Trying to find root cause of overwatch ban

[JK_Mooney]

Well, my son drew an overwatch ban. Popular opinion on the forums is that there is no way to draw the ban unless he was cheating. However, after a very thorough survey of the computer he plays on, I can say without question that it's clean. Whatever drew the ban had nothing to do with what's installed on that machine.

Researching the boards, I've also run across something called "smurfing". Apparently this is a skilled player masquerading as a noob. Will that draw an overwatch ban? He did say a bunch of his friends got CS:GO accounts recently and he dropped into a map they were playing on.

He wants to create a new account but, without knowing what drew the ban in the first place and having objective evidence that the gaming computer is clean, how I don't know he won't just get banned again?

Also, on a related note. Reviewing the available information on the overwatch system; it appears that "accuracy" is determed by how well the reviewers agree with each other. This, coupled with the pressure to be "good at spotting cheats" sounds like a recipe for a confirmation bias to build into the system over time. It would show as a trending increase in conviction rate. Has anyone looked at that statistic?

One final thing, I've noted on the boards that whenever someone suggests that overwatch falsely convicted them, it tends to draw a lot of juvenile name calling. If you're not going to take the question seriously, just ignore me....let's not waste each other's time 'K?

[76561198001062896]

Your the one wasting peoples time here as
nobody here can help you
secondly: all I hear is excuses, OW-ers are chosen from people with many experience and also all cases are being reviewed by the staff itself to minimise issues. For the info, they tested OW-ers by showing them footage of pro players (without telling that part) and in majority of cases no false positive decision was made.
Thirdly: this whole my son/daughter/whoever relative didnt cheated doesnt work here. For all we know, you may be the cheater trying to make up excuses
yet another private profile, how odd

[JK_Mooney]

Private because I don't freely give out PII and....looking at your profile:

"Please keep in mind that I only use this account for posting in the community discussions since I got permabanned on my main one...... "

Again....serious responses only please..

[Forcen]

No, smurfing doesn't cause overwatch.

When you say "clean" and "a very thorough survey" I'm not sure what you mean? Did you just search for viruses with an antivirus? Did you do a manual search? Can you spot cheats when you see them?

Also even if there is no cheats on the PC now it doesn't mean that there never where cheats on it

The account could also have cheated on another PC, maybe at a friends house? Maybe he left it logged in on a friends PC or they got his password though keylogger and cheated when he left?

Or the easiest answer, maybe your son did cheat, maybe just to try it but he changed his mind stopped and deleted the cheat and now he got banned and doesn't want to admit wasting his or maybe your money.

Here is some info on overwatch if you want to read: http://blog.counter-strike.net/index.php/overwatch/

http://steamcommunity.com/app/730/discussions/0/624075036317904163/

Here is a guide for overwatching, notice the "Evident beyond reasonable doubt" button the click when they see cheats: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=151566523

[76561198001062896]

Origineel geplaatst door Corvus Shade:

Private because I don't freely give out PII and....looking at your profile:

"Please keep in mind that I only use this account for posting in the community discussions since I got permabanned on my main one...... "

Again....serious responses only please..

not sure how its any of your business

and oh look, somebody has that laughable "anything that I dont like to hear is not a serious response".
That kind of attitude of yours itself shows that you simply cannot be taken seriously

[Satoru]

Root cause is cheating. You only get permanently overwatch banned for cheating.

Your son cheated.

Not sure what more you want.

[JK_Mooney]

Thanks Forcan,

There are ways to check if executables were modded (did find one in ARMA III - but that appeared to be Adware) and, of course, virus scan....and I thougnt about the possibility that someone got our account password, but I get the e-mails on that account and Steam would have notified me of a login from a different machine by sending me a passcode that whomever tried to log in would have had to use. Still....a password change might be a good precaution.

As for intentionally cheating and hiding it; he doesn't play competitively so there's little motivation. Plus, if I understand the system correctly. An automated VAC ban is a positive detection of illicit software. The Overwatch ban is a subjective evaluation of game footage.

Smurfing was the only remaining liklihood I could come up with. It's a concern because, if he did create a new account and started playing as himself, will he marked as a noob who's playing way too far above his skill level?

[JK_Mooney]

Darth Veda: The gaming machine runs windows 10 tech preview. While it's been remarkably stable for beta, I suspect that said re-image is in my future regardless. Might be a good precaution in any event if I do find the cause.

....and I did discover this morning that he was running expired AV software....fortunately, that machine only runs games right now as it's just to shake down Windows 10.

[JK_Mooney]

Satoru: I don't think you know what a "Root Cause Analysis" is....

[JK_Mooney]

....actually, said gaming computer is dual-booted with Linux MInt (just in case things went "all wonky" on the Win 10 Tech preview side I'd have a chance to recover the disks). Could just try re-installing a new account from the Mint side and see if the same thing happens....

[J4MESOX4D]

Origineel geplaatst door Corvus Shade:

Smurfing was the only remaining liklihood I could come up with.

Smurfing isn't an offence. Only cheating is the result of a Overwatch issued Game Ban or Global Cooldown. The only way to ensure your PC is clean is by doing a full system reformat. You may think your PC is clear of cheats after running multiple scans but most modern cheats act like Malware and can do undetected because they aren't a virus. They can hide themselves, automatically re-install when removed by hand, bury in deep unrelated folders so they cannot be tracked and they can also overwrite other files anywhere on the PC that haven't been in use for a certain time period and then automatically overwrite core files when a new installation of software is done in relation to the game a person was banned from. These cheats are smart, vicious and pose a substantial threat to a user down the line not just for the gaming experience but for malicious activity of files on their PC.

He cheated on CSGO, was correctly banned based a conclusive overwatch decision and now you must decide whether to trust him on a new account and with your PC. Only a full wipe will suffice if he wishes to resume on a new account and you may have to do one for the sake of your computer integrity. He could alternatively remain banned from the game on his current account but play other titles. Either way; keep him on a tight leash in future. Modern cheat sites not only offer routes to cheating but they can also house harmful material that could put every user on the PC at risk.

[Sazzbot]

Origineel geplaatst door Corvus Shade:

Thanks Forcan,
As for intentionally cheating and hiding it; he doesn't play competitively so there's little motivation. Plus, if I understand the system correctly. An automated VAC ban is a positive detection of illicit software. The Overwatch ban is a subjective evaluation of game footage.

Just now you lied, can you find your own lie?

[Forcen]

I'm pretty sure there cheats work in other ways then modifying executables...
VAC doesn't know all cheats either, that is why they have overwatch.

Also there is a whole lot of possible motivation to play in casual, maybe even more then competitive. For example, testing out a cheat. If i just wanted to try a cheat but not depend on it for rank i would not play competitive.

Could your son delete any email that steam sends out if he logs in to a new PC? If he say logged in to another PC? Does he know the password?

Also what about the point of friends playing on the PC and maybe bringing cheats? Did your son even know that cheating is bannable before this?

Drop the smurfing issue, it is not an issue...

The important point is, that account got reported enough to have the replays sent to a number of investigators and the majority voted that it was cheating evident beyond a reasonable doubt.

[JK_Mooney]

The e-mails go to me....he doesn't know my e-mail password. We use the "family share" option so I keep that under my control.

Haven't investigated friends brining/sending cheats....although we don't let guests use our machines (but some are allowed to use our WiFi)

[Forcen]

So he doesnt own CS:GO? Does he have his own account or not?

[JK_Mooney]

By the way, for those of you who are genuinely helping me invtigate this. Thanks. I'm OK with a little skepticism given the seemly high level of faith in Overwatch, and I hope you'll appreciate my skepticism that the system is incapable of a false-positive.

However, straight-up trolls have all been reported to the mods.