Discussion: Boss fights

[B✪✪tsy]

I don't know about you, but I usually hate them in games. They are often unskippable artificial hurdles that prevents you from playing the rest of the game if you don't beat the boss.

Back in the beginning of computer games boss fights were a common thing in games and most games had them. This was simply due to the fact that computers and the programming were very limited back then. So the most logical thing for developers to do was adding artificial difficulty hurdles to prolong the gameplay and add extra challenges for the players.

Today developers still add boss fights to games. Only now it is not due to the limitations of technology and programming, but to often it is out of lazyness and lack of creativiy of developers.

There are some games where boss fights are still suited and should be in the game such as 'super hero/villian' games like Batman and stuff, I get that. But even then there should always be a way to either skip them or cheat them in 'single player' games. In other games boss fights just feels lame and cheesy and it a very bad way of locking players out of content (that they payed for).

To all devs in the world. For the love of god, if you add boss fights in a single player game then always add an option to skip it, cheat it or an other more inventive way to get around 'artificial hurdles' that locks players out of the rest of the story and prevents them from finishing the game.

I have been gaming almost my entire life (since Pong). I am simply to old to do the same boss fight 50 times just to progress with the story and gameplay. I just want to relax and have fun while being immersed with the game story, I don't want to spend hours on beating 1 boss, because the devs are to lazy to up come with other inventive gameplay features.You are ruining your own games with it if you lock players out of the rest of the content. I have at least a dozen unfinished games in my library due to unskippable boss fights. All of those games have gameplay that is not hard even on hardest settings... besides the frikkin boss fights... and that is just stupid.

And the youngsters among you will probably say 'get good', but that's not the point really. I have done the challenges and boss fights in my life, I play games to relax nowaydays, not to be sweating and cramping behind my PC just to beat an artificial gameplay hurdle.

I am right about this. Yes/no?

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

No.

[B✪✪tsy]

cSg|mc-Hotsauce の投稿を引用：

No.

:qr:

Okay, why?

[Start_Running]

No. Boss fights are basically just there to break up the monotony and create high-points in the inetrest curves. Go play Galaga, or SPace Invaders, see how tedious the repetition gets after a while.

[Kargor]

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

I don't know about you, but I usually hate them in games. They are often unskippable artificial hurdles that prevents you from playing the rest of the game if you don't beat the boss.

Yeah, same here. More often than not I put a game on "easy" since I have to assume that they difficulty-spike the bosses, or the last level, and you can't usually adjust difficulty midgame.

Sometimes bosses are OK, but it feels like an exception.

[B✪✪tsy]

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

No. Boss fights are basically just there to break up the monotony and create high-points in the inetrest curves. Go play Galaga, or SPace Invaders, see how tedious the repetition gets after a while.

But as I've said. Boss fights originates from thechnical and programming limitations. It is the most lazy and cheesy way for a developers to create hurdles in a game. There is nothing inventive or creative about it. They are just grabbing the almost oldest game mechanic in history, because of lack of creativy and to reduce development time of a game. It is basically develpers that are cutting corners to deliver a finished product 'with challenges'.

[B✪✪tsy]

Kargor の投稿を引用：

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

I don't know about you, but I usually hate them in games. They are often unskippable artificial hurdles that prevents you from playing the rest of the game if you don't beat the boss.

Yeah, same here. More often than not I put a game on "easy" since I have to assume that they difficulty-spike the bosses, or the last level, and you can't usually adjust difficulty midgame.

Sometimes bosses are OK, but it feels like an exception.

Yep. The Batman games is a good example I think. The gameplay in those games is easy even on hardest settings... till you meet a boss. I believe I played Batman Origins a few week ago. I came up to a boss that was just over the top compared to the normal gameplay difficulty. I looked up a video of that boss fight and the guy in the video was sweating and spamming his keyboard for 10 minutes to beat the boss. I just want to skip that bullcrap and continue with the story :)

[feytharn]

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

Start_Running の投稿を引用：

No. Boss fights are basically just there to break up the monotony and create high-points in the inetrest curves. Go play Galaga, or SPace Invaders, see how tedious the repetition gets after a while.

But as I've said. Boss fights originates from thechnical and programming limitations. It is the most lazy and cheesy way for a developers to create hurdles in a game. There is nothing inventive or creative about it. The are just grabbing the almost oldest game mechanic in history, because of lack of creativy and to reduce development time of a game. It is basically develpers that are cutting corners to deliver a finished product 'with challenges'.

I disagree with you here. bossfights in games like Dragons Dogma, Divinity Original Sin 2, Dragon age Inqisition (well more the dragon fights then the bossfights there, but still) are nothing like you describe them. Even bossfights that are basically learn/adapt pattern can be and are being made interesting AND challenging.

[feytharn]

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

Kargor の投稿を引用：

Yeah, same here. More often than not I put a game on "easy" since I have to assume that they difficulty-spike the bosses, or the last level, and you can't usually adjust difficulty midgame.

Sometimes bosses are OK, but it feels like an exception.

Yep. The Batman games is a good example I think. The gameplay in those games is easy even on hardest settings... till you meet a boss. I believe I played Batman Origins a few week ago. I came up to a boss that was just over the top compared to the normal gameplay difficulty. I looked up a video of that boss fight and the guy in the video was sweating and spamming his keyboard for 10 minutes to beat the boss. I just want to skip that bullcrap and continue with the story :)

And that is you not liking bossfights. That is fine but has absolutely nothing to do with 'They are just grabbing the almost oldest game mechanic in history, because of lack of creativy and to reduce development time of a game. It is basically develpers that are cutting corners to deliver a finished product 'with challenges'. That is just some made up justification to make your taste seem a little superior.

[B✪✪tsy]

feytharn の投稿を引用：

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

But as I've said. Boss fights originates from thechnical and programming limitations. It is the most lazy and cheesy way for a developers to create hurdles in a game. There is nothing inventive or creative about it. The are just grabbing the almost oldest game mechanic in history, because of lack of creativy and to reduce development time of a game. It is basically develpers that are cutting corners to deliver a finished product 'with challenges'.

I disagree with you here. bossfights in games like Dragons Dogma, Divinity Original Sin 2, Dragon age Inqisition (well more the dragon fights then the bossfights there, but still) are nothing like you describe them. Even bossfights that are basically learn/adapt pattern can be and are being made interesting AND challenging.

I only played Dragon Age that you mentioned. In that game you can cheat the 'artificial hurdles'. In that case I don't mind boss fights that much as I can get past them and continue to enjoy the story and adventure. Those devs at least understood that not everyone likes boss fight hurdels, but play games for the immersion and the story.

[feytharn]

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

feytharn の投稿を引用：

I disagree with you here. bossfights in games like Dragons Dogma, Divinity Original Sin 2, Dragon age Inqisition (well more the dragon fights then the bossfights there, but still) are nothing like you describe them. Even bossfights that are basically learn/adapt pattern can be and are being made interesting AND challenging.

I only played Dragon Age that you mentioned. In that game you can cheat the 'artificial hurdles'. In that case I don't mind boss fights that much as I can get past them and continue to enjoy the story and adventure. Those devs at least understood that not everyone likes boss fight hurdels, but play games for the immersion and the story.

Again: I get that you don't like bossfights. I often prefer to get on with the story myself. Where I disagree is that you try hard to make your dislike seem like objectively inferior gamedesign instead of just a matter of taste.

[B✪✪tsy]

feytharn の投稿を引用：

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

Yep. The Batman games is a good example I think. The gameplay in those games is easy even on hardest settings... till you meet a boss. I believe I played Batman Origins a few week ago. I came up to a boss that was just over the top compared to the normal gameplay difficulty. I looked up a video of that boss fight and the guy in the video was sweating and spamming his keyboard for 10 minutes to beat the boss. I just want to skip that bullcrap and continue with the story :)

And that is you not liking bossfights. That is fine but has absolutely nothing to do with 'They are just grabbing the almost oldest game mechanic in history, because of lack of creativy and to reduce development time of a game. It is basically develpers that are cutting corners to deliver a finished product 'with challenges'. That is just some made up justification to make your taste seem a little superior.

There is nothing creative and inventive about that mechanic, devs usually don't even bother to do something new with it. Thats no justification, but an observation.

[cSg|mc-Hotsauce]

Dark Souls and Serious Sam games. All pretty good boss fights that provided challenges to overcome.

[B✪✪tsy]

feytharn の投稿を引用：

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

I only played Dragon Age that you mentioned. In that game you can cheat the 'artificial hurdles'. In that case I don't mind boss fights that much as I can get past them and continue to enjoy the story and adventure. Those devs at least understood that not everyone likes boss fight hurdels, but play games for the immersion and the story.

Again: I get that you don't like bossfights. I often prefer to get on with the story myself. Where I disagree is that you try hard to make your dislike seem like objectively inferior gamedesign instead of just a matter of taste.

Do you agree that boss fights should not lock the player out of the rest of the game? Are you against skippable (in any way) boss fights in a single player game?

[feytharn]

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

feytharn の投稿を引用：

Again: I get that you don't like bossfights. I often prefer to get on with the story myself. Where I disagree is that you try hard to make your dislike seem like objectively inferior gamedesign instead of just a matter of taste.

Do you agree that boss fights should not lock the player out of the rest of the game? Are you against skippable (in any way) boss gifgts in a single player game?

No, I don't agree. Neither do I agree with your 'observation'. You can say that about pretty much every single aspect of a game (i find fighting boring and unoriginal, I find traps boring and unoriginal, I find riddles boring and unoriginal, I find upgarding my nation/character/vehicle boring and unoriginal, I find exploration boring and unoriginal etc). A developer trying to resolve this would have to make every aspect of a game skippable without real consequences to the rest of the game and I doubt that is possible.

[B✪✪tsy]

feytharn の投稿を引用：

B00tsy の投稿を引用：

Do you agree that boss fights should not lock the player out of the rest of the game? Are you against skippable (in any way) boss gifgts in a single player game?

No, I don't agree. Neither do I agree with your 'observation'. You can say that about pretty much every single aspect of a game (i find fighting boring and unoriginal, I find traps boring and unoriginal, I find riddles boring and unoriginal, I find upgarding my nation/character/vehicle boring and unoriginal, I find exploration boring and unoriginal etc). A developer trying to resolve this would have to make every aspect of a game skippable without real consequences to the rest of the game and I doubt that is possible.

We are talking about single player games, you are aware of that right. Tell me the positive part about locking players out of the game content.... that payed 60 bucks for the game. Why should it not be an option to cheat, skip or a more 'invenitve' way to get past the boss fight?