usa drunk driving law is idiotic don't you think so?

[De Hollandse Ezel]

In my country people who are drunk, in an understanable rage, or insane are legally "not accountable for their actions"

nobody on purpose kills other people.. and to have people who cause an accident due drunk driving go to jail as they do in usa in insanity to me.

now I think my nations laws around drinking and driving are a lot better.

firstly our drivers are a LOT better trained (minimumage to get a licence is 18, not 16 as in usa, and our driving licence lessons and exams are way stricter.. there is a reason getting a licence will easely cost you 4 thousand euro and thats IF you even pass your first exam.. which about halve don't.. meaning an aditional 2k and 2 months for more lessons are slapped on top before doing your reexam.. most will pass this 2d run.. but theres always some who don't about 10% of all people won't have their licence even after 2 exams.. so thats another 2k.. more lessons.,. you get it.. there is no limit how often you can retry.,. but there is a minimum time between exams, and a minimum number of lessons you must take between each exam.

secondly our roads are a lot safer in their design -> usa roads are like 50 years behind in safety designs vs dutch roads..

usa has way way higher trafficdeaths per 10000 people.. than netherlands mostly because these above 2 reasons.. and idioticly strict alchol laws are not even a drop on that..

so to tross people who merely did a misdemeneor (drunk driving) into jail for manslaughter is UTTERLY insane when it is your road designs and low bar for getting a driving licence that are truelly to blame for the deaths.

now... what will happen if you drink and drive and cause a deathly accident in MY country,
***it depends firstly how MUCH you did drink.

-you are legaly allowed to drink upto 2 units of alcohol and still be legal to drive.
(thats basicly normal sized glasses of 250ml normal 5% beer, 100ml of 12% wine, or 30ml of 40% spirits)
1 unit takes an average persons liver 2 hours to filter out of your blood, so how long ago you drank before driving does still matter

If you are found with or at this ammount while in the accident the following will happen.
***insurance will pay out as normal, you were to the law considered sober
***if you had your licence for over 2 years.. nothing will happen.. just an accident.
***if you had your licence for LESS than 2 years though.. you get a mark (you also get that mark if found with any alcohol in a standard roadstop if you got your licence less than 2 years)
->
if you get 2 marks on a licence before you own it 2 years.. you loose it.. permanently (so you lost on a HEFTY cash investment). AND are banned from taking new driving lessons or taking exams for 2 years.

(basicly the law does allow experienced drivers to drink some alchol.. but does not beginning drivers)

still nobody gets fined.. nobody gets a criminal record, nobody goes to jail despite a person just died.. accidents happen.

------
a second amount of blood alchol... basicly more than 2 units.. but below 5 units.. will get you a fine, you are also instantly denied to continue driving, as well you aint sober
-> beginning drivers at this level will recieve 2 marks at once (so instantly loose their licence)

but other than that.. still nothing happens, no criminal record, no jailtime, no nothing, just a misdemeneor.
---------
over 5 units of alcohol (and up)

**this is where EVERY driver even experienced onces will loose their licence on the spot.
they will also be banned from continue to drive on.
-> and they will not get a standard fine.. but their case will go to a judge
-> judges are buisy so you likely at least loose your licence for 3 months until your case gets on trial.
**the judge will look at their case and set a fine, and a time for which the licencence will be held (for experienced drivers) or for how long you will be denied driving lessons (for beginning drivers)
**maximum fine the judge can give is 8000 euro.. maximum time you may loose your licence is 10 years.. (judge usually picks something below that extreme matching the severity of your case.. and the severity is NOT that you caused an accident, but by the judge of character.. one factor is how much DID you drink.. but repeated offender also counts.. finally.. character.. if the judge sees your young, and shocked.. or just a decent civillian who drank to much once cause his wife left him/just died.. he will judge lighter than if he sees a person who basicly is more hillbilly in their attitude..
in any cause you will NOT go to jail, and this judges judgment will NOT depend on the damage you caused.. so deaths or not plays no part in his ruling.
->
in REALLY extreme cases the judge can demand upto 6 months communiuty service.. to give back, and demand an alchollock to be installed when the no licence time has passed. (an alcohollock will be installed at the drivers own expense.. it basicly detects alchol in the drivers breath and won't allow the car to start if ANY is in it)

==================================
now why is taking somebody's licence and that such a big deal?

driving without licence or driving in a car without alchollock when the judge said you have to have one.. IS a criminal offense.. that again regardless of damages caused.. can land you upto 1 year in jail (but can.. is not the same as always will).. you car will in that case also be ceized.. and regardless of if your given jailtime or not you WILL get a criminal record.
(a cat 1 one, so it will disapear from your record in 10 years.. but still thats a long time to be excluded from jobs that need a "certificate of lawfull behavipr" -> a document only citycents without any criminal record can get from their city council to hand their employer.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

so... in most cases in usa where they trow drivers (often teens) into jail for like 20 years.. a mere accident..

here we would have given them only a fine at worst an 8000 euro one.. or at worst taken away their licence for 5-10 years.

[the vampire of time and memory]

nothing wrong with a couple pints to calm the nerves while driving

it's quite fun, even

[Prinzip]

I live in Europe and I think it's a totalitarian ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

[Chaosolous]

Tldr

If you’re drinking and commit a crime, you chose to drink, you’re responsible.

[Good Night Owl]

I don't think the drunk driving law in particular is stupid given our system. But I do agree that the education, and road system here needs improvement l, and stricter requirements getting a license. A better system would render a law like this not necessary, but the system itself makes this necessary.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

ciarruh の投稿を引用：

this is the worst troll i ever read

whats trolling about... stating how my nation handles driving under influence
and how I deem usa way to handle it idiotic.

it is to me idiotic that an accident gets turned into a manslaughter cause..
drunk driving should be judged on it's own.. regardless if you cause an accident or not.

and even IF you did a real crime, when drunk, or otherwise under influence you should get a LOWER punishment, than if you did the same thing sober, as you cannot be held fully accountable for your actions.

[Good Night Owl]

Chaosolous の投稿を引用：

Tldr

If you’re drinking and commit a crime, you chose to drink, you’re responsible.

I didn't read it all either, but no, it's more about how our system is way too lenient overall, resulting in a law with an extreme consequence. It's way too easy to get a license with hardly any education for it.

[ƝՕϹ]

In my country, the USA, people push you onto the train tracks for no reason other than they feel like it. The laws probably aren't harsh enough over here. If the driving tests were as strict as in your country, half the people wouldn't be allowed to drive.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

Noc の投稿を引用：

In my country, the USA, people push you onto the train tracks for no reason other than they feel like it. The laws probably aren't harsh enough over here. If the driving tests were as strict as in your country, half the people wouldn't be allowed to drive.

than make them as harsh.. better have them not on the road at all.. than be unreasonable to a person who made a mere mistake.. nobody causes an accident on purpose.. and nobody drinks thinking "oh lets cause an accident today"
they made a terrible judgement call "won't happen to me"
and thats why you do give them a fine, and perhaps take their licence away..
but you don't charge them for what clearly is.. an unwanted accident.

[Chaosolous]

Good Night Owl の投稿を引用：

Chaosolous の投稿を引用：

Tldr

If you’re drinking and commit a crime, you chose to drink, you’re responsible.

I didn't read it all either, but no, it's more about how our system is way too lenient overall, resulting in a law with an extreme consequence. It's way too easy to get a license with hardly any education for it.

That’s gonna vary from state to state. The state I grew up in has very difficult driving tests and has a mandatory minimum training time. Something like 85%+ of the people who take the test fail the first two times.

People should vote better but tribalism makes that impossible.

The state I live in now though, very lax with motor vehicle license. Great state otherwise though.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

Chaosolous の投稿を引用：

Tldr

If you’re drinking and commit a crime, you chose to drink, you’re responsible.

a crime is when you do something with intent.
nobody who is drunk driving.. hits another person on the road on purpose.. it's an accident.
and if you see it as such when they are sober.. than see it also such when they are drunk.

if normally you only give a fine for drunk driving.. that thats what you also should do when they cause an accident.
you should not suddenly judge an accident differently cause they happen to also comitting a misdemeneor.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

Chaosolous の投稿を引用：

Good Night Owl の投稿を引用：

I didn't read it all either, but no, it's more about how our system is way too lenient overall, resulting in a law with an extreme consequence. It's way too easy to get a license with hardly any education for it.

That’s gonna vary from state to state. The state I grew up in has very difficult driving tests and has a mandatory minimum training time. Something like 85%+ of the people who take the test fail the first two times.

People should vote better but tribalism makes that impossible.

The state I live in now though, very lax with motor vehicle license. Gray state otherwise though.

here you first must learn a book of about 1800 roadsigns, trafficsigns, trafficlaws out of your head. getting the learning stuff for that will put you down 400-600 euro.
you than get an theoryexam.. and not a multiple guess one.. no open questions.... randomly picked about 50 trafficsigns and 50 traffic situations out of all in that book.. and you have to answer them all correctly or you fail.
that exam costs about 300 euro per attempt.

after you passed that exam.. you need to get a minimum of 15 hours drivinglessons.. with a maximum of 1.5 hours per day.. (standard lessontime most instructors give is 45 minutes, and costs about 100 euro each..
so thats 1000 euro.. MINIMUM.
but you don't deciede when your examready.. your instructor does.. and VERY few students are actually ready in 15 lessons (most that try fail).. so 22-30 lessons is an more realistic amount.
**then your driving exam wil take place with an licenced state examinator and your instructor present. taking this exam costs about 700 euro.. (and like said a little over halve fails first attempt) you drive in REAL traffic.. you hold the wheel.. your examinator only tells you where to drive to, park etc..
those cars do have 2 steering wheels... but the 2d wheel is not used.. unless the examinator sees you doing anything unsafe.. than with a switch he can take control of the vehicle away.. and you automaticly failed if he has to do that.
(but doing moderatory bad behavior like cutting somebody off, driving to slow or to fast.. braking to abrupt.. not keeping distance, not looking in your mirrors (which is why you want to turn your head EXTREMELY for just looking out of your eyecorners may percieved as you did not check your mirrors.. may all still fail you despite he did not interupt you..

and thats on dutch roads.. who by design are much safer (tons of little infrastructure things that make it less likely for you to hit anybody or anything should you even loose control, and that make it less likely for you to loose control in the first place)

we do NOT allow people with american licences to rent and drive a car here.. we don't recognise usa licences as valid. to us usa licences could as well be the wrapper of a stick of butter, equally useless and cheap.

but well while a TON of lifes could be safed if usa would stop being so car depended.. and start up drivers exams demands and costs.. and upgrade the design of their roads to safer infrastructure.
->
even without that.. it seems unfair in ANY situation to penaltilise people who drink and drive.. seems like they are used as an unfair scapegoat.. while many are just silly teens who made a mistake 10000000s do.. why should the few poor souls causing an accident while being just stupid teens.,. go to jail for over a decade.. makes no sense at al.. seems utterly cruel.

[abcd]

what's bad about the road designs?

[michaelplehner]

Troll bait and people fell for it. Congrats.

[Violent Rainbow]

The thing about drink driving is that I'm drunk right now, and Im still perfectly capableof answering your question. So do you think that the laws should apply to me, Violent Rainbow? because I spit on your laws! I spit on them! I wont take any part in the business of the business, and I dfeiunitely wont show up to court tomorrow becauase I'm going to be WAAAAY too hungover for that ♥♥♥♥! So don't kjdxc nrrrrrrrrrr