Honey Rose: Underdog Fighter Extraordinaire

Honey Rose: Underdog Fighter Extraordinaire

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glottis  [developer] Nov 3, 2016 @ 4:01am
"Pay-what-you-liked" explained!
Hello everyone!

I've received feedback that the business model used by the game is confusing for some, so I hope to explain here a bit more about how it works, what its goals are and why it is designed the way it currently is. If you have any questions, thoughts or ideas regarding it, I'll also do my best to discuss it all with you below!

At its core, the "pay-what-you-liked" model is a derivative of "pay-what-you-want", a system that is not available on Steam. The first aim was to find a way to make "pay-what-you-want"-type systems available for Steam's users. I used the DLC system as stand-ins for different tiers of purchase: if you decide to support the game, you can use any single DLC tier (or multiple ones) to choose the amount you want to pay.

The aim is to keep the complete experience of the game accessible to everyone, without locking any content behind paywalls. It does so to dissociate the notions of "purchase" and "play". We currently widely encourage and teach the pursuit of individualistic gain and instant gratification, and I believe this negatively affects how and why we interact with anything, including each other. In addition, I aim to dissociate your experience with the game from the value of a single defined pricetag, to avoid you playing the meta "sales game", and prevent you building expectations based on the price itself. This is why the tiers cover a wide range of possible pricetags and none of them will ever be put on sale: the lower pricetags are already designed to offer the sales-type prices. This is entirely to the player's benefit, as in the current economy, this means I cannot use the sales period as exposure and revenue bumps.

My hope is for you to experience the game and determine what the experience it provides means for you: those who dislike it would move on, while those who like it enough would pay the amount they feel adequately represent what they got out of it. This model aims to give you a choice: an informed and responsible act of patronage, rather than a blind luck purchase.

By using this model, I hope to get some people who would otherwise decide not to play the game based on the price alone to try it, and determine for themselves if it is worthy of support. The game is not "free", it is "accessible", and it is up to you to determine the amount of support you're willing to act upon for it.

To be clear: these aren't tips/donations, they are delayed purchases: this model is my salary and central source of revenue, and will directly fund my next project, in addition to pay for daily living expenses. While I willingly take this risk as I firmly believe this change would be healthier for players and the industry in general, it *is* an immense risk that should not be taken lightly. I have chosen to trust in your sense of responsibility and your wish to see all of the industry's actors at large treat its players and games with more respect.

In the end, this model hopes to propose an alternative system that could be applied to more works, should it succeed. This possibility is entirely in your hands, and if the model spreads, it will be through your own making. Each of your individual choices and voices matter *immensely*!

If you wish to support the game and/or this model, you can purchase any tier of DLC, or multiple, to determine the exact amount you're willing to pay, based on what you've determined your experience to be worth, or the message you wish to send across!

If you're willing to support the "pay-what-you-liked" process and directly affect my next game, you can also support my Patreon here: patreon.com/pehesse
You can also check out the game's page here for even more information and options regarding all of the above: http://pehesse.fr/honey/en/get-the-game/

In conclusion: thank you *so much* for all the support you choose or have already chosen to lend to this attempt at sparking a change.

Above all, I hope you've enjoyed your time alongside Honey and her friends!

And if you have any questions, I'll do my best to reply!



Last edited by glottis; Nov 3, 2016 @ 4:03am
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Showing 1-10 of 10 comments
I liked a lot the way you have made the method of payment. Very different and creative. You are being a great developer too, fixing bugs very quick and helping people here on the forum. Thank you for your great game and hard work! Be sure to thank the guy who made the music too :). Now, the only thing I don't like in this method is that your game will never be on sale and, because of this, will never appear on steam's front page. This will limit how much people can see and play your game. I'm really hoping that this will not be a problem for you and you can achieve the success you deserve.
Last edited by Guaxinim Bodybuilder; Nov 10, 2016 @ 5:10am
glottis  [developer] Nov 10, 2016 @ 12:08am 
Originally posted by Migraman:
I liked a lot the way you have made the method of payment. Very different and creative. You are being a great developer too, fixing bugs very quick and helping people here on the forum. Thank you for your great game and hard work! Be sure to thank the game who made the music too :). Now, the only thing I don't like in this method is that your game will never be on sale and, because of this, will never appear on steam's front page. This will limit how much people can see and play your game. I'm really hoping that this will not be a problem for you and you can achieve the success you deserve.

Thank you very much for your kind words!

I entirely agree that sales are currently the weakest point of the model as far as exposure (and revenue) goes.

With the upcoming Steam sales on the horizon, we'll see how much of an impact not participating will have, though I'm afraid we can already foresee what will happen. That's definitely something I'll have to reconsider for my future uses of the model!

A "fun" alternative during sales periods would be to rework/increase the base DLC's prices so they "appear" on sale, even though with the sale reductions they'd en up being the exact same as they were at first (that's usually a very frowned upon practice, though, which is why I'm not doing it for now - I'd like to make it a clear understanding between us if it were to happen).

My other current alternative will be to post news/announcements alongside the sale, which I definitely plan to do. Other than that... well, we'll see :-D
Wok Nov 10, 2016 @ 4:46am 
You could have a "normal tier" that you would discount to the same price as the "sale tier" for the sake of visibility during sales.

I think you can still do it. During sales, you could discount at -75% the "impulse tier" so that it matches the "sales tier". It would make a lot of sense, since every tier would be static except the "impulse tier" which would have to match the "sales tier"... during sales. Otherwise it is not "impulse" purchase anymore, right?
Last edited by Wok; Nov 10, 2016 @ 4:51am
glottis  [developer] Nov 10, 2016 @ 4:53am 
Originally posted by Wok:
You could have a "normal tier" that you would discount to the same price as the "sale tier" for the sake of visibility during sales.

I think you can still do it. During sales, you could discount at -75% the "impulse tier" so that it matches the "sales tier". It would make a lot of sense, since every tier would be static except the "impulse tier" which would have to match the "sales tier"... during sales. Otherwise it is not "impulse" purchase anymore, right?

That's definitely another option! If others voice support for the idea, we could try it for the next Steam Sale, see how it goes?
Originally posted by glottis:
Originally posted by Wok:
You could have a "normal tier" that you would discount to the same price as the "sale tier" for the sake of visibility during sales.

I think you can still do it. During sales, you could discount at -75% the "impulse tier" so that it matches the "sales tier". It would make a lot of sense, since every tier would be static except the "impulse tier" which would have to match the "sales tier"... during sales. Otherwise it is not "impulse" purchase anymore, right?

That's definitely another option! If others voice support for the idea, we could try it for the next Steam Sale, see how it goes?

I think it's a great idea!
glottis  [developer] Nov 10, 2016 @ 6:13am 
Originally posted by Migraman:
Originally posted by glottis:

That's definitely another option! If others voice support for the idea, we could try it for the next Steam Sale, see how it goes?

I think it's a great idea!

Well, I'm sold :-) We'll try it, and see what happens! Thanks a lot for the idea and support, everyone!
Wok Nov 29, 2016 @ 3:00pm 
I am reading your article on Gamasutra[www.gamasutra.com] and I wanted to say that I had bought several tiers of the game beforehand to support you. I rated 6/10 the game on SensCritique and I am sorry if it had saddened you. It is not that I don't like the game, it is just that I usually don't go higher than 7/10 if I don't finish the game for whatever reason. It is in no way supposed to mean the game is bad.
Last edited by Wok; Nov 29, 2016 @ 3:01pm
glottis  [developer] Nov 30, 2016 @ 12:09am 
Originally posted by Wok:
I am reading your article on Gamasutra[www.gamasutra.com] and I wanted to say that I had bought several tiers of the game beforehand to support you. I rated 6/10 the game on SensCritique and I am sorry if it had saddened you. It is not that I don't like the game, it is just that I usually don't go higher than 7/10 if I don't finish the game for whatever reason. It is in no way supposed to mean the game is bad.

Don't worry, I completely understand (and I'm sorry if I gave the wrong impression)! What saddens me most isn't what you rated it, which is absolutely fair - it's that it failed to engage you enough for you to want to finish it in the first place, which is definitely a problem from the game!

Thank you so much for choosing to purchase some tiers (and for suggesting the sales idea in the first place, that was fantastically helpful!), and I hope if you come back to the game at some point to finish it, you'll have had an interesting experience overall!
Last edited by glottis; Nov 30, 2016 @ 12:40am
Wok Nov 30, 2016 @ 3:30am 
One thing that made me lose it is that I did not understand how my actions modified the little heads at the top of the screen. I had been studying maths for days and it had not changed to a happy face.
Last edited by Wok; Nov 30, 2016 @ 3:30am
glottis  [developer] Nov 30, 2016 @ 4:48am 
Originally posted by Wok:
One thing that made me lose it is that I did not understand how my actions modified the little heads at the top of the screen. I had been studying maths for days and it had not changed to a happy face.

Yes, progress occurs relative to thresholds - just because there is no "visible" progress (and in fact, there is: you always have arrows pointing up when a stat increases) doesn't mean there is no tracked progress. The whole point of that design was to get players to persevere even when there are no clear visible and tangible rewards, though I'll admit it's a very specific mindset to get into! The aim of the game, overall, is to get players to overcome that apprehension and make choices towards what they believe in, not based on pure statistical gains (basically, carrots on sticks), but through determination that they're doing the right thing, and will operate change in the long run.

So a portrait will change color only after some time spent "training" the corresponding stat, as the thresholds are far enough apar that they all require a number of sessions between turns - in daydreamer mode, it's usually 2-3, in ropewalker it's anywhere from 5 to 10, and challenger can go even higher - but they're all entirely possible to max out when needed, and I actually highly recommend playing once in challenger mode from scratch (but with knowledge from previous playthroughs) and to try and ace each test and beat every match on the first try, it's quite a thrill!
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