Kenshi
No Cut Efficiency
 This topic has been pinned, so it's probably important
Lyston  [developer] Sep 6, 2019 @ 12:25am
How to make your own NCE edits for armors from other mods
The process of making your own NCE edits in FCS are very simple but also quite tedious to get exactly right. I'll explain the process here.

tl;dr

Here's the quick tl;dr for people who know what they're doing but need some tips:

  • You need to know the [Masterwork Grade] Cut Resistance and Cut Efficiency values for the armor pieces you want to edit beforehand. Write them down (I use excel) and calculate the expected Cut Resistance you need after removing Cut Efficiency (expected = vanilla Cut Resistance * vanilla Cut Efficiency).

  • In the FCS, the only two values you will edit are "cut def bonus" and "cut into stun". "cut into stun" is the cut inefficiency. Always set this to 0 for 100% efficiency. "cut def bonus" is a flat value added to the [Masterwork Grade] Cut Resistance. Positive for more, negative for less. For example, a vanilla Dustcoat has 44% cut resist, 60% cut eff. The expected is 26.4% (44% * 60%). To get that, we need a bonus of -0.176 (0.44 - 0.176 = 26.4%) to get 26% on [Masterwork]. The game itself takes care of adjusting this bonus for lower qualities automatically.

  • Lastly, about 99% of the time, the "cut def bonus" has a hidden weight that prevents it from a flat adjustment of the Cut Resistance. After making your edit, go into game and look at the [Masterwork] version of what you just edited. If it is not exactly your expected value, go back to FCS and adjust your bonus. Then go check again. Then adjust your bonus. Repeat this over and over until it is exactly right. This is MOST ♥♥♥♥ING TEDIOUS part of this whole process.

The Long Version

Part 1: Opening the mod into FCS

First you need to download the armor mod you want to edit. I'll use "Armor; Nomad Cape" from Acord as an example. After subscribing to the mod, Steam will download it into "C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\workshop\content\233860". 233860 is the Steam ID of Kenshi, and this folder will contain all the mods you've subscribed to for this game.

All the mods you've downloaded will also have folders named after their respective Steam ID's. To find the one you want, just open random folders and check the name of the .mod file. In this case, folder "1817582624" has "nomad cape.mod" so I know this is the right one. Once you found the right folder, copy the folder (for me, "1817582624") and paste it into C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Kenshi\mods with your other mods.

Next, go inside the pasted folder and copy the name part of "name.mod" (for me, "nomad cape" of "nomad cape.mod") and rename the folder to that (for me, rename "1817582624" to "nomad cape").

Next, go up from the mod folder to the Kenshi folder and run "forgotten construction set.exe". Make a new mod for your edits (for me, "NCE for Nomad Cape"). Finally, uncheck all the boxes in the lower list except the armor mod ("nomad cape.mod") and your NCE mod ("NCE for Nomad Cape.mod"). Make sure the NCE mod has the *ACTIVE* tag, not the armor mod. Hit DONE.

Part 2: Getting the unmodded Cut Resistance and Cut Efficiency

In the FCS, go to Items -> Armour. This gives you a list of all the armors in the game, including the armors from the mod you want to edit.

[[[There is no marker to tell mod armors apart from game armors in FCS. I already know the armors I'm editing will be the ones called Nomad cape, but if you don't know, you can go back to your Kenshi folder and run "forgotten construction set.exe" again to open a second FCS window. In that one, open just the armor mod (for me, have only "nomad cape.mod" checked and *ACTIVE*). Go to Items -> Armour, and all of the armor mod's new armors will be marked green. You can take screenshots, write the names down, or just keep the second FCS window open to reference the armors you need to edit. Now switch back to the first FCS window, the one editing the NCE mod.]]]

With the NCE mod open, the first step you need to do is figure out the Cut Resistance and Cut Efficiency values of the [Masterwork Grade] versions of the mod's armors. The only way to check this is in-game, not the FCS. However, we can use the FCS to make this much easier.

Go to Characters in the left panal and scroll down until you find "Vagabond". Open it. On the right-hand side are the clothing options the Vagabond character starts with. Delete all three. In the pull-down menu above it, select "clothing" and click Add. Select one of the armor mod's armors (for me, "Nomad cape black") and click Ok. On the left side of the Vagabond window, change armour grade from GEAR_CHEAP to GEAR_MASTER. Set "armour upgrade chance" to 0.

[[["Vagabond" is the starting character of the "The Holy Sword" game start. I prefer that one because it utilizes a character instead of a squad in FCS, making it easier to edit. If you want to use someone else for testing or already have all the masterworks in a save, you can use that instead. Second, if the mod you're editing has many armors, you can add one of each slot to "Vagabond" (or whoever) to test them all at once. I don't recommend trying more than 1 of the same slot at once, as its RNG on which one you'll start with]]]

Save your mod.

Open Kenshi through Steam, enable both the armor mod and NCE mod (put the NCE below the armor mod in load order).

Select New Game, using "The Holy Sword" game start. Your character will be wearing the item(s) you set for the Vagabond in [Masterwork Grade]. Write down the values for Cut Resistance and Cut Efficiency. I write them in Excel, but it's your choice. (for "Nomad cape black", the Cut Resistance is 7% and the Cut Resistance Efficiency is 80%)

Close the game.

Part 3: Editing the NCE and adjusting the Cut Resistance

Calculate the expected Cut Resistance for after you remove the Cut Efficiency, using Cut Resist * Cut Eff = Expected (for me, 7% * 80% = 5.6%. Since Kenshi rounds, my expected Cut Resistance for [Masterwork] is 6%).

Now we need to calculate the value for "cut def bonus". This is a flat value added to the [Masterwork Grade] Cut Resistance. Positive for more, negative for less. The formula is unmodded Cut Resist - expected Cut Resist (for me, 0.07 - 0.056 = 0.014. We need to subtract this value, so my "cut def bonus" will be -0.014)

Go back to the FCS with your NCE mod loaded, go to Items -> Armour and open the armor piece you calculated for (for me, "Nomad cape black").

Scroll down the list to the "stats 0-1" category. To remove Cut Efficiency, edit "cut into stun" to 0. "cut into stun" is the cut inefficiency of the item, so 0 is 100% efficiency (for me, 0.2 (IE 80%) is changed to 0).

Next, edit the "cut def bonus" of the armor using the value we previously calculated (for me, edit 0 to -0.014). If the unmodded armor already had a cut def bonus value, subtract it by your value (IE, 0.05 - 0.014 = 0.036. I'd use positive 0.036 instead if it was 0.05 unmodded).

Save your mod.

Open the game.

Start a New Game using The Holy Sword start. Your character will still start with the armor piece you're editing, so check its stats (for me, the edited "Nomad cape black" has no cut efficiency listed, which means 100%, and the Cut resistance is 6%, which matches my expectations).

If your Cut Resistance matches your calculated expected value, you're done. Congrats, move onto the next piece. The armor quality system in-game will already adjust the bonus values for the lower qualities, and Cut Efficiency will always be gone. If it did not match your expected value, that is because there is a hidden weight ♥♥♥♥ing things up with no indication of what exactly it is. You need to go back to FCS and tweak your "cut def bonus" value to account for this hidden weight. Make the change, save it, go back into the game to check, repeat until it matches your expected exactly. This is tedious to the extreme but necessary for a proper fix.

Do this for all the armors pieces of the mod (for me, after "Nomad cape black" is "Nomad cape blue", "Nomad cape white", etc. etc.).

Once all your values are right, you need to undo the "Vagabond" changes you made to test things. To do that, go to Changes at the top bar of the FCS, right click the "Vagabond" entry in the Change List, and click Revert. That's it.

Save your mod, and you're finished.

If you want to upload your NCE mod to Steam, you will have to launch the FCS from Steam instead of the exe, then use the Steam Workshop button at the top bar of the FCS. Make sure to observe proper decorum when uploading mods, including linking and bringing attention to the original modder of the armor mod you made your edit for. Use the "Add/Remove Required Items" button on the mod page to make the original armor mod required for your NCE edit (because it is required. This is both a courtesy and a necessity, since a mod made this way does not include the armor files. It only edits values of the original). My original NCE mod is not required, so there's no reason to include it in the required list.

(I won't be uploading the Nomad Cape mod I made for the purpose of this guide. The original armor mod is missing icons and needs updating, while I don't care to follow along and make adjustments when it does get updated. However, if anyone wishes to make it themselves, you have all the work done in this guide, so it will be very easy to make yourself)
Last edited by Lyston; Mar 24, 2021 @ 10:04pm
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Showing 1-8 of 8 comments
DW420 Sep 7, 2019 @ 1:03am 
Lastly, about 99% of the time, the "cut def bonus" has a hidden weight that prevents it from a flat adjustment of the Cut Resistance. After making your edit, go into game and look at the [Masterwork] version of what you just edited. If it is not exactly your expected value, go back to FCS and adjust your bonus. Then go check again. Then adjust your bonus. Repeat this over and over until it is exactly right. This is MOST ♥♥♥♥ING TEDIOUS part of this whole process.

A shot in the dark (as i've done no prior research)..but could it be that its the "class" and "material type" that carry that hidden weight?

It would make sense (from a dev pov) to have them factor in , so one can create 1 "shoe that adds sharkswithlaserbeamsonhead" template which with a few edits (class/material/name etc) can create 16 variants of "shoe" , one for each class/material type.

In simpler words..can it be that armour item "X" classified as GEAR CLOTH/MATERIAL CLOTH (0) is less resistant in-game than the same item but classified as GEAR HEAVY/MATERIAL METAL PLATE (3) ??

Edit-- forgot to mention: This suggestion is mainly due to the explanation on "pierce def multiplier" .."stats are generated by class and material enums" and the possibility of that info being omitted for cut def.

(i expect it to have already been clarified by the devs and i'm wasting everyones time...so my preemptive apologies.)
Last edited by DW420; Sep 7, 2019 @ 1:13am
Lyston  [developer] Sep 7, 2019 @ 5:11pm 
Originally posted by DW420:
but could it be that its the "class" and "material type" that carry that hidden weight?

I have no confirmation from the devs, but I can confirm from my own experience that while they may be an influence, they are not the only deciding factor. When I was editing, there was an item with a noticeable hidden weight that used the same class and material type as Dustcoat (which has no weight) but was in a different gear slot. However, at the same time, ALL chainmail type items have the largest deviation from their expected, sometimes to 50%, so I believe it does have some influence. Slot, coverage, class, and material are all possible contributors. Maybe its all of them simultaneously. I could never figure it out.

There is another influencing factor, but this one is predictable. Certain items (for example, I think most of the Samurai pieces) have a level bonus. For example, +10 level or -5 level. What that means is instead of a [Masterwork] counting as level 100 for auto-calculating its stats (from the class and materials, as you noticed), it will count as level 110 or 95, making it stronger or weaker than others of the same enums at the same quality. This level shift also influences the "cut def bonus". So, for example, if you want to remove 10% (-0.1) but the item has a +10 level bonus, you will see a "cut def bonus" of -0.1 actually removes 11%. (-0.1 * 1.10 = -0.11).
Petra Jul 15, 2021 @ 7:29pm 
Thank you so much for the tutorial! With all of the math going on under the hood I wasn't expecting much from my efforts (with my experience level I wasn't expecting the game to still load), but the results were surprisingly good.
Sitrus Jan 5, 2022 @ 11:08am 
Shidan made a nifty Resistance & skill multiplier calculator for armor years ago. Why not just use that to calculate the values? I just modified a copy of it for myself, so it calculated the cut bonus needed for the efficiency removal.
Mister Bones May 24, 2022 @ 2:34pm 
Originally posted by Sitrus:
Shidan made a nifty Resistance & skill multiplier calculator for armor years ago. Why not just use that to calculate the values? I just modified a copy of it for myself, so it calculated the cut bonus needed for the efficiency removal.
I could use the version you made if you still have it and would be so kind as to upload it to MEGA or something.
ThoricSatsuma37 Dec 4, 2022 @ 5:13pm 
I've figured out the hidden weights and formulae for computing armor stats, and made a handy spreadsheet (download Excel file[docs.google.com] or access a copy of the Google Doc[docs.google.com])for making these edits. The whole process can be done within FCS, so you don't need to hunt down any armor in-game. You can hover over the column headers for some info and basic instructions. It should also warn you if you try to change anything important.

The Workspace sheet is where you should enter values and get results. The Tip sheet gives a handy way to find all the armors you need to edit. The Parameters sheet holds the hidden weights used in calculating armor cut resistance.

I didn't include any instructions on how to get into or work with FCS, so you should still read the OP. One important thing to remember when reading the OP is that the result my spreadsheet produces is meant to REPLACE the "cut def bonus" for an armor, while the OP walks through a process of MODIFYING the existing value.
Last edited by ThoricSatsuma37; Dec 4, 2022 @ 6:02pm
Mister Bones Dec 5, 2022 @ 3:51pm 
Originally posted by ThoricSatsuma37:
I've figured out the hidden weights and formulae for computing armor stats, and made a handy spreadsheet
[snip]

Sweet, I hope I remember this for next time I play. I think I used a super scuffed spreadsheet when I was doing it too but it was using OP's method.
Shezzar Feb 27 @ 1:03pm 
Originally posted by ThoricSatsuma37:
I've figured out the hidden weights and formulae for computing armor stats, and made a handy spreadsheet (download Excel file[docs.google.com] or access a copy of the Google Doc[docs.google.com])for making these edits. The whole process can be done within FCS, so you don't need to hunt down any armor in-game. You can hover over the column headers for some info and basic instructions. It should also warn you if you try to change anything important.

The Workspace sheet is where you should enter values and get results. The Tip sheet gives a handy way to find all the armors you need to edit. The Parameters sheet holds the hidden weights used in calculating armor cut resistance.

I didn't include any instructions on how to get into or work with FCS, so you should still read the OP. One important thing to remember when reading the OP is that the result my spreadsheet produces is meant to REPLACE the "cut def bonus" for an armor, while the OP walks through a process of MODIFYING the existing value.

Полезная штука, благодарю за труд.

Google Translate:
Useful stuff, thanks for the effort.
Last edited by Shezzar; Feb 28 @ 5:23am
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