This concede rule is terrible. Actively takes away from enjoying the game.

[stinkbug]

You can be down more points than there are rounds left and you aren't allowed to leave. I am banned for 2 days and have never left a competitive match.

God forbid I don't want to spend upwards of 10 minutes doing nothing and watching my players be murdered and injured by someone who is holding the ball hostage since they're already up more than enough.

I understand that the devs don't want people quitting constantly but completely removing the option to end a match early is not the right solution. There are too many mathematically impossible to come back from situations; coupled with how long each round takes to actually end.

People play video games to have fun, it is boring and stressful to have to wait so long for no reason especially when your players are having the crap beat out of them in the meantime.

Every game I've quit I've been down 2 with about 4 rounds left. That is 16 minutes of round total round time, you can be extremely generous and say it would work out to be 10 actual minutes to get through those rounds but that is still ridiculous.

I was having a really good time on this game but this inability to leave a game that has already ended, and getting banned for not wasting my time waiting on the game to end anyways has been a big hit to enjoying it.

[Cathaidan]

Again, the penalty should be the same as a concede in the rulebook.

Winning team gets all SPP earned in the game so far. Winning teams gets the earnings of both teams. Winning teams gets both teams' MVP SPP. Done.

Especially with how lopsided the die roller is in most games. I am yet to play a game where, by the end of Turn 4, we don't already know who the dieroller is favoring and is going to hand the win. And I do mean the die roller.

I've played too many games where my opponent is throwing their 12th 1 die block of the game, and getting their 5th AV 9+ armour break of the turn. Sometimes, it is me that is getting the armour breaks on every other roll. Sometimes, it is my opponent. But either way, once a team is cleared off the pitch that badly, the game is over.

[VoodooMike]

Originally posted by Kriegshammer:

If it's technically possible, the team could be locked in the game and run by a bad AI, so the conceding player can leave and know their team could be destroyed (if they care at all), at least the staying coach could finish their game.

Anything is "technically" possible, but a lot of things (like the idea of having AI take over) are really bad ideas and should not be pursued. Remember that concession can also happen due to technical difficulties, which means you could have permanent team damage as a result of a power or internet outage, or simple connectivity issues with Cyanide's servers. Also, people who want to play against the AI have always had that choice - folks who play multiplayer do so specifically because they do NOT want to play the atrocious AI that BB3 has.

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Again, the penalty should be the same as a concede in the rulebook.

Winning team gets all SPP earned in the game so far. Winning teams gets the earnings of both teams. Winning teams gets both teams' MVP SPP. Done.

Well, which is it? Should it be the same as in the rulebook, or what you declare it should be in the subsequent paragraph?

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Especially with how lopsided the die roller is in most games. I am yet to play a game where, by the end of Turn 4, we don't already know who the dieroller is favoring and is going to hand the win. And I do mean the die roller.

Ohh, you're one of the "special" people. Nevermind.

[dark-thomy]

I wouldn't want players to be punished for conceding, but I'd like incentive to play half the match at least too.
Would be nice I think.

[grumplekins]

Originally posted by stinkbug:

You can be down more points than there are rounds left and you aren't allowed to leave. I am banned for 2 days and have never left a competitive match.

God forbid I don't want to spend upwards of 10 minutes doing nothing and watching my players be murdered and injured by someone who is holding the ball hostage since they're already up more than enough.

I understand that the devs don't want people quitting constantly but completely removing the option to end a match early is not the right solution. There are too many mathematically impossible to come back from situations; coupled with how long each round takes to actually end.

People play video games to have fun, it is boring and stressful to have to wait so long for no reason especially when your players are having the crap beat out of them in the meantime.

Every game I've quit I've been down 2 with about 4 rounds left. That is 16 minutes of round total round time, you can be extremely generous and say it would work out to be 10 actual minutes to get through those rounds but that is still ridiculous.

I was having a really good time on this game but this inability to leave a game that has already ended, and getting banned for not wasting my time waiting on the game to end anyways has been a big hit to enjoying it.

Thanks, you've done a wonderful job of succinctly voicing the precise attitude that keeps people from learning how to play this game well!

[grumplekins]

Originally posted by Eyesight:

Nah , that not an option and it would be way to easily abusable , the AI is so bad that you can pretty much grind any player you want against it so you will be rewarded way better for a concession than a regular match and that probably was an issue in BB2 to , reason for they did remove double spp.

I think having your opponent player leaving the team would probably resolve that issue or you pull something like any injury you did get during that match are remove and they don't get any spp at all like you didn't do any match really.

The only approach that works is banning people who concede excessively from the competitive ladders. Excessively = all the reasons mentioned in this thread and others related to in-game stuff. Child's head on fire is legit.

[Splinter]

The concede rules are way more generous than they were in BB2. If you left more than 5 games you were banned for the whole season.

[Cathaidan]

Originally posted by grumplekins:

The only approach that works is banning people who concede excessively from the competitive ladders. Excessively = all the reasons mentioned in this thread and others related to in-game stuff. Child's head on fire is legit.

Yeah! Exactly! That's why conceding in BB3 is the same as it is in Table Top... Hey... Wait a minute... You almost had me, there.

[grumplekins]

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Originally posted by grumplekins:

The only approach that works is banning people who concede excessively from the competitive ladders. Excessively = all the reasons mentioned in this thread and others related to in-game stuff. Child's head on fire is legit.

Yeah! Exactly! That's why conceding in BB3 is the same as it is in Table Top... Hey... Wait a minute... You almost had me, there.

Conceding in TT is better. You can at least apologise in person and make it mean something. Not having a chat makes it worse.

I'm fine with people conceding if that's stated as an accepted norm within the specific ladder. I'd be happy to have all the conceders play in a casual ladder like before.

I think they just need a non-competitive ladder where people who think this is an rpg can play and concede until the cows come home. Banning should only be from the competivtive ladder.

[Cathaidan]

Originally posted by VoodooMike:

Well, which is it? Should it be the same as in the rulebook, or what you declare it should be in the subsequent paragraph?

Those are the rules from the rule book... Reading is hard, man. You have to like... Read.

[Cathaidan]

Originally posted by grumplekins:

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Yeah! Exactly! That's why conceding in BB3 is the same as it is in Table Top... Hey... Wait a minute... You almost had me, there.

Conceding in TT is better. You can at least apologise in person and make it mean something. Not having a chat makes it worse.

I'm fine with people conceding if that's stated as an accepted norm within the specific ladder. I'd be happy to have all the conceders play in a casual ladder like before.

I think they just need a non-competitive ladder where people who think this is an rpg can play and concede until the cows come home. Banning should only be from the competivtive ladder.

I meant that, per the 2020 Rules, the conceding teams gets no winnings and no MVP. The now winning team gets the cash from both teams and 2 MVPs.

Like, I don't mind you ghosting on a game, if I still get the SPP for 2 MVPs and your cash.

[stinkbug]

Originally posted by grumplekins:

Originally posted by stinkbug:

You can be down more points than there are rounds left and you aren't allowed to leave. I am banned for 2 days and have never left a competitive match.

God forbid I don't want to spend upwards of 10 minutes doing nothing and watching my players be murdered and injured by someone who is holding the ball hostage since they're already up more than enough.

I understand that the devs don't want people quitting constantly but completely removing the option to end a match early is not the right solution. There are too many mathematically impossible to come back from situations; coupled with how long each round takes to actually end.

People play video games to have fun, it is boring and stressful to have to wait so long for no reason especially when your players are having the crap beat out of them in the meantime.

Every game I've quit I've been down 2 with about 4 rounds left. That is 16 minutes of round total round time, you can be extremely generous and say it would work out to be 10 actual minutes to get through those rounds but that is still ridiculous.

I was having a really good time on this game but this inability to leave a game that has already ended, and getting banned for not wasting my time waiting on the game to end anyways has been a big hit to enjoying it.

Thanks, you've done a wonderful job of succinctly voicing the precise attitude that keeps people from learning how to play this game well!

Which is why they need to fix it, casual fans (who keep the game alive for the non-casual fans that seem to think there is no other option than to entirely ban conceding) and newer players aren't going to want to spend match after match waiting 20 minutes for the game to end when they're done 3 at the end of the first half.

Nobody is going to want to keep playing this game, or open their wallet in the first place, after finding out they're locked into a match like a prison sentence. This mentality that the players in this community has is largely based upon feeling like a gaming chad for playing such a brutal online game and they reinforce poor game design to continue to feel like their community is full of gaming marines. When in reality all they're doing in encouraging the game to stop being supported after it dies having no casual fan base.

Because I don't want to sit there doing nothing over and over again and I want to actually play the video game, I am completely prevented from playing the game at all by the ban system. It is poor game design and this scorched earth policy against concedes is not necessary. Middlegrounds exist and the developers have the responsibility when offering a product for money to find that balance. Instead, they took the easy way out and did the no-thought solution and simultaneously hoping that the sweats will let them get away with it, and killing any future the game had.

Going off of this thread it seems like the sweats are going to let them get away with lazy game design. Texas Chainsaw Massacre did the same thing, they had a poor design philosophy (leaving the game unrefined and poorly balanced to preserve its casual-ness) and the community rallied behind that terrible mentality and the game died. This is the same situation, community rallying around poor design mentality that will damage or outright kill the game.

[grumplekins]

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Originally posted by grumplekins:

Conceding in TT is better. You can at least apologise in person and make it mean something. Not having a chat makes it worse.

I'm fine with people conceding if that's stated as an accepted norm within the specific ladder. I'd be happy to have all the conceders play in a casual ladder like before.

I think they just need a non-competitive ladder where people who think this is an rpg can play and concede until the cows come home. Banning should only be from the competivtive ladder.

I meant that, per the 2020 Rules, the conceding teams gets no winnings and no MVP. The now winning team gets the cash from both teams and 2 MVPs.

Like, I don't mind you ghosting on a game, if I still get the SPP for 2 MVPs and your cash.

And I don’t mind not getting SPP or cash as long as I get to play a full game, and people who concede to a fault are banned. See the difference is the latter matters at all.

[grumplekins]

Originally posted by stinkbug:

Originally posted by grumplekins:

Thanks, you've done a wonderful job of succinctly voicing the precise attitude that keeps people from learning how to play this game well!

Which is why they need to fix it, casual fans (who keep the game alive for the non-casual fans that seem to think there is no other option than to entirely ban conceding) and newer players aren't going to want to spend match after match waiting 20 minutes for the game to end when they're done 3 at the end of the first half.

Nobody is going to want to keep playing this game, or open their wallet in the first place, after finding out they're locked into a match like a prison sentence. This mentality that the players in this community has is largely based upon feeling like a gaming chad for playing such a brutal online game and they reinforce poor game design to continue to feel like their community is full of gaming marines. When in reality all they're doing in encouraging the game to stop being supported after it dies having no casual fan base.

Because I don't want to sit there doing nothing over and over again and I want to actually play the video game, I am completely prevented from playing the game at all by the ban system. It is poor game design and this scorched earth policy against concedes is not necessary. Middlegrounds exist and the developers have the responsibility when offering a product for money to find that balance. Instead, they took the easy way out and did the no-thought solution and simultaneously hoping that the sweats will let them get away with it, and killing any future the game had.

Going off of this thread it seems like the sweats are going to let them get away with lazy game design. Texas Chainsaw Massacre did the same thing, they had a poor design philosophy (leaving the game unrefined and poorly balanced to preserve its casual-ness) and the community rallied behind that terrible mentality and the game died. This is the same situation, community rallying around poor design mentality that will damage or outright kill the game.

No, I agree there is need for a casual ladder, bans should only apply to the competitive one. We do need a space where it’s OK to not get the game. But it’s weird how people expect to be entitled to treat the competitive environment as though it were casual.

[stinkbug]

Originally posted by grumplekins:

Originally posted by stinkbug:

Which is why they need to fix it, casual fans (who keep the game alive for the non-casual fans that seem to think there is no other option than to entirely ban conceding) and newer players aren't going to want to spend match after match waiting 20 minutes for the game to end when they're done 3 at the end of the first half.

Nobody is going to want to keep playing this game, or open their wallet in the first place, after finding out they're locked into a match like a prison sentence. This mentality that the players in this community has is largely based upon feeling like a gaming chad for playing such a brutal online game and they reinforce poor game design to continue to feel like their community is full of gaming marines. When in reality all they're doing in encouraging the game to stop being supported after it dies having no casual fan base.

Because I don't want to sit there doing nothing over and over again and I want to actually play the video game, I am completely prevented from playing the game at all by the ban system. It is poor game design and this scorched earth policy against concedes is not necessary. Middlegrounds exist and the developers have the responsibility when offering a product for money to find that balance. Instead, they took the easy way out and did the no-thought solution and simultaneously hoping that the sweats will let them get away with it, and killing any future the game had.

Going off of this thread it seems like the sweats are going to let them get away with lazy game design. Texas Chainsaw Massacre did the same thing, they had a poor design philosophy (leaving the game unrefined and poorly balanced to preserve its casual-ness) and the community rallied behind that terrible mentality and the game died. This is the same situation, community rallying around poor design mentality that will damage or outright kill the game.

No, I agree there is need for a casual ladder, bans should only apply to the competitive one. We do need a space where it’s OK to not get the game. But it’s weird how people expect to be entitled to treat the competitive environment as though it were casual.

Because that is the game. That is the only way to play, it is unrealistic to get in a player-made ladder, especially consistently. I am a very competitive player in any game I play and I went into BB3 because of it's reputation (and some childhood BB2 memories). It's not treating it casually to want the game to end when it is over. Especially with the amount of time turns take. It is absolutely ridiculous the amount of wasted time this games learning curve has.

I don't think you actually understand the experience a new player has on this game. I don't think you understand what it actually feels like in practice to sit down to play a game you paid money for, have a match be over already, then have to waste 10-20 minutes of the time you have to game waiting for it to just end so you can have an actual competitive match again. Then to have the game basically steal your money by banning you from playing it for weeks at a time because you don't have time to sit there staring at the wall doing nothing over and over and over again.

As a new player this game is unplayable after the bans start. It is incredibly ironic for you to say that this mentality is treating a competitive environment like a casual one when the entire point is to be able to actually play the game instead of a finished match for no reason.

[VoodooMike]

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

Those are the rules from the rule book... Reading is hard, man. You have to like... Read.

Reading apparently is hard, since what you listed are absolutely NOT the rules from the rulebook. Maybe it's time you actually read it? I'll help you out - page 67.

Originally posted by Cathaidan:

I meant that, per the 2020 Rules, the conceding teams gets no winnings and no MVP. The now winning team gets the cash from both teams and 2 MVPs.

You seem to have a mish-mash of BB2020 and CRP rules in your head, champ.