So why are foreigners in Finnland stripped off their rights ?

[SvarogX]

So why are foreigners in Finnland stripped off their rights ?

Basically, most Finnish people have guns and most men serve in the military until 40+ or older as reserves.

When Russia invades, they all can organise themselves, defend their homes and survive.

If you are a foreigner, you can't have a gun nor are you allowed to join any type of home defense / military unit to train and be prepared.

I think this is like taking away the rights off a human, right for self-defence and right for not being harmed.

I think Finnland should have more trust in migrants who live there, especially if they are from culturally similar countries such as Denmark, Germany, Sweden and so on.

They constantly talk about how Russia is threatening them and an invasion is a huge risk, yet they only arm and train some choosen people.
In my eyes, everyone who lives in Finnland, pays his rent or bought a property, should have the right to carry a gun and get military training, man I would even pay to get some military training here, fine by me.

But being isolated and discriminated isn't all that cool if you have a family to protect.

[Voroff]

Opprinnelig skrevet av videogames10:

Some foreigners may be spies or russian sympathizers. They're certainly not going to tell you that. You never really know what a person's true intentions are. russia has been known to plant spies and spread anti-West/U.S. propaganda throughout the world.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=2k7YTFrmt84
From 8'22 to 34 minutes more or less.


About the topic : hey OP the changing name ones, nameless one, you decided not to go to the US because the green card is not allowed for non-vaxxed, right ?

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Echo NO Aim:

Also Finland is part of Nato. Russia won't invade or Article 5 strikes.

So? If Russia attacks, I have to sit here and watch them destroy my family

If you so fear the evil russian guys that you have considered to leave Germany ... in the center of europe ... behind the steroided Poland ... to ... Finland, bordering Russia. Riiiiight. Remind me why in the heck you're willing to leave Germany ? Something to do with the AfD party ?

[Q-T_3.14.exe]

You need to have lived in Finland for 5 years for you to join the Finnish Defense Forces.
At least that's what I remember. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Dutchgamer1982]

if somebody is a guest in my house.. they will have to follow my rules.
that means their freedom is limited yes.
I would not want guests with weapons in my house either.
if they want to have their full freedom, they should go back to their own house.

I may be a generous host.. but no you are not just to dive into my fridge and grab yourself something to eat.. you wait till I offer you something or you ask me if you may have something. If I say no after you asking you have to accept that.

If you need to store your own stuff same thing.. you not just pull open my fridge and put it in.. you either don't or ask permissing and if I say no.. than you have to accept that.

You are not allowed to open any closet.. no going trough my stuff or go look for a place to store yours... if you want to store your stuff.. ask for a place to store it.. and I apoint you one..

ofcourse to make life a bit livable a generous host might offer you some freedoms.. like I will place charger near you.. give you a minifridge to use for your own needs.. and the guesroom where you may use all the closets in... and you may use the old computer/laptop to acces the interent.
(so basicly as a host I grand you certain default permissions.. I am not OBLIGATED to grand any.. but I grand some and basicly by that say this is what you are allowed to do without asking.. anything else ASK)

if your abuse these permissions.. say I gave you permisssion to use any toilet but you happen to sit on it for an hour.. so nobody else can go.. and stink up the room more than an normal person would.. I may during your stay restrict your acces.. and say you can only use the toilet downstairs not the one in the bathrooom.
..
or if you set the tv way to loud.. at way to early hours.. than I may force you to wear a headphone when watching or just ban you from using it before and after 10hour.
if you cannot walk of the stairs like a normal person and stomp like an elephant.. you guessed it.. I will ban you from going downstairs when others are still sleeping...

behave well.. and as a host I will extend your freedoms.. behave badly and you get less..
a reaaaal well behaved guest might even get permissions similair to my kids if i had them.
but you are still a guest.. so you won't ever get the same rights as me (and if I had one my wife) who are owners.

[Siluva]

Sounds just like common sense to me.

[Asha]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Ah so if I get citizenship I am not a foreigner anymore out of the blue ?

That’s what citizenship means, legally, and you are talking about legal rights - so yes. Ethnically, only native Finns can ever be Finnish.

[DoomsDay]

maybe Finnland government is already compromised by foreigners or immigrant,those that are in office find it pointless ,the foreigners outside the office can still wave their guns at locals.

[JacquesPatat]

now i didn't look at self defence but looked at ways to get gun licence/guns in Finnland and that is to either apply for hunting licence or if you are a foreigner and have a hunting licence from your own country or take their hunting exam.

I mean yes hunting and defending yourself against intruders is two different things but a gun, is a gun

[A&A]

And are you a citizen? I guess you are not.
What is the problem?
It's the same as why you can't vote for Finnish politicians.

[Hobbit XIII]

Seems very sensible, in my humble opinion.

If I lived in Norway I would like to join in with the training but if it is true that it is for Finnish only I can understand that.

My problem with it would be personal ego that I would feel like dead-weight to a country that let me stay in it.

[Q-T_3.14.exe]

Opprinnelig skrevet av 𝙰𝚜𝚑𝚊:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Ah so if I get citizenship I am not a foreigner anymore out of the blue ?

That’s what citizenship means, legally, and you are talking about legal rights - so yes. Ethnically, only native Finns can ever be Finnish.

Funny story. People used to think I was a foreigner despite being a native Finn born and raised in this cold and dark forest filled land.

[NW/RL]

Noncitizens are not afforded the privileges citizens are granted. Hope this helps

[Dutchgamer1982]

Opprinnelig skrevet av 𝙰𝚜𝚑𝚊:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Ah so if I get citizenship I am not a foreigner anymore out of the blue ?

That’s what citizenship means, legally, and you are talking about legal rights - so yes. Ethnically, only native Finns can ever be Finnish.

modern states give passports away.. but personally I not believe a nationally can ever be given like that.

and my nation consideres people autochtone (or native) if all 4 your grandparents were born here
the rest is allochtone.

we even differentiate between western and non western allochtones (aka those with different cultures but similair genes and those with VERY different cultures and genes)

a nationality is of the blood... so foreigners NEVER can become native.. and always will remain guests.. mine and other states that see it otherwise I believe see it wrong.

I even don't think that the "if your grandparents are born here you are native" rule is good enough.
if foreigners only marry foreigners... even if those foreigners are born here.. they still never will become native they may eventually not belong in their homecountry anymore either but become their own national group...

It needs inmixing and have their offspring have at least 50% genes of the original population.. ALONGSIDE complete cultural assimilation.. before a group can be considered naturalised to me. the rest always will be foreigners and should not have votingrights of be considered of my nationality.

but merely "guests we allow to work and live here under OUR rules"

[SvarogX]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Q-T_3.14.exe:

You need to have lived in Finland for 5 years for you to join the Finnish Defense Forces.
At least that's what I remember. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think you need citizenship first, also by them I am probably too old.

Opprinnelig skrevet av 𝙰𝚜𝚑𝚊:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Ah so if I get citizenship I am not a foreigner anymore out of the blue ?

That’s what citizenship means, legally, and you are talking about legal rights - so yes. Ethnically, only native Finns can ever be Finnish.

You sound like a complete racist as this wasn't really what this topic was about.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hobbit XIII:

Seems very sensible, in my humble opinion.

If I lived in Norway I would like to join in with the training but if it is true that it is for Finnish only I can understand that.

My problem with it would be personal ego that I would feel like dead-weight to a country that let me stay in it.

Yes same here. I want to be part of it and ready. You will never be part of a country and culture if everyone has served, except for you.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Dutchgamer1982:

if somebody is a guest in my house.. they will have to follow my rules.
that means their freedom is limited yes.
I would not want guests with weapons in my house either.
if they want to have their full freedom, they should go back to their own house.

I may be a generous host.. but no you are not just to dive into my fridge and grab yourself something to eat.. you wait till I offer you something or you ask me if you may have something. If I say no after you asking you have to accept that.

If you need to store your own stuff same thing.. you not just pull open my fridge and put it in.. you either don't or ask permissing and if I say no.. than you have to accept that.

You are not allowed to open any closet.. no going trough my stuff or go look for a place to store yours... if you want to store your stuff.. ask for a place to store it.. and I apoint you one..

ofcourse to make life a bit livable a generous host might offer you some freedoms.. like I will place charger near you.. give you a minifridge to use for your own needs.. and the guesroom where you may use all the closets in... and you may use the old computer/laptop to acces the interent.
(so basicly as a host I grand you certain default permissions.. I am not OBLIGATED to grand any.. but I grand some and basicly by that say this is what you are allowed to do without asking.. anything else ASK)

if your abuse these permissions.. say I gave you permisssion to use any toilet but you happen to sit on it for an hour.. so nobody else can go.. and stink up the room more than an normal person would.. I may during your stay restrict your acces.. and say you can only use the toilet downstairs not the one in the bathrooom.
..
or if you set the tv way to loud.. at way to early hours.. than I may force you to wear a headphone when watching or just ban you from using it before and after 10hour.
if you cannot walk of the stairs like a normal person and stomp like an elephant.. you guessed it.. I will ban you from going downstairs when others are still sleeping...

behave well.. and as a host I will extend your freedoms.. behave badly and you get less..
a reaaaal well behaved guest might even get permissions similair to my kids if i had them.
but you are still a guest.. so you won't ever get the same rights as me (and if I had one my wife) who are owners.

Do your guests have to pay you taxes? Work for you ?
Sounds like a silly comparison as a guest is comparable to a tourist.
Someone who lives, works, pays in a country, speaks the language and strictly abides by the rules, is certainly not a guest anymore but an inhabitant.

Also, lets be realistic here, but Finnish people do not even visually see that I am not Finnish nor am I culturally different to them in any significant part as I am German.
They also seem to have forgotten about their German allies fiercly fighting on their side during WW2 and providing them also with numerous guns.

[Asha]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Dutchgamer1982:

a nationality is of the blood... so foreigners NEVER can become native..

Opprinnelig skrevet av Dutchgamer1982:

It needs inmixing

This is absurdly contradictory.

[Q-T_3.14.exe]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Q-T_3.14.exe:

You need to have lived in Finland for 5 years for you to join the Finnish Defense Forces.
At least that's what I remember. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I think you need citizenship first, also by them I am probably too old.

You get full citizenship. I think that's what it's called.

Opprinnelig skrevet av Hitmain:

Do your guests have to pay you taxes? Work for you ?
Sounds like a silly comparison as a guest is comparable to a tourist.
Someone who lives, works, pays in a country, speaks the language and strictly abides by the rules, is certainly not a guest anymore but an inhabitant.

Country is just a communal apartment, comrade.