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🌠Deusgo 2024 年 10 月 29 日 上午 4:35
Is communism good on paper?
Clearly it don’t work in humans, the person at the top tends to be a ♥♥♥♥ bag, but with another civilisation, that of robots per say, without greed or the need to hate see it fruitful?
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Ni-Neith 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:33 
引用自 Fumo Bnnuy n Frends
the idea was made by basically a "bum" who refused to work so much so his own son died when he got ill and refused to help out.

on paper sharing is caring is good
but in reality not so much



there are only so many "rich" and "bountiful" people.

instead of having a moderate house for everyone.

it'd be more like clown car-ing everyone into a house usually homeless or poorer people.

Everyone will get something to eat but rations will be cut to give everyone a small piece vs some moderate or a lot and others none

putting a $60k bonus for top employee every month may seem like a lot
but try it with $1k even $100 guaranteed bonus for every employee

1. they won't care much nor see the value in it
2. they won't work as hard or compete for it
3. it'll cost more

spending a few $$$$$ per person a small piece of meat a piece of bread etc really amounts once realize we're a billion + people on earth. if everyone had an equal share then we'd be at a disadvantage and it's not just once but every day / week / month.
people gotta eat sleep with a roof over their heads etc.




you can look no other than private vs public sector

private sectors thrive because of competition and people invest into them.

public doesn't b/c it's all funded by the government and people. You can splurge 5 trillion bajillion billion dollars on useless stuff that doesn't work no one will care

do even a fraction of that in a private sector and people will not only notice but try to actively run you out of anything to do with them.


airlines were once private now they're given government grants and look how far they've fallen sadly.



it's in the name COMMUN-ism
COMMUNE

meaning a small group
not
a large group of people


communism may work in a smallish group of around what $100 or so?
but once the next 1 person over the quota is added things start to go south fast.

The first communes 2000 years ago:

https://www.bible.com/bible/compare/ACT.4.32-37
Acts 4:32-37 New Century Version (NCV)
The group of believers were united in their hearts and spirit. All those in the group acted as though their private property belonged to everyone in the group. In fact, they shared everything. With great power the apostles were telling people that the Lord Jesus was truly raised from the dead. And God blessed all the believers very much. There were no needy people among them. From time to time those who owned fields or houses sold them, brought the money, and gave it to the apostles. Then the money was given to anyone who needed it. One of the believers was named Joseph, a Levite born in Cyprus. The apostles called him Barnabas (which means “one who encourages”). Joseph owned a field, sold it, brought the money, and gave it to the apostles.
最后由 Ni-Neith 编辑于; 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:16
Birds 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:34 
no, it's a problematic response to capitalism. "if we all must be slaves, then we should be enslaved together. in mutuality."

you'll find socialism also values the social factor over the reality of the individual.

without capitalism's presupposition of slavery neither really makes any sense; they're just critiques of a flawed system, not any kind of answer for it.
最后由 Birds 编辑于; 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:38
kingjames488 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:35 
引用自 Birds
no, it's a problematic response to capitalism. if we all must be slaves, then we should be enslaved together. in mutuality.
good news...
Birds 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:38 
引用自 kingjames488
引用自 Birds
no, it's a problematic response to capitalism. if we all must be slaves, then we should be enslaved together. in mutuality.
good news...

i added quotation marks to ease the process of not interpreting everything I say backwards.
kingjames488 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:41 
引用自 Birds
引用自 kingjames488
good news...

i added quotation marks to ease the process of not interpreting everything I say backwards.
it actually didn't change anything... weird how I seem to be in some inverted parallel universe where it's all backwards but it was backwards when you posted it so I see it right-side-up...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNj8mJq65i4
Dialectical Femboism 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:51 
It's a good system when implemented correctly. Market socialism has had varying degrees of success.
Xero_Daxter 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:53 
It's a good system when implemented correctly. Market socialism has had varying degrees of success.
Isn’t socialism a dollar store version of communism?
Birds 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:54 
引用自 kingjames488
引用自 Birds

i added quotation marks to ease the process of not interpreting everything I say backwards.
it actually didn't change anything... weird how I seem to be in some inverted parallel universe where it's all backwards but it was backwards when you posted it so I see it right-side-up...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNj8mJq65i4

we've tried to explain the reversal to god innumerable times, it's one of the things he's incapable of understanding. similar to looking inside the cube through his back door.
kingjames488 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 4:56 
引用自 Birds
引用自 kingjames488
it actually didn't change anything... weird how I seem to be in some inverted parallel universe where it's all backwards but it was backwards when you posted it so I see it right-side-up...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNj8mJq65i4

we've tried to explain the reversal to god innumerable times, it's one of the things he's incapable of understanding. similar to looking inside the cube through his back door.
but it breaks down because "god" is illogical...
Birds 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:01 
引用自 kingjames488
引用自 Birds

we've tried to explain the reversal to god innumerable times, it's one of the things he's incapable of understanding. similar to looking inside the cube through his back door.
but it breaks down because "god" is illogical...

illogical machines are truly diffficult to parse.

in a sense, his incomprehensibility and inconsistent behavior is what makes him such a rife subject for worship.
最后由 Birds 编辑于; 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:02
Dialectical Femboism 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:01 
引用自 Xero_Daxter
It's a good system when implemented correctly. Market socialism has had varying degrees of success.
Isn’t socialism a dollar store version of communism?

Nah, it's more like socialism is practical communism. Technically, there has never actually been an actual "communist state" and the term itself is hyperbolic since communism is meant to be state-less. Communism would really require a post-scarce economy to function and that just isn't attainable right now. Socialism is primarily characterized by social in reality worker ownership over the means of production.
Dutchgamer1982 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:33 
引用自 Xero_Daxter
Isn’t socialism a dollar store version of communism?

Nah, it's more like socialism is practical communism. Technically, there has never actually been an actual "communist state" and the term itself is hyperbolic since communism is meant to be state-less. Communism would really require a post-scarce economy to function and that just isn't attainable right now. Socialism is primarily characterized by social in reality worker ownership over the means of production.

liberalism - the game is fully free to play.. male up your own rules amarchy!

socialism - the game can be played freely, but the goverment set the games rules.

communism - the goverment deciedes the piece you play with..and plays your turn for you.. as well as setting the rules. no freedom at all.

basicly socialism is capitalism with rules. while true capitalism ia anarchy.
最后由 Dutchgamer1982 编辑于; 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:34
Dialectical Femboism 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 5:55 
引用自 Dutchgamer1982

Nah, it's more like socialism is practical communism. Technically, there has never actually been an actual "communist state" and the term itself is hyperbolic since communism is meant to be state-less. Communism would really require a post-scarce economy to function and that just isn't attainable right now. Socialism is primarily characterized by social in reality worker ownership over the means of production.

liberalism - the game is fully free to play.. male up your own rules amarchy!

socialism - the game can be played freely, but the goverment set the games rules.

communism - the goverment deciedes the piece you play with..and plays your turn for you.. as well as setting the rules. no freedom at all.

basicly socialism is capitalism with rules. while true capitalism ia anarchy.

Ehhhhh it's actually much more different from that. Socialism is it's own thing. Socialism is strictly defined by social ownership (which often translates to worker ownership) over the means of production. This can be instituted through several methods. Market socialism in which there is a blend of social ownership over the means of production, while also being dictated by market factors of supply and demand. There is Marxism-Leninism. That's your USSR and various other "communist" states. There is even libertarian socialism, which advocates for a decentralized form of social ownership over the means of production without the need for an authoritative state.
Othobrithol 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 7:04 
When judging any sort of "ism" I find it wise to consider the cultural context. It is too easy to mistake outcomes from cultural issues (eg stalinism as just a continuation of the czars, maoism as the newest incarnation of the mandate from heaven) as being caused by whatever new social movement is spreading. Democracy for instance, did not cause, by some intrinsic aspect of the ideology, the bloodbath that followed the French Revolution.

All I know for certain is that the ideal balance between the right to accumulate wealth vs the right to share the bounty of civilization has been debated since the dawn of man, and will remain so for certainly as long as I live. But I also know that we have not found that balance point, despite the insistence of the devotees of Laissez-faire.
tom blu 2024 年 10 月 29 日 下午 7:55 
People like to say "communism works in theory but not in practice", but we don't actually have any good examples. There's never really been a truly communist or socialist state (I use these terms interchangeably, though they do differ slightly). Communism cannot exist in a vacuum. As long as the world runs on a global capitalist economy, then any communist state inevitably has to start playing the capitalist game. It becomes a question of resources. No single nation has access to all the resources they'd need to maintain what has become an acceptable quality of life, i.e. any nation that tried would eventually regress to pre-industrial living.

The only place we can really observe anything that resembles communism in a broad sense is in the animal kingdom. Eusocial species - ants, termites, bees, naked mole-rats, and a few others. We consider this to be the highest order of sociality. It's incredibly efficient and the species that have adopted it have been extremely successful, some of them for millions of years.

The problem with adopting it into human societies is that, generally speaking, it sacrifices the individual for the benefit of the group. And most people can't, or won't accept that. We're too empathetic, compassionate, and consciously aware. Take Covid as an example. A eusocial species would have just let it run it's course. You isolate the infected, let them die off, and let the virus die with it. Then it's gone forever. We'd never have to deal with it again. If you zoom out, this is ultimately the better outcome, but of course, if those are your friends and family it's like, ♥♥♥♥ that. It's intolerable, so we find a way. The hive takes a hit, becomes weaker overall, but we don't have to suffer so much as individuals.

There's a false dichotomy in this conversation. The U.S. fought a cultural and ideological war with the Soviet Union, and so any mention of communism is immediately shot down and treated with suspicion in the western world. Some of it is warranted, but a lot of it is just propaganda. Pure capitalism would be just as a bad a nightmare as pure communism. But it doesn't have to be one or the other. We're not ants. We've got these big human brains. We can find a healthy balance. We're just in a situation where the established power structures are too deeply embedded. Nothing will change until we hit breaking point. And by then it will be too late. We're doing irreparable damage to the Earth. Right now is most certainly one of the best times to be alive. I don't envy future generations. Quality of life goes down from here.
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所有讨论 > Steam 论坛 > Off Topic > 主题详情
发帖日期: 2024 年 10 月 29 日 上午 4:35
回复数: 91