Apologies if this isn't exactly on topic with "bug report" sort of things, I just wanted to get your opinion on something I tried to do with the models, Phanto. the images are a bit sloppy since I didn't have the most easy method of doing this, though I managed to get some dynamic looks from the Toa by using a visual clip tool (which was a huge pain sad to say). I'd like to know your opinion on how these look for pretty much jerry rigging them together.
http://imgur.com/a/kaPMY

Well, I made the topic that you could post here, instead of comments, so no biggie.

They look alright, I especially like the second picture, Lewa's left leg in the first looks weird though. I can see you were trying to get the "jointed legs" that apparently a few people want. Don't worry, I will do the jointed legs/arms when I can, whether it ends up being an update to the toa here, or an upload on the garry's mod site, is entirely up to trial and error with them.

I'm curious what maps you used though. :3

Thank you, I really tried to get him to look agile, though having to piece him together and hope it came out in my head prevented that a bit, though at least I got a decent look from him in it, and I'm surprised you like Pohatu's more, I actually felt dissatisfied with it which is why I made Lewa's afterwards, though I am glad you like it.

The map I used for Lewa was de_forest, I just noclipped to an area very close to the edge of the map for more of the skybox, which caused many problems in getting his right arm since the physics of the model attached to the arm pieces kept hitting the wall and would not cooporate.

Pohatu's was in gm_DesertMountains, the rocks and boulders were added in from TF2 map resources to attempt to replicate the arch he knocked down in his original animated introduction, and to break up the sand just a little bit. I'm thinking of doing Gali next since there are no Lava maps to have Tahu in, still looking for a good cave for Onua, and same thing with Kopaka.

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Also while I'm here, I have a small list of extra posing features to ask if they are going to be added in the possible update with knees, elbows, and possibly a toe bend, if I may ask these.

-A hinge on the hand connectors on the Toa's hips and shoulders so they can move forward and backwards. (I say the ones on the hips as well being because on the animation for Lewa when he crouches his hip connectors just completely flip upside down to get him closer to the tree branch.)

-Bending fingers for Lewa, Pohatu, and Tahu's hands, Onua's claws, and flexing hooks for Gali if possible.

-Waist movement (I fully understand if this isn't easily possible without distorting the waist, just asking if it's planned as well).


And two last things I wish to ask before I finish up, if I'm permitted.

Do you plan on making prop models of all the bionicle Pieces used on the Toa for people that want to make scenes such as them building themselves or such?

And are you going to make the masks bodygroups as some point? I think it would be very helpful for people whom want to make the Toa wear any of the 6 Kanohi.

Sorry for typing so darn much and seeming to harp so much as well, I just am very curious what is planned for the Toa and what is not so I know not to ask or mention something again.

Its alright, I'll try to answer everything in much less text.

Oh, actually, I know two lava maps, gm_lair (volcano, but it has lava pits), and a map called Mustafa (its a star wars map). There are plenty of water maps as well. One of my favorite snow maps is gm_mountainside, it has a nice area in the forest.

First, I want to keep originality with these toa, not to get you down or anything, they're great ideas, but I've already taken account of the hinges for the hips and arms (if you mean where the arms/legs connect to, in real life the arm hinge things can move back and forth in real life), its quite difficult to pull off, and frankly, would look weird with the legs.

Secondly, I'm doing a project called BYOM, people can BUILD their OWN Bionicle MOCs with a whole database of parts, I cannot add all parts, because I am limited to the fact that not all the Bionicle parts exist on programs such as LDD or Ldraw (where the models were obtained), but it will be as decent as I can achieve with Source's limitations.

As for fingers, no, that just takes out originality completely...sorry. But, there are the Toa Unova, they have fingers. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=552151034

As for hips, no, already impossible, I mean, it can be done, just that its a mountain load of work that I don't have time, I've had experience with dealing with spine bones and bionicle, it usually ends up weird.

I haven't planned anything other than the elbow/knee joints, I prefer to leave them as they are after that, There's still Vissova's Toa (SFM, they may also come to gmod) to look forward to, and they may have more poseablility than these "Toy Style" toa.

I can understand the hip ones, and your justification for the fingers is understandable as well, and though I still do have an eagerness for the hinged hand connectors, waist and possibly toe bends, I understand completely if that is not the route you with to choose with any of those. I just am really looking forward to the finished rigging of these models since these are the most toy accurate ones I've seen and I can't help but imagine all the articulation they have in the animations, fingers excluded since in the animations their fingers never really did move at all, excluding Onua's claws, I think they did move slightly in the animations, but not much.

That isn't to say I don't like the SFM models, I think they look fantastic as well, though I think of the unreleased Legends of Mata Nui game when I look at them rather than the animations to promote the toys. However, I'm not going to be like that bunch that while whine and beg and harass you over a few things that weren't added that can be done much more easily once hinging elbows and knees are added, assuming they will be anyway. These models are yours, and you shouldn't have people constantly saying to change little things they dislike constantly. Heck, I could easily make images with simulated waist articulation just from using two props made from the torso being broken in half with the pistons on the sides removed, the spine and hips being one, and the rest of the upper body being the rest so there are work arounds for sure for people that want that.

I'm losing my train of thought here and rambling, to the point here I respect your choices with your models, and am thankful enough you're considering the elbows and knees, no clue if you'll decide anything further, though either way I am just happy to see these models finally existing on Gmod.

Yeh...well...I'm glad you're happy the toa are finally on gmod, I think I've made a lot of people happy, if I were someone else, not a modder, and to see the toa finally on gmod, I'd be just as excited too.

Well, technically, the models belong to LEGO, because they're models from I believe LDD, LDraw and where ever else I won't know, a user called Lehvak ripped them somehow, even though I haven't seen all these Toa parts in LDD (there are parts that I don't have that I want to rip myself).

So of course the models would be the most accurate, because truthfully, they ARE identical to real life, in every detail. :3 So really, thank LEGO they made 3D models for their programs (such as LEGO Digital Designer), but don't go telling them that someone managed to rip the models. They won't add anymore to LDD, I once emailed them, and they replied they wouldn't. So I'll say it beforehand not to get hopeful we'll see every other bionicle set ever made.

Yeah, the only other way that will happen is if someone devotes their time modeling every Bionicle part that isn't on those softwares, which would take forever. The way I see it, we have the Toa Mata, and the day we have the Turaga, Matoran, and Bohrok as well will make it all complete, those are Bionicle's history, and the most important part of it, we don't relly need more than that, excluding the Toa Metru maybe.

All those can be done with the parts that I have, technically. But I'm not saying I really want to make them...(a long time ago I built a bohrok with the parts) however the bohrok have flaws with the neck. It has two of those beams with the cogs at the end, and making the neck act like it does in real life would take a miracle to pull off. So far in my observances can't be achieved.

But...not to suddenly break the idea off now...I keep looking at the toa, and thinking logically about how to pull off the knees/elbows without having to have it as a noticeable joint, that I'd prefer people to be able to use joint tool to pose them...but in my mind, I've visualized it, it can't work that way.

Of course, if I did devote time to just making that work like normally, the toa can still have elbows/knees. But I keep feeling like its dragging on, I love bionicle modding, but I really want to do other modding stuff and just leave Bionicle alone for a while. BYOM I plan to be my last Bionicle project (probably for a long time).

Let me show you what also brings me down about adding elbows/knees, I should've shown you before, this is for BYOM though.

http://i.imgur.com/vJtl8Cy.png
http://i.imgur.com/0gX0Hmy.png
http://i.imgur.com/D3JdGn3.png

They're not the best looking, because these models are quite high poly.

With BYOM, people will be able to recreate the Toa if they please, and along with that, have jointed knees/elbows. Sorry, to now disappoint you, but this feature is already going to be evident in another project...but I've just come to realize how bothered I feel about needing to do something more with a project I've already uploaded. In short, I just don't feel like doing it anymore...because it'll be in BYOM, so I don't see too much use doing it here.

You know what, I can entirely respect that, that makes plenty of sense the way you put it. So this addon can be left for those whom wish to have figures with essentially the articulation of toys (excluding the shoulders, which I'm assuming were left out due to the issue of turning gears, which aren't needed for Gmod models in my personal opinion really), and then BYOM can allow people to make more articulate models and customize them to their liking, or make more poseable Toa. That's honestly not a bad idea at all and makes sense, so I'm 100% behind you on that choice.

Moving onto what I think about the limbs you pointed out, I can definitely see the issues, especilly in the tool weilding arm in picture 3, howeverThough picture 2 doesn't look too bad really. I'm judging the advanced articulation based off of one thing and one thing only, the 6 promotional animations. If I may
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fk47EDfWK10

You've likely seen these animations dozens of times, though I recommend taking another close look if you have not already. Observing the way the limbs bend carefully shows exactly how LEGO invisioned them functioning realistically, which involves the pistons moving in a very realistic way, where as the leg bend issue, very prominent with Lewa, is a bit realism breaking, but it's an issue even LEGO had, same with some of the piston glitching out at times. The only real instance where the pistons will need to be carefully looked at is the tool weilding arm, where the whole lower arm assembly is the inside of the hinge, and the upper arm assembly isn't connected to the inside, but instead being held on by the outside of the hing with the piston on it. Obviously the Toa were made in a more advanced (or more advanced than Gmod anyway) software, so perfect, and sometimes even moderate pistan functions are ectremely difficult unless they have hinches all their own, and have the smaller cylinder stretch rather than hold anoth cylinder inside, though that could risk the piston spazzing out of control if it's just loose rather than having it's own hinges mapped to the igging in a way as well.

Keep in mind, I've never modeled anything before, I tried once and ended up making a blob vaguely shaped like a humanoid... Thing, so I obviously don't know the process of mapping or modeling, What I do know is sometimes having someone else say something to you can make the biggest ideas click and find a solution, I should know, some of my favorite MOCs were made because someone said something to me that made it click in my head. Le legs and tool arms have little indicators on them of where pistons would have hinges to assume the necessary posisions to allow Bionicles to function, so maybe there is a way to alter the models slightly to seperate the pistons from the model itself, though not look disconnected, and apply a hinge mapped to the bone structure where ever it's needed, and have the smaller cylinder stretch as you've had it. By no means am I trying to be bossy, a know it all, or anything like that, I'm just saying what would make sense in my head, and hope it could give you a sudden inspirational spark. Or if I'm completely wrong about everything I've said about the piston suggestions then you can just say I was wrong as well, because I don't know how modeling works, I just know my way around machinery workings for the most part, both fictional and real usually.

Anyway, that's my wall of text for tonight, whenever you see this hopefully what I said helps in some way, shape, or form at all, otherwise feel free to just say that won't work, but it never hurts to try and help verbally to see if something ends up making sense by looking at it from a different perspective. I'm always happy to help, if I am ever able to do so. And lastly, enjoy your break from Bionicle mods, breaks are always refreshing, even ones from the things you love, and if I know one thing about hobbies or interests it's that you really begin to despise them when they feel like they are becoming a job or expected of you. Take as long as you need, patience is a virtue and every needs to learn to have it.

I've got one: The Fire Sword isn't bone-merging with Tahu's hand anymore; it just floats in the air behind him.

@Officer Spencer Pootis, ok. Even though Source has its limits, and of course not everything would work the same way as what LEGO managed to do to create their movements. I just wish I could improve the articulation I have for BYOM...but...these models are high poly, which make them harder to bone weight, rig, with parts that aren't intentionally meant to rotate or move.

@Tyraka628, alright, I'll get right on fixing that.

@Phanto Well, it was worth seeing if I could help, though I wish you the best of luck in what ever you work on with the BYOM in the future, I'll try to stop bugging you with long walls of text now and wait patiently to see the final product when the time comes for it's completion, sorry I couldn't really say something that would help since my knowledge is lacking in this feild, though I tried at least, and I'm sure what ever you do the the BYOM it will come out fantastically. Best of luck on your future addons and mods.

Thanks! Now I just wish more people would start contributing artworks and screenshots for these bionicles, and other bionicles that I've done for gmod...I've made a picture thread to encourage people.

Then allow me to add to that, I'll see if I can make some good photos with all the Toa, and seperate images which do them justice, Gali is my next picture project once I find out why my rock models from counterstrike are all errors. Can't promise others will make pictures, certainly hope they do, though I can promise I'll be contributing to that section as I make images.

Bone Merger doesn't seem to work with Tahu and his fire sword. It says "That object has no attachment points!" whenever I try to use it on either Tahu or his fire sword. Same with Kopaka.