2 and threw it down the drain to a weird clunky picture of a summon when using abilities might as well be a mage class take away the summons appearing rapidly over and over and thats all it is. not really understanding why it got changed from pso2 dont think anyone was asking for them to ruin the class.

Could you explain what you loved about the Summoner class in Pso2? Only Summoners I ever saw were the level 100 Summoner/55 Fighter bots letting their auto-attack ring do all the work while they afk'd. You could see groups of them in the party list all day long.

Seemed like a broken, clunky, and exploitable mess to me.

[DLOZanma]

Originally posted by Prokaizer:

Originally posted by DLOZanma:

You did not ever even SEEN a summoner and it shows.

I mean you are right, i've never seen a summoner.

https://ibb.co/PCRTGzp

Why make such a dumb post earlier then? If you bothered to level it to 100 you know your previous post is complete bull.

[omfgboom1]

Originally posted by Fafnir:

Originally posted by omfgboom1:

So i am taken back at how awful the new class preview looks. it seems they took all the things i loved about the summoner class in pso2 and threw it down the drain to a weird clunky picture of a summon when using abilities might as well be a mage class take away the summons appearing rapidly over and over and thats all it is. not really understanding why it got changed from pso2 dont think anyone was asking for them to ruin the class.

Could you explain what you loved about the Summoner class in Pso2? Only Summoners I ever saw were the level 100 Summoner/55 Fighter bots letting their auto-attack ring do all the work while they afk'd. You could see groups of them in the party list all day long.

Seemed like a broken, clunky, and exploitable mess to me.

How people choose to play is their own business so the afk groups i could really care less about, but for me a summoner is a pet class not a mage with pet animations. i tend to play summon classes in every game i play whether it be hunter, summoner, necromancer, etc. So this game originally having a summon class (and the end game classes) is what drew me to the game and kept me playing. Ive been waiting for summoner to come to NG so i can enjoy what i loved about pso2 and obviously that is not going to happen now. There were many things they could have changed to change the class instead of what i feel making entirely not a summoning class.

[Kue]

Summoner in base PSO2 - Puppeteer style class in combat: You manage your pet from distance (Or not if you're using Redran), Pet has it's own healthbar and every action is done from distance, either attack, or AoEs, countering PAs or comboing at a distance. Meanwhile you use support techs to keep your Pet's buffs when he asks for them and heals.

Waker in NGS - Caster with diferent ranges and gimmicks probably, your Pet's phase in and out of existence when attacking - that implies they don't have a hitbox, can't aggro for you or recieve buffs.

So yeah, on the combat side of things Summoner and Waker are entirely different, they didn't need to change this if they wanted to simpify the class.

The things you gotta change are:
I mained Summoner until Luster came out, played since the Global version launched and I can safely say: Yes, Summoner was flawled, but not because of Summoner's design, but by SEGA's negligence in creating a good , ongoing progression system and giving Summoner up to date Harmonizers and buffs.

From Ep4 to EP6 we didn't have no new harmonizer that challenged the current meta: Rykkross Staff from Ep4, our Pet Eggs were capped at 14 stars and Candies were hell to find if you ever missed some seasonal UQs.

If one part of the class design doesn't work, change it. If Sega doesn't want to deal with candies, eggs and all that fiasco again ? Sure, remove it. But keep the friggin' combat gameplay intact ! Just like classic old Sega - some part of the design didn't work ? Scrap ALL of it then.

And as for classs appeal, popularity, complexity:

Face it people, when Hero was launched in EP5 every class was obsolete but Hero, and just Scion classes were popular after Hero.

"B-but as Summoner you just stand there and left click and dodge to win !!!" - Well, as Luster you can do that too with Smart PA. Or you could just use Hero with TMG and left-click your way thru victory only worrying about dodging. Or you can cheese Phantom Rod and become literally invincible while casting over and over again.

You like to deminish Summoner being lazy, boring or too safe/too simple, but in EP6 all classes except Summoner got a Life Stealing weapon FOR FREE on global so - - Who had it easy ? I'll tell you who - Everyone. Stop pretending PSO2 and NGS are some sweatlord DMC-Bayonetta complex action game: All classes have cheese strats for great DPS, all classes end up busted or forgotten and the game was braindead easy up until the last update versus the optional content like Masquerade or Ultimate TPD.

You think Sega will do such a great great work with Waker for some reason. Have you not seen the state of NGS as a whole ?
Waker will be or weak asf at launch or broken so much the meta will change for a while. But wheter it's one or the other, the class will be the same old same old NGS pastiche formula of classes without much of an identity. You'll do the same as ever: Counter and 1 PA for optimal damage.

[Fafnir]

Originally posted by omfgboom1:

How people choose to play is their own business so the afk groups i could really care less about, but for me a summoner is a pet class not a mage with pet animations. i tend to play summon classes in every game i play whether it be hunter, summoner, necromancer, etc. So this game originally having a summon class (and the end game classes) is what drew me to the game and kept me playing. Ive been waiting for summoner to come to NG so i can enjoy what i loved about pso2 and obviously that is not going to happen now. There were many things they could have changed to change the class instead of what i feel making entirely not a summoning class.

Okay, what I'm getting from this is that you loved Summoner because it was a Summoner and because you always play Summoner classes that's why you loved Summoner.

So because Waker isn't a Summoner as you define Summoner you aren't happy.

Alright, sure, understood.

[女王ルナ]

NGS is a insult to PSO2, PSU, PSO1.
NGS was a mistake, their trash new Engine is a mistake.
the name change for summoner.... is idiotic as hell lol
wonder what theyre going to butcher Luster with . . . and Phantom if they release those as new classes.
i like how each class feels butchered, a husk of what they used to be
(( except for FI, that class is god tier in NGS ill admit that ))
New GU noises, are insanely annoying and ugly ASF.... i miss the old GU noises. . .

NGS is just hot garbo, its a shame because the game HAS / HAD insane potential but yeahhhh "SEGA". . .

[k-ricks]

i'am glad that i don't have to deal with feeding ,candying don't have to lost 100 storage space for those eggs and candies so waker is better than su to me

[L-laine]

Originally posted by Gilver Redgrave:

Originally posted by Nope:

♥♥♥♥ the base summoner lol, there is a reason why it's the least liked class, even for many top tier summoner main, across both server

Techter is the least liked class. I believe thats still the case in NGS.

Think it's not well liked cause sega doesn't do enough for Talis and also wand to a certain extent. Talis needs a big boost (skills/attacks/some gimmick) but it's been pretty much ignored since the beginning of the game. Techter over all isn't a hated class it's weapons just need more work.

[ronelm2000]

Originally posted by Peri:

Summoner in base PSO2 - Puppeteer style class in combat: You manage your pet from distance (Or not if you're using Redran), Pet has it's own healthbar and every action is done from distance, either attack, or AoEs, countering PAs or comboing at a distance. Meanwhile you use support techs to keep your Pet's buffs when he asks for them and heals.

Waker in NGS - Caster with diferent ranges and gimmicks probably, your Pet's phase in and out of existence when attacking - that implies they don't have a hitbox, can't aggro for you or recieve buffs.

So yeah, on the combat side of things Summoner and Waker are entirely different, they didn't need to change this if they wanted to simpify the class.

The things you gotta change are:
I mained Summoner until Luster came out, played since the Global version launched and I can safely say: Yes, Summoner was flawled, but not because of Summoner's design, but by SEGA's negligence in creating a good , ongoing progression system and giving Summoner up to date Harmonizers and buffs.

No it was bad. The entire system basically had a life of its own so not only couldn't you use any weapon augments, most of your progression was tied to your pets.

Not to mention the mere fact that the game isn't designed for having a Pet in general.

Originally posted by Peri:

Face it people, when Hero was launched in EP5 every class was obsolete but Hero, and just Scion classes were popular after Hero.

"B-but as Summoner you just stand there and left click and dodge to win !!!" - Well, as Luster you can do that too with Smart PA. Or you could just use Hero with TMG and left-click your way thru victory only worrying about dodging. Or you can cheese Phantom Rod and become literally invincible while casting over and over again.

You like to deminish Summoner being lazy, boring or too safe/too simple, but in EP6 all classes except Summoner got a Life Stealing weapon FOR FREE on global so - - Who had it easy ? I'll tell you who - Everyone. Stop pretending PSO2 and NGS are some sweatlord DMC-Bayonetta complex action game: All classes have cheese strats for great DPS, all classes end up busted or forgotten and the game was braindead easy up until the last update versus the optional content like Masquerade or Ultimate TPD.

So you're saying because base was bad and had power creep they should repeat the same mistake again in NGS?

[Gilver Redgrave]

Originally posted by L-laine:

Think it's not well liked cause sega doesn't do enough for Talis and also wand to a certain extent. Talis needs a big boost (skills/attacks/some gimmick) but it's been pretty much ignored since the beginning of the game. Techter over all isn't a hated class it's weapons just need more work.

Trust me Talis is not the problem it wasnt even a viable weapon in base game.

The problem with Techter is this:

Base PSO2:
Worst solo gameplay unless you go Techter/Luster. You do no damage and you need ages for monsters others kill in 3 minutes.You are pure Support and some people dont like being the so called "B*tch for everyone."

NGS:
Still the same solo issues however no Luster compensating for it. The Support gameplay from base is mostly gone aswell because the skills aint there (yet) and Restasign make you less relevant as a healer. And that Force shares the AoE Resta heal with Techter isnt helping .And people that never liked Support in base wont like it now.

So yeah the Support Role that made Techter fun was mostly taken away with NGS.

[Kue]

Originally posted by ronelm2000:

Originally posted by Peri:

Summoner in base PSO2 - Puppeteer style class in combat: You manage your pet from distance (Or not if you're using Redran), Pet has it's own healthbar and every action is done from distance, either attack, or AoEs, countering PAs or comboing at a distance. Meanwhile you use support techs to keep your Pet's buffs when he asks for them and heals.

Waker in NGS - Caster with diferent ranges and gimmicks probably, your Pet's phase in and out of existence when attacking - that implies they don't have a hitbox, can't aggro for you or recieve buffs.

So yeah, on the combat side of things Summoner and Waker are entirely different, they didn't need to change this if they wanted to simpify the class.

The things you gotta change are:
I mained Summoner until Luster came out, played since the Global version launched and I can safely say: Yes, Summoner was flawled, but not because of Summoner's design, but by SEGA's negligence in creating a good , ongoing progression system and giving Summoner up to date Harmonizers and buffs.

No it was bad. The entire system basically had a life of its own so not only couldn't you use any weapon augments, most of your progression was tied to your pets.

Not to mention the mere fact that the game isn't designed for having a Pet in general.

Originally posted by Peri:

Face it people, when Hero was launched in EP5 every class was obsolete but Hero, and just Scion classes were popular after Hero.

"B-but as Summoner you just stand there and left click and dodge to win !!!" - Well, as Luster you can do that too with Smart PA. Or you could just use Hero with TMG and left-click your way thru victory only worrying about dodging. Or you can cheese Phantom Rod and become literally invincible while casting over and over again.

You like to deminish Summoner being lazy, boring or too safe/too simple, but in EP6 all classes except Summoner got a Life Stealing weapon FOR FREE on global so - - Who had it easy ? I'll tell you who - Everyone. Stop pretending PSO2 and NGS are some sweatlord DMC-Bayonetta complex action game: All classes have cheese strats for great DPS, all classes end up busted or forgotten and the game was braindead easy up until the last update versus the optional content like Masquerade or Ultimate TPD.

So you're saying because base was bad and had power creep they should repeat the same mistake again in NGS?

First, having a diferent progression system does not make a class idea be bad. Summoner/Fighter was pretty popular in EP4 in JP when it was introduced. I already told you what the problem was, read.


And second "So you're saying because base was bad and had power creep they should repeat the same mistake again in NGS?" I'm not even saying that, read again.