Missions should have a "abort mission" option.

[PsychoBush]

I was doing a "find the 3 parts of the substract" kind of mission when I realized that mission couldn't be completed because I couldn't find any of the objectives in the lootboxes avaliable. It seems all the 3 parts where in lootboxes inside a gold area part of the map (acessible only with gold cards). I am guessing it's bug. That's ok. But what was really frustrating is that I couldn't even just fail the mission and leave with all that I've looted so far because extraction point don't pop up if I don't complete the any parcial objetives.

So, I guess, for missions where players find impossobile to complete, it should have an option to abort it at any time, it doesn't make much sense the other way around.

[Trese Brothers]

Thanks for the suggestion. We've gone back and forth on how to offer this option for a while. We agree it's needed but not sure on the specifics.

Depending on difficulty, you can always "Restore Before Mission".

The most player -friendlt but also consequence free would be to allow you to abort from the pause menu and just go home with a loss, your licks and whatever you've got.

The other more complicated option is to enable a "abort extraction" exit that you could enable.

Probably the former is best, we just haven't pulled the trigger.

[davea]

There are two other observations here. First, I feel the objectives should be reachable, instead of in an inaccessible room. Second, ""several"" players have observed that in a heist, you would know where your exits are. In some cases late-arriving news could cause one exit to be inaccessible; this is a good surprise which is used in several scripted missions. But in general, I feel "an" exit should always be available.

[PsychoBush]

Originally posted by davea:

There are two other observations here. First, I feel the objectives should be reachable, instead of in an inaccessible room. Second, ""several"" players have observed that in a heist, you would know where your exits are. In some cases late-arriving news could cause one exit to be inaccessible; this is a good surprise which is used in several scripted missions. But in general, I feel "an" exit should always be available.

It does make sense, in a heist, know since from the start where the exit will be.

On the topic on how to implement an abort mission, I think it should be with regular extraction. No news there. Just that, if a mission don't give you extract points till you complete the objective, an "abort mission" option would automatically make objetives unreachable and give the player an exit point rigth away.

[davea]

Originally posted by PsychoBush:

an "abort mission" option would automatically make objetives unreachable and give the player an exit point rigth away.

That's a great alternative.

[Jeffreyac]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

Thanks for the suggestion. We've gone back and forth on how to offer this option for a while. We agree it's needed but not sure on the specifics.

Depending on difficulty, you can always "Restore Before Mission".

The most player -friendlt but also consequence free would be to allow you to abort from the pause menu and just go home with a loss, your licks and whatever you've got.

The other more complicated option is to enable a "abort extraction" exit that you could enable.

Probably the former is best, we just haven't pulled the trigger.

Probably more work for you, but I actually like the abort extraction exit better... still have to get to an abort point to abort the mission, can't just magically teleport out.

[Trese Brothers]

Yes, it is a huge amount of work D:

It is the reason we haven't added it quickly. We may still end up at the "Abort" button in the pause menu but keep looking for some way to make the extraction zone possible. But given that there are 32 ways to play the latest map, we'd have to cook up 32 possible ways to extract on abort.

It's cool but it's a rare thing players are encountering, so we have to balance that out.

[Jeffreyac]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

Yes, it is a huge amount of work D:

It is the reason we haven't added it quickly. We may still end up at the "Abort" button in the pause menu but keep looking for some way to make the extraction zone possible. But given that there are 32 ways to play the latest map, we'd have to cook up 32 possible ways to extract on abort.

It's cool but it's a rare thing players are encountering, so we have to balance that out.

Fair enough

I trust you all - you've earned it!

Could you simplify the math and just activate the entry point used as the emergency evac route on an abort? Might be a balance - it'd be somewhat less punishing for players, as presumably they'd come from there so going back might be doable, and you wouldn't have to create a new random exit generator, or whatever developer magic you do on those things... :)

(I realize it's still a lot of work though, and understand you've got to balance these things!)

[Trese Brothers]

Yes, this one is a huge cost of the "cool" versus the need for a basic feature that will be rarely used.

For now, anyone having an issue with needing an Abort should simply hit ESC and then pick "Restore Before Mission" to return to the Safehouse the minute before you left.

This doesn't allow you to take the loss you may want for its consequences but it is something.

[davea]

It doesn't seem like "fun gameplay" to go into a mission and not have any idea where the exit will be.

[Trese Brothers]

Originally posted by davea:

It doesn't seem like "fun gameplay" to go into a mission and not have any idea where the exit will be.

Thanks for the ""feedback!

We'll "keep working" on improving.

Definitely work to do on extraction points =P

[PsychoBush]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

Yes, this one is a huge cost of the "cool" versus the need for a basic feature that will be rarely used.

For now, anyone having an issue with needing an Abort should simply hit ESC and then pick "Restore Before Mission" to return to the Safehouse the minute before you left.

This doesn't allow you to take the loss you may want for its consequences but it is something.

Ok. I understand what you saying but that wouldn't work with a ironman gameplay. Do you guys have any plan on adding that as difficulty settings, like it had in Star Traders?

[Trese Brothers]

That is a difficulty setting, save mode allows you to enable or disable auto-saves like "Restore before Mission".

Agreed, the workaround doesn't work for Ironman.

[Zarquon]

Originally posted by davea:

It doesn't seem like "fun gameplay" to go into a mission and not have any idea where the exit will be.

i like not knowing where the exit is. It adds to the thinking on the fly where you can try to plan but chaos always ensues, where you have to make the most of a bad situation.
For me it would be that that bit more boring if there were less surprises.

Perhaps a compromise would be a "scout map" feature before entering the map, where you gain extra knowledge of the location of things but have to pay a price. Either reduction in rewards (payment for doing the scouting), upfront cost, or starting at a higher escalation level, as the AI is already slightly alerted.

[davea]

I have trouble picturing the team sitting at home working on the plan. Somebody asks, "how do we get out?" and the answer is "we don't know where the doors are". As I mentioned I am ok with an alert during the mission that the original door is blocked and there needs to be a backup plan. Currently the door magically appears after we loot the first item.

[PsychoBush]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

That is a difficulty setting, save mode allows you to enable or disable auto-saves like "Restore before Mission".

Agreed, the workaround doesn't work for Ironman.

So... if you playing on doing later a Ironman mode, an abort mission is a must. I think the way this game is developing, an Ironman mode would play really well.