Games made for a "modern audience" are stupid

[Chocobo & Moogle]

Let's pander to a specific group of people to make the game better. The fanbase doesn't matter.

[atomicgirl]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Holografix:

Opprinnelig skrevet av atomicgirl:

Neither was I into that stuff. I never went to a Comic Con or E3, but that and all the other stuff I mentioned was a huge part of gamer culture, not sitting around seething over B.S. Real gamers were too busy geeking out over side activities to get obsessed over the kind of stuff the bad actors, rage bait hustlers and other frauds post all the time "as gamers."

Gaming is a solo activity.

It never was, no matter how much you say that.

[Tito Shivan]

Opprinnelig skrevet av AdahnGorion:

the issue is that "hardcore" gamers don't accept candycrush and other mobile games as games

The real issue is that 'twue gamers' can't stand not being in the spotlight anymore. As gaming has become mainstream they need to gatekeep what once was only theirs. Dismiss "modern audiences" as not true. You can see this process on almost any hobby or fandom that has become mainstream.

Basically little kids not wanting to share their toys.

[WhiteKnight77]

Years ago, I castigated Ubisoft, and rightly so, due to them bastardizing 2 games that while niche games, had a hardcore following. I always stated that it is one thing to add to a game to create a sequel, but it is another to completely change it into something it isn't. It was enough that Ubisoft paid for me to go to Games Convention 2005 in Leipzig, Germany to see the PC version of GRAW and interview the CEO of the development company that was developing it.

Still, Ubisoft had the niche game market cornered at the time with games such as Lo-MAC, Silent Hunter as well as R6 and GR. But, they tossed all that away by chasing the CoD and CS dollars, and not really doing so, not one ever topped those 2 games, or even won GOTY awards like the originals did.

They lost Crytek and Eagle Dynamics, or let them go. They bastardized the last Silent Hunter sub RTS by giving people magical torpedoes and making everything "easy" for the players while tossing the hardcore SH players aside. Ubi no longer makes the Silent Hunter series of games. And this does not count the Harpoon series of games that they shelved in the late 90's early 00's. Ubi has shelved many games over the years including GR2 for PC due to the gamers not wanting it due to being "3rd person/over the shoulder" in the view department.

Gamers tend to vote with their wallet and their votes are for a small set of games that offer specific things. All one has to do is look at the Steam charts to see what people are spending money on due to who is playing what game(s). Developers see what people are buying and develop such games. As long as people buy such games, developers will keep making them.

[TWPanda77]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Thanos:

Let's pander to a specific group of people to make the game better. The fanbase doesn't matter.

Is that you Grandad?

[Jackie Daytona]

Opprinnelig skrevet av AdahnGorion:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Jackie Daytona:

The people on Twitch are representative of the community. From the viewers to the streamers.

You can dislike it. You can wish it was different. You can advocate for change. Nevertheless, reality is reality. Most gamers are male. It's just how it is.

'The Sims'? You bring that up? You're just proving my point.

I have a female friend. She is a hardcore gamer. She plays all kinds of competitive games. She's better than me at all games we both play. (Except fighting games. She is abysmal.)

But you know what she likes best? Showing off the houses she builds in Ark, Sims, and FO4. Showing off the interiors and decorations. With all her crazy mods.

Male and female gamers are two different audiences. There's nothing wrong with that. Thinking there's a "modern audience" that just wants one thing is ridiculous.

being creative is awesome, I like to show of my builds as well.. just take my planet zoo stuff.

That's cool.

Opprinnelig skrevet av AdahnGorion:

Female gamers are a majority btw. Statistics showcase that... the issue is that "hardcore" gamers don't accept candycrush and other mobile games as games

It's not that we don't recognize these as games. It's more about the time and dedication it takes. Mobile games are usually spend money then win. Respectable games take time and patience. Mobile is just tapping and moving your finger around. Even console games require two hands. There is very little skill needed for mobile.

Playing games while you are in a line, riding in a taxi, or waiting for an appointment? That's not a gamer. That's just everybody.

But the statistics try to count that sort of person as a "gamer". Which (not coincidentally) is more women than men. Then they can claim there are more female gamers than male gamers. Except there's all kinds of evidence that there are vastly more males playing video games than women.

Worldwide, streamers are overwhelmingly men. At least when it comes to gaming.

Opprinnelig skrevet av AdahnGorion:

There are not one audience, nor two.. there are many subgroups.

There are multiple audiences. But that's kinda my point.

Ya gotta make something for somebody. Making something for everybody blandifies your product. Because not everyone is going to like everything.

[Adversary]

The point is to endure short term financial loss in order to obtain long term ideological gain.

[Tonepoet]

It's kind of something that should go without saying. I mean, a game for dead people wouldn't sell very well. Ghosts aren't really concerning themselves with spending money. Even the most avaricious spirits only want to horde the wealth they have accumulated.

I suppose you could try to make games for time travelers, at least if it were not for the fact that half of them try their darndest not to actually interfere with the course of history by making people wealthy beyond their wildest dreams and the other half are penniles psychopaths likely out to kill anybody who has the slightest bit of involvement with them.

What irks me more is trying to modernize already well beloved tales. It reeks of disrespect and lack of originality under the guise of a plattitude. I guess Sherlock Holmes in the 22nd Century was kind of alright though.

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

they got it right

b/c only fans care about the game
and modern audience don't care about the game let alone buying a copy. Hence they tend to sell poorly or worse than they would if they just updated the graphics

that's all you pretty much gotta do.

[atomicgirl]

Opprinnelig skrevet av TWPanda77:

Opprinnelig skrevet av Thanos:

Let's pander to a specific group of people to make the game better. The fanbase doesn't matter.

Is that you Grandad?

This is not a generational thing. It's cultural. I'm GenX and in the United States, no one gave or continues to give a flip about anything that rage baiters complain about. A lot of this "hurrdurr wymmin bad minorities bad" are coming from cultures that can't handle American IPs, which have always been multicultural. The biggest rage baiting culture war trolls were Brits and Canadians like Milo Yiannapoulos, Sargon of Akkad and that idiot, Jesse Grant, and they were or are under 40. Very few Boomers and GenXers from the United States are flipping gaskets except maybe Matt Stone and Trey Parker.

[Coinkydink]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Mod_Abuse_victim#488:

art form to a corporate money machine.

Video games were never an art form, where did you get that idea? They were commercial entertainment products from the start, and originally developed using US military technology, like the internet.

[atomicgirl]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Jackie Daytona:

'The Sims'? You bring that up? You're just proving my point.

Yes, that you have no idea what you're talking about. That's all. The Sims is one of the best selling franchises of all time. It was also developed by one of the biggest legends in gaming and gamer history--Will Wright. There's no way to dismiss it or the huge female fandom and modders that pushed it to the top. Dismissing it either makes you a contrarian sticking his fingers in his ears and going, "La la la I'm not listening" or a bandwagon jumper who got into gaming really late and is trying to use revisionist history to try to claim gaming as predominantly male.

[Tito Shivan]

Opprinnelig skrevet av nagu_al:

Video games were never an art form, where did you get that idea? They were commercial entertainment products from the start, and originally developed using US military technology, like the internet.

Wait till you learn most or artwork we have was actually made for profit back then. And the Internet wasn't really a US military invention.

Opprinnelig skrevet av atomicgirl:

This is not a generational thing. It's cultural. I'm GenX and in the United States, no one gave or continues to give a flip about anything that rage baiters complain about. A lot of this "hurrdurr wymmin bad minorities bad" are coming from cultures that can't handle American IPs, which have always been multicultural. The biggest rage baiting culture war trolls were Brits and Canadians like Milo Yiannapoulos, Sargon of Akkad and that idiot, Jesse Grant, and they were or are under 40. Very few Boomers and GenXers from the United States are flipping gaskets except maybe Matt Stone and Trey Parker.

You cannot underscore the power of US media monsters like Fox, american companies like Facebook or Twitter or people like Steve Bannon or Alex Jones in regards the expansion of regressive viewpoints and scaremongering.

The EEUU also has its fair share of rage baiters and regressive personalities.

[atomicgirl]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Tito Shivan:

You cannot underscore the power of US media monsters like Fox, american companies like Facebook or Twitter or people like Steve Bannon or Alex Jones in regards the expansion of regressive viewpoints and scaremongering.

No.

Bannon and Jones were always on the lunatic fringes of American media and had no real reach. It's why they were disgraced, ridiculed and later sued to oblivion. Jones was so fringe that even Howard Stern, who was also pretty fringe himself, made fun of him.

Facebook and Twitter were "American companies," but they were propped up by foreign disinfo.

On top of everything else, people like Bannon and Jones never weaponized American pop culture to spread extremist ideology. That was always the wheelhouse of Brits (Milo Y, Sargon of Akkad, Jesse Grant, Russell Brand), Canadians (Gavin McInnes) and everyone else in between.

[peppermint hollows]

Opprinnelig skrevet av Jackie Daytona:

-snip-

In other words, you only consider "gamers" to be people who fit into your very specific definition. This is also convenient as it allows you to argue that your point is correct because a large demographic of people simply don't count as gamers in your argument.

[Tito Shivan]

Opprinnelig skrevet av atomicgirl:

No.

Bannon and Jones were always on the lunatic fringes of American media and had no real reach.

Don't tell me Bannon has no reach when our right wing party (among others) has been following Bannon's bible to the Alt-right to the T and radicalizing themselves for at least a decade.

They do have reach. Of the worst kind: Political one.

Opprinnelig skrevet av peppermint hollows:

In other words, you only consider "gamers" to be people who fit into your very specific definition.

AKA: Cherrypicking.
"The act of pointing to individual cases or data that seem to confirm a particular position while ignoring a significant portion of related and similar cases or data that may contradict that position."