What is the purpose of moderation in games and forums?

[Zeno]

What is the purpose of moderation in games and forums?

There is a mute function everywhere nowadays. Like, let people say what they want, its just words online. I don't see the purpose of moderation and putting ressources into this.

[Zeno]

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

I think you need to learn that your opinion is not a fact and you accusing me of things and claiming things about me is not going to make your statements any more credible but rather the opposite. Are you aware of this ?

Not sure if this is how you always try to force your views and positions on to people in discussions, but its certainly not my way hence I am not going to say anything anymore to you.

Agreed to disagree. Check.

Your opinion does not equate to fact either, such as moderation being obsolete due to mute and block features existing.

Never said my opinion is a fact.

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por Tito Shivan:

It's worth noting even "wretched hives of scum and villainy" like the Chans DO HAVE MODS.

Couple of the IRCs I used to hang out in growing up, people would actively share info to phish/Dox public officials. Even we had channel operators, IRCops, etc.

Literally every form of social outlet/gathering has some sort of moderation to it.

Which still does not make moderation useful or less obsolete lol.

[Leonardo Da Pinchi]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Your opinion does not equate to fact either, such as moderation being obsolete due to mute and block features existing.

Never said my opinion is a fact.

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Couple of the IRCs I used to hang out in growing up, people would actively share info to phish/Dox public officials. Even we had channel operators, IRCops, etc.

Literally every form of social outlet/gathering has some sort of moderation to it.

Which still does not make moderation useful or less obsolete lol.

Schrodinger's Moderation, whereas it is both obsolete and not obsolete.

[Zeno]

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Block and mute solves the problem as the problem is people getting bothered by trolls and toxicity.

A technical moderation to take care of phishing and an automated system to prevent spam are a completely different topic, same goes for people who commit crimes such as terrorist threats and so on.

We are talking about the moderation of toxic behaviour and people throwing insults. This is simply not needed unless you want to boost your ego by getting hurtful people banned rather than throwing them on your block list.

And why are you ignoring my statements about people getting banned for disagreeing or having a non/popular narrative political position ? In your time as a moderator you have censored people all the time, so would you not be an expert on the topic anyway ?

Block and mute doesn't solve the problem of patterns of abusive behavior however, whereas moderation does.

It does solve it as everyone toxic people engage can just mute them, preventing them from having any effect. Plus common sense.

If you act out of place all the time, people simply won't talk to you anymore. No one needs a moderator to shut someone down.

Are you scared of someone's words ?


I guess we won't find common grounds here. Cheers.

[Leonardo Da Pinchi]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Block and mute doesn't solve the problem of patterns of abusive behavior however, whereas moderation does.

It does solve it as everyone toxic people engage can just mute them, preventing them from having any effect. Plus common sense.

If you act out of place all the time, people simply won't talk to you anymore. No one needs a moderator to shut someone down.

Are you scared of someone's words ?


I guess we won't find common grounds here. Cheers.

I mean I guess I'll just adhere to the stereotype then, why do you justify and enable toxic behavior if not toxic oneself?

[Zeno]

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

It does solve it as everyone toxic people engage can just mute them, preventing them from having any effect. Plus common sense.

If you act out of place all the time, people simply won't talk to you anymore. No one needs a moderator to shut someone down.

Are you scared of someone's words ?


I guess we won't find common grounds here. Cheers.

I mean I guess I'll just adhere to the stereotype then, why do you justify and enable toxic behavior if not toxic oneself?

Because I believe that "TOXIC behaviour " is used way too lightly and quickly and even non-toxic behaviours are marked as such and then wrongfully punished, such as my bans which ALL have been revoked by Steam Valve immediately.

Comprende ?

[Leonardo Da Pinchi]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

I mean I guess I'll just adhere to the stereotype then, why do you justify and enable toxic behavior if not toxic oneself?

Because I believe that "TOXIC behaviour " is used way too lightly and quickly and even non-toxic behaviours are marked as such and then wrongfully punished, such as my bans which ALL have been revoked by Steam Valve immediately.

Comprende ?

I mean if you're getting banned from game hubs, don't use those hubs any more, it's obvious the moderation there don't want you there.

If it's general steam forums, that's a different kettle of fish since Steam moderators actually have a set of rules they're supposed to adhere to.

However, nobody is OBLIGATED to provide a platform, one way or the other. And toxic behavior did indeed have its consequences even pre-internet days.

[Zeno]

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Because I believe that "TOXIC behaviour " is used way too lightly and quickly and even non-toxic behaviours are marked as such and then wrongfully punished, such as my bans which ALL have been revoked by Steam Valve immediately.

Comprende ?

I mean if you're getting banned from game hubs, don't use those hubs any more, it's obvious the moderation there don't want you there.

If it's general steam forums, that's a different kettle of fish since Steam moderators actually have a set of rules they're supposed to adhere to.

However, nobody is OBLIGATED to provide a platform, one way or the other. And toxic behavior did indeed have its consequences even pre-internet days.

I read the steam rules and they can be stretched a lot. A moderator can literally mark EVERYTHING as combative behaviour or a disturbance. Literally.

No one is obligated to do anything, lol. You said that around a 1000 times. BUT a company usually has the goal to provide a fair and good environment for its customers and this is not happening by enabling mods to act this loosely.

You are basically saying (on every thread you participate I might mention) that criticism is not allowed and pointless as the owner of this platform can do (legally) whatever the hell they want.

How is that going for you ?

[Leonardo Da Pinchi]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

I mean if you're getting banned from game hubs, don't use those hubs any more, it's obvious the moderation there don't want you there.

If it's general steam forums, that's a different kettle of fish since Steam moderators actually have a set of rules they're supposed to adhere to.

However, nobody is OBLIGATED to provide a platform, one way or the other. And toxic behavior did indeed have its consequences even pre-internet days.

I read the steam rules and they can be stretched a lot. A moderator can literally mark EVERYTHING as combative behaviour or a disturbance. Literally.

No one is obligated to do anything, lol. You said that around a 1000 times. BUT a company usually has the goal to provide a fair and good environment for its customers and this is not happening by enabling mods to act this loosely.

You are basically saying (on every thread you participate I might mention) that criticism is not allowed and pointless as the owner of this platform can do (legally) whatever the hell they want.

How is that going for you ?

Devs can indeed delete criticism if they feel it's not constructive, yes. It's their hub.

I got perm banned from Domina's game hub for telling people who were joking about Trans suicide rates that if they didn't like Steam's ToS, they could find another platform.

Devs have complete control of their game hubs, and can moderate it as they see fit.

That's quite literally how it works.

Keep in mind, there's also a difference between complaining/bashing a product/dev and constructive criticism. "Game is buggy, dev sucks" isn't considered constructive for example.

However, that has nothing to do with "moderation" and more with the absolute freedom given to Devs.

[Zeno]

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

I read the steam rules and they can be stretched a lot. A moderator can literally mark EVERYTHING as combative behaviour or a disturbance. Literally.

No one is obligated to do anything, lol. You said that around a 1000 times. BUT a company usually has the goal to provide a fair and good environment for its customers and this is not happening by enabling mods to act this loosely.

You are basically saying (on every thread you participate I might mention) that criticism is not allowed and pointless as the owner of this platform can do (legally) whatever the hell they want.

How is that going for you ?

Devs can indeed delete criticism if they feel it's not constructive, yes. It's their hub.

I got perm banned from Domina's game hub for telling people who were joking about Trans suicide rates that if they didn't like Steam's ToS, they could find another platform.

Devs have complete control of their game hubs, and can moderate it as they see fit.

That's quite literally how it works.

Keep in mind, there's also a difference between complaining/bashing a product/dev and constructive criticism. "Game is buggy, dev sucks" isn't considered constructive for example.

However, that has nothing to do with "moderation" and more with the absolute freedom given to Devs.

Its quite tiring.

Reminds me of winning in chess against a pigeon, the pigeon will still jump the board and throw all the figures down.

Have a good day.

[Leonardo Da Pinchi]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Devs can indeed delete criticism if they feel it's not constructive, yes. It's their hub.

I got perm banned from Domina's game hub for telling people who were joking about Trans suicide rates that if they didn't like Steam's ToS, they could find another platform.

Devs have complete control of their game hubs, and can moderate it as they see fit.

That's quite literally how it works.

Keep in mind, there's also a difference between complaining/bashing a product/dev and constructive criticism. "Game is buggy, dev sucks" isn't considered constructive for example.

However, that has nothing to do with "moderation" and more with the absolute freedom given to Devs.

Its quite tiring.

Reminds me of winning in chess against a pigeon, the pigeon will still jump the board and throw all the figures down.

Have a good day.

Which is why I suggested just not going to hubs with Devs who're a bit more "generous" with their bans.

WarThunder did it when they screwed over the repair system for f2p players, Diablo 4's doing it to silence people who're upset with the game, etc.

Less to do with moderation, more to do with Dev's freedom/lack of structure attributed across game hubs.

[Tito Shivan]

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

Block and mute solves the problem as the problem is people getting bothered by trolls and toxicity.

It solves A problem. Not THE problem.

Me not looking in disgust at a toddler plastering the walls with crap doesn't solve the wall being littered.

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

We are talking about the moderation of toxic behavior and people throwing insults. This is simply not needed

Yes it is actually needed. Both behaviors are against the rules. And the rules states the penalties of not abiding to them.

Escrito originalmente por 4RR0W:

And why are you ignoring my statements about people getting banned for disagreeing or having a non/popular narrative political position ? In your time as a moderator you have censored people all the time, so would you not be an expert on the topic anyway ?

This quote self explains it. I won't drink of a poisoned well.

Escrito originalmente por Leonardo Da Pinchi:

Less to do with moderation, more to do with Dev's freedom/lack of structure attributed across game hubs.

This isn't about the need of moderation as much as it's about certain styles of moderation.

As a service provider Steam had a choice to make. Who has the upper hand on a game discussion forum: Steam or the Dev? Since they allow devs to completely opt out of Steam moderation they've decided to go down the Reddit Route. Let devs manage their own communities, set their own rules and only intervene at an upper layer.

And just like in Reddit, it means you're going to find all shades of moderation and community management. But that doesn't mean moderation in itself has no purpose.

It's probably for the better to stop seeing the whole of Steam Forums as a homogeneous place and more like we look at Reddit, or Discord.

[The nameless Gamer]

I'm afraid I can't relate to you, OP, because I don't feel oppressed by the moderation and the rules on this platform. I've been in opinion clashes and disagreements way many more times than I would have liked it. Maybe even been slightly rude sometimes myself. My impression is that it's not WHAT you are saying, but HOW you are wording it that can be the problem. It's not the opinion that gets someone banned, it's the choice of words.

[Pocahawtness]

Words can be very damaging.
Freedom of speech has never included the right to lie or the right to insult or hurt people.
Society needs rules or it descends in to chaos, because there are a lot of very stupid, manipulative, hurtful people out there.

[Sidakte]

im all for freedom of speech.
but at some point myself received a community ban.
later on i found out that it only comes if someone gets banned from multiple forums.
i only post here, maybe i have some posts on cs2 forum too, can't recall.
thing is that if i broke the rules somehow, then ok i could roll with that ban like i stated to the support when i opened a ticket about it.
but the mods lifted it. the reason for it was simply one word: "spamming".
perhaps i did spam, or perhaps i was reported. i don't know.
all i know is that forums need mods. and not just for perhaps couple people that may get funky.

[REALiNSaNgAMingGODPrODIgY]

this dude really copyed my post, crazy