Could I Get Tips on Second Mission/Octane Request Mission

[BurntFaceMan]

Hello - I'm new to the game and still trying to work out whether to keep trying to play now - or to wait until the game is more fleshed out - I figure I want to dive in and give it a go now, despite the empty corners, but I'm feeling really stuck on working out how to approach the second mission.

I get part of the idea/fun of a tactics game is to figure out how to approach every situation, but I feel totally stumped how the game expects me to approach the room full of people that the objective is located in.

For complete context I'm trying to learn to do the mission in only 12 turns - seeing as realistically this is the second mission a new player will ever encounter, and thus it gives the impression that these secondary objectives are realistically achievable for a new player.

I just feel flummoxed by the complexity of the problems presented in this mission vs the first one, without any continued tutorial to hint at how to approach such a situation.

1) Is the idea that the mission is supposed to go loud inevitably, so I clear out as many relevant guards in stealth, then I just start spamming grenades into the room and bum rush it?

2) Is there some stealthier way to get to the objective?

At first due to typical stealth game design, I assumed there'd be some way to lure the guards out of the room via the mission design - so I figured maybe the hacker is supposed to use the console to somehow grab the objective from outside the room or something - but I've explored that and nothing of the sort.

I also tried on one run to use 15m radius lure to just pull the whole group out of the room - but then that's not conductive to finishing the mission in 12 turns either, seeing as it takes them all ages to clear out of the room, and then they all patrol in a huge area.

Is there something I'm missing, or is the idea simply to sneak up quickly whilst preparing an exit route and then bum rush the room before fleeing, to get it done in 12 turns?

[Trese Brothers]

In most heist missions, a pure stealth approach will eventually turn into a gunfight unless you've built a team explicitly for it and you have a lot of extra time to take it slow. It is possible to draw them out of that fortified room in Haven Smokeout but would definitely not be possible within the secondary objective.

You can go full blasting from turn one (consider a Sniper). My preference is, as you stated, a rapid series of stealth kills followed by a full-throated loud assault in the central room.

If you'd like really specific advice,


I would recommend picking one of the two entrances - between the big crates in the left or over the broken wall on the far right. Easiest to keep the team together. Rush full speed the first turn. Delay if needed until the guard in your side turns away and sprint into the outskirts/cover of your chosen path. May need to use Lure or another distraction.

Proceed quickly , taking first kills by stealth with blade or multiple mercs with silenced pistols (to be sure, as one volley may not do it).

You should be able to reach the start of the hallway with the big room without really being detected.

If you're going for the 12 Turns, you've moved quickly up to here. You've left some enemies behind you. At this point, trying to slow walk the approach to the room is going to cost too many turns or force your fighting retreat to be a messy rush instead of having the turns to safely tactically withdraw.

Start with grenades, Slashslide if you have a sword, save your Knight's Tactical Surge (left side talent, train it before the mission) for this turn. You should be able to pretty solidly smash the captains in the room. End the turn with Overwatch with your Soldier (which you can use even with 0 AP!)

Next turn, risk someone tough like the Knight to rush into the room, grab the case and retreat.

Now fight your way out.

[BurntFaceMan]

Thank you for the very detailed rundown - I get a bit OCD with these sorts of things and like it when games tell me how things are supposed to be done before I start getting creative with exploring different approaches - your reply was exactly what I needed.

Congratulations on having another great and complex game on the go - you guys make really cool stuff.

How long is the current content of the game expect to last btw?

Been a bit miffed by some of the stuff I've run into - like how the legwork option to look into the CK device immediately leads to a WIP prompt - IMO remove the option to do that legwork until that branch is somewhat ready, as it feels bizarre to run into a "you've reached the end of this path" message after a single action.

I'm not really fussed with how long the current story content is, more interested how long the gameplay mechanics allow the player to feel a sense of progression in levelling/equipment/base progression.

[Trese Brothers]

Glad it was helpful!

The current content should run about 20-30 hours and then you can play as long as you like with proc-gen missions.

The current level cap is 25. You can get a pretty high powered team.

Sorry the dead-end legworks miffed, it's not a great look and something we're working to wrap up. The rest is the storyline is complete, so it's those specific legwork branches. Our preference is to leave clear sign posts when content is paused or waiting to reduce confusion.

[BurntFaceMan]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

Glad it was helpful!

The current content should run about 20-30 hours and then you can play as long as you like with proc-gen missions.

The current level cap is 25. You can get a pretty high powered team.

Sorry the dead-end legworks miffed, it's not a great look and something we're working to wrap up. The rest is the storyline is complete, so it's those specific legwork branches. Our preference is to leave clear sign posts when content is paused or waiting to reduce confusion.

Thanks again - started a new run and this time around I got a quick level up for everyone by doing the other available mission first - then was able to steam roll the mission fairly easy (ended up killing everyone and getting out in 11 turns - I think my biggest downfall before was trying to hack the terminal for bonus loot whilst also trying to get the 12 turn clear).

[Trese Brothers]

That makes sense. The more extra loot or extra secondary objectives (like killing the Wireghost) you try to pack on, the harder the ones that you can't really win until the end (Turn count especially) get. Maybe you spent an extra Turn chasing the target in turn 3 that cost you at the end.

The extra level definitely helps!

[BurntFaceMan]

Originally posted by Trese Brothers:

That makes sense. The more extra loot or extra secondary objectives (like killing the Wireghost) you try to pack on, the harder the ones that you can't really win until the end (Turn count especially) get. Maybe you spent an extra Turn chasing the target in turn 3 that cost you at the end.

The extra level definitely helps!

one thing I would say is that currently the secondary objectives feel out of balance with the potential value of just ignoring them - specifically time and sec level based ones (basically the same thing just ones a soft limit and the other is hard).

This is a shame because it feels fun to have challenge objectives that offer great rewards.

In general it'd be great if contacts and thus the contracts/jobs they offer came with desirable terms (secondary objectives that offer really favourable incentives, the real bulk of the mission rewards) and necessary terms (the primary objective - the thing that has to be done, even if you end up making a mess of getting it done, the bare minimum you're obliged).

That way you create a gameplay loop that gives the player incentive to chase a more high octane style of gameplay that's about ultimately building specialist teams in order to do high quality executions of challenging contracts for clients who like things on particular terms (e.g. this guy always gives access to preemo guns if you do the job without a body being logged/seen - or this lady pays triple for contracts done with no kills.)

This pulls the game away from a loop that seems to want the economically focused player to slog through the entirety of each map checking off every source of finance/loot, and just making generalist teams that can do everything on every map.

When I see a huge map with loot crates in every corner I'm left with the dread of the countless minutes/hours of life lost to movement and enemy turn sequences.

It's great when you have a sense that there's actually an incentive to not do that - that loot is more something to plan into a route, rather than routing through all the loot.

Like the first time I encountered a mission where it was just my hacker in front of a terminal - that was a RUSH.

Thus having contacts that offer particular mission types, and then tends towards giving particular desirable terms on their contracts - you create a long term gameplay loop where a player can say "This playthrough I want to specialise in elite small team pacifist contracts, so I'll focus my early game on building a few highly geared vanguards"

or "I feel like lots of loud tactical combat, so this playthrough I'll get in with the gang warlords that favour causing a scene before leaving a job - I'll have to get some loyal soldiers who don't mind the stress of mass killing."

etc.

[Trese Brothers]

Skip/fast-forward enemy turns is coming soon, so hopefully we can reduce some of that dread.

Offering objectives that lay out more extreme on the spectrum sounds interesting.

We've been working on adding the code for kill counts ("Sends message and kill at least 15").

Thanks for playing and the valuable feedback!

[Dr. Spendlove]

I see you decided to not tell this player about the third entrance that goes through a loot room... I guess it is a pretty hard approach though.

[Trese Brothers]

With the emphasis on making the 12 Turn objective, I focused on a simpler approach.

[Trese Brothers]

Copied over from Discord where a veteran player was sharing their 7 Turn run on Smokeout as they learn the ropes with Agent EX and no Vanguard.

"It has taken a few tries but I'm finally getting a feel for Agent Ex. Just completed a fun Haven Smokeout.

Turn 1: Tactical Surge lets the Knight move around to the right and take out the first guard while Hacker and Agent advance as far as they can.
Turn 2: Knight and Agent take out second guard and the camera while Hacker advances to the Matrix Host
Turn 3: Agent drops White Noise into the office so no one hears the Knight and Agent climbing through the wall to the lockbox on the left, while the Hacker begins cleaning out the Matrix
Turn 4: Agent empties the lockbox, then Knight and Agent fire through the laser fence to take out the Wireghost, while Hacker continues in the Matrix.
Turn 5: All the guards start gathering outside the laser fence; Knight tosses a grenade and shoots to kill a couple; Agent glitches through the wall into the now-empty office, empties the lockbox, and grabs the Q-Endpoint; Hacker finishes in the Matrix and starts heading to the third lockbox
Turn 6: Knight uses Tactical Surge then climbs back through the wall; Agent exits the office; Hacker empties the third lockbox; everyone gathers out front while the guards run around in panic
Turn 7: team evacs"