Recall/Copilot AI on Windows is a good feature, stop fear-mongering

[Dom]

We've seen people saying that Recall (and Copilot) is the reason that they would move away from Windows 11 and I honestly do not understand this line of logic.

If you don't know, Recall is an AI feature which takes snapshots of the PC screen every 3 seconds in order to remember what the user did on the PC, and utilize that information to personalize and predict the experience.

Recall is an additional feature of Windows 11 that can be fully or temporarily disabled at any time, just like other features of the operating system. There will be a button at the taskbar that temporarily disables the Recall feature. This way, if the user is doing something confidential on the computer such as "scientific" research, they can just press that and no snapshots will be taken for a certain time period. Or, they can disable the entire feature from the settings.

The snapshots will be encrypted and stored locally on the hard drive. The encryption key is stored (locally) on the TPM. Due to existing privacy laws, Microsoft is not even allowed to send such snapshots over to their servers. It would be a major breach.

Some conspiracy theories have sparked that Microsoft will force Recall to be enabled all the time, and I honestly don't understand where those claims come from. Recall (and Copilot) is very resource-intensive and requires very high-end hardware. It would be extremely inconvenient from Microsoft to require it to be enabled all the time and it would provide no value to them to do so. It is obviously the best-case practice to have it enabled whenever the user wants it and would benefit from its use.

Personally, I can see this feature being extremely useful. When I'm using the computer and discovering things, sometimes I do wish I could rewind what I witnessed. I may have seen something that I thought was not important at the time, and later on change my mind and want to come back to it. In fact, that sounds fantastic. There have been few times when I've lost Office files (such as due to file corruption). With tools such as Recall, the AI could re-create the entire file based on what it has seen in the past and so on.

The question I have for people who would move to Linux over tools such as Recall is, would they also ditch their Linux operating system if it starts to have AI tools (like Recall) as well? Fact is, AI increases productivity and usability. Everyone in big tech knows this, and that's why they are integrating AI into everything they do. Operating systems and web services that don't have AI will simply fall behind in progress and therefore they would not enable the same level of productivity for the user.

Moving away from operating systems that utilize AI to get the best out of the user experience would be a degrade, not an upgrade. If not right now, few years from now, for sure.

[󠀡󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧Kei]

i have it already deleted from the registry, useless feature

[Dom]

Originally posted by Feiqizi:

i have it already deleted from the registry, useless feature

Depends on whom you're asking for and what you're aiming to have.

In terms of LLM, Copilot is good enough for OpenAI to charge money for it (GPT-4).

[Dom]

Originally posted by Midori:

Microsoft forcing me to edge has just made me scared of anything new they add to the OS.

I don't remember the last thing they added that was worthwhile, and not designed only to harvest data or incentivise the use a MS Account, is my concern.

Windows requires Microsoft account for installation but it is not obligatory to sign into Windows with Microsoft account, you can use local account.
Even with installation there is a rather simple trick/workaround to skip the sign-up part.

[󠀡󠀡󠀡󠀡⁧⁧Kei]

Originally posted by Dom:

Originally posted by Feiqizi:

i have it already deleted from the registry, useless feature

Depends on whom you're asking for and what you're aiming to have.

In terms of LLM, Copilot is good enough for OpenAI to charge money for it (GPT-4).

i only use it for gaming or browsing stuff so i don't really need it in my way

[Xautos]

Originally posted by Dom:

The question I have for people who would move to Linux over tools such as Recall is, would they also ditch their Linux operating system if it starts to have AI tools (like Recall) as well? Fact is, AI increases productivity and usability. Everyone in big tech knows this, and that's why they are integrating AI into everything they do. Operating systems and web services that don't have AI will simply fall behind in progress and therefore they would not enable the same level of productivity for the user.

Linux is open source, there is no way you can hide that in the OS and expect to keep it there. someone somewhere will fork the AI right out and others will simply download, install and remove the AI entirely through that fork.

The massive difference between Windows and Linux is that in Windows you can not guarantee the Recall AI won't be on all the time or that it can be permanently switched off either and neither can it be removed because of the closed source nature of the OS.

You are advocating that those who have no choice should accept they continue to have no choice on Windows where as the alternative is open to have a choice in Linux.

[ナルゴ]

Give users a choice. Make it opt-in. Don't add it to base Windows OS product.

I consider it bloat. Takes up a machine's resources for things that I never asked for. A computer is just a tool. I buy them for specific usecases. I don't need a tool that tries to outsmart its user by "optimizing". I don't need an OS pre-loading dependencies for a specific application, because it's anticipating that I'll open that application, as a result of it detecting that I use the aforementioned application regularly.

From a business perspective, that would be like an employee wasting time and effort via over-delivering on projects tasks, which leads to excess costs & opportunity costs.

One of the reasons why linux is appealing is because it's so lean. The user has complete control of the machine. It doesn't have dozens of background processes spontaneously spawning and doing things unknown to the owner.
Having no extra processes like that means the computer will run better too.

[Dom]

Originally posted by Xautos:

Originally posted by Dom:

The question I have for people who would move to Linux over tools such as Recall is, would they also ditch their Linux operating system if it starts to have AI tools (like Recall) as well? Fact is, AI increases productivity and usability. Everyone in big tech knows this, and that's why they are integrating AI into everything they do. Operating systems and web services that don't have AI will simply fall behind in progress and therefore they would not enable the same level of productivity for the user.

Linux is open source, there is no way you can hide that in the OS and expect to keep it there. someone somewhere will fork the AI right out and others will simply download, install and remove the AI entirely through that fork.

The massive difference between Windows and Linux is that in Windows you can not guarantee the Recall AI won't be on all the time or that it can be permanently switched off either and neither can it be removed because of the closed source nature of the OS.

You are advocating that those who have no choice should accept they continue to have no choice on Windows where as the alternative is open to have a choice in Linux.

Linux is open-source but there are big companies that work on major distributions. Taking Canonical as the most obvious example, although there are others too.

I don't think it's out of the question that they would add AI tools into their operating system once AI competition within the OS field gets more and more intense. It's true that someone could create a version (fork) that has them removed and there will always be Linux distributions that don't have AI. So don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that it's impossible to escape AI.

And that's not really the point I'm making. The point I'm making is that AI is going to make the use of the operating system and the services better. That's why there are so many investments and all of the hype. And the industry is constantly discovering new capabilities and potential. The people who don't have that advanced AI integrated into their system, will have an obsolete system in the future that does not perform as well as those that have it.

So Copilot and other AI tools that would function similarly need to be seen in a bigger light & context than just "Microsoft bad".

[Xautos]

Originally posted by Dom:

Originally posted by Xautos:

Linux is open source, there is no way you can hide that in the OS and expect to keep it there. someone somewhere will fork the AI right out and others will simply download, install and remove the AI entirely through that fork.

The massive difference between Windows and Linux is that in Windows you can not guarantee the Recall AI won't be on all the time or that it can be permanently switched off either and neither can it be removed because of the closed source nature of the OS.

You are advocating that those who have no choice should accept they continue to have no choice on Windows where as the alternative is open to have a choice in Linux.

Linux is open-source but there are big companies that work on major distributions. Taking Canonical as the most obvious example, although there are others too.

I don't think it's out of the question that they would add AI tools into their operating system once AI competition within the OS field gets more and more intense. It's true that someone could create a version (fork) that has them removed and there will always be Linux distributions that don't have AI. So don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that it's impossible to escape AI.

And that's not really the point I'm making. The point I'm making is that AI is going to make the use of the operating system and the services better. That's why there are so many investments and all of the hype. And the industry is constantly discovering new capabilities and potential. The people who don't have that advanced AI integrated into their system, will have an obsolete system in the future that does not perform as well as those that have it.

So Copilot and other AI tools that would function similarly need to be seen in a bigger light & context than just "Microsoft bad".

That's still something that is entirely dependant on the person, they should not be forced into using an AI they don't want on their OS, let alone how far the AI can go and what it can do. Though even that could be customised on Linux as well, so that's one thing in Linux's favour, there is very much likely to be choices offered from removal to customising and fully embracing it.

On Windows it's a different matter, you don't have a choice but to accept the product Microsoft gives you as they want it and you would have no idea what Microsoft would programme it to do and what its goals are, you can't customise it and when they decide to roll it out as a permanent feature, there will be no way to get rid of it because they'll likely tie the damned thing into the OS itself.

[ナルゴ]

And let's not forget that whatever AI these corporations come up with will serve the corporations' interests.
"Improve user experience" More like having an annoying AI constantly trying to pivot the user into whatever rent-seeking subscription nonsense a corporation offers.

This is Microsoft we're talking about here. The same microsoft that already tries to ram OneDrive and Edge down your throat.
Then same microsoft that removes the decline button from pop-up windows, only leaving you with "Bite the bullet" or "Remind me later"

[Dom]

Originally posted by Xautos:

Originally posted by Dom:

Linux is open-source but there are big companies that work on major distributions. Taking Canonical as the most obvious example, although there are others too.

I don't think it's out of the question that they would add AI tools into their operating system once AI competition within the OS field gets more and more intense. It's true that someone could create a version (fork) that has them removed and there will always be Linux distributions that don't have AI. So don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that it's impossible to escape AI.

And that's not really the point I'm making. The point I'm making is that AI is going to make the use of the operating system and the services better. That's why there are so many investments and all of the hype. And the industry is constantly discovering new capabilities and potential. The people who don't have that advanced AI integrated into their system, will have an obsolete system in the future that does not perform as well as those that have it.

So Copilot and other AI tools that would function similarly need to be seen in a bigger light & context than just "Microsoft bad".

That's still something that is entirely dependant on the person, they should not be forced into using an AI they don't want on their OS, let alone how far the AI can go and what it can do. Though even that could be customised on Linux as well, so that's one thing in Linux's favour, there is very much likely to be choices offered from removal to customising and fully embracing it.

On Windows it's a different matter, you don't have a choice but to accept the product Microsoft gives you as they want it and you would have no idea what Microsoft would programme it to do and what its goals are, you can't customise it and when they decide to roll it out as a permanent feature, there will be no way to get rid of it because they'll likely tie the damned thing into the OS itself.

But we move on with times. For example, I'm pretty sure there were people who made the argument "taskbar shouldn't be forced on people" when Windows 95 was announced. And several other features of that operating system at the time.

But nowadays, those features (such as taskbar) are directly linked to go together with the whole concept of an operating system. When people visualize an operating system in front of them, that OS will have a taskbar.

Similarly, it is quite likely that in the future AI and OS go "hand-in-hand". Any operating system that does not have AI, is seen as not being an operating system because it lacks the key functionality that everyone thinks is part of a fully functional operating system.

Based on the results of the AI and how effective it is, there are convincing arguments for why escaping that progress and development is generally a bad idea, although very much possible.

[ナルゴ]

That's like saying the hammer will become obsolete because the future is factory robots. Stop using hammers, you're denying progress and development!


Sorry some people still prefer using a simple hammer.

[Dom]

Originally posted by Nargo:

That's like saying the hammer will become obsolete because the future is factory robots. Stop using hammers, you're denying progress and development!
:lunar2019crylaughingpig:

Sorry some people still prefer using a simple hammer.

You're comparing factories (industry production) to home users.

Producers and consumers will always have different tools in their possession.

And you'll always find an individual who prefers to do a thing in their own way.
But that doesn't reflect the common standard.

[ナルゴ]

Originally posted by Dom:

Producers and consumers will always have different tools in their possession.

Yes. Like having a normal operating system vs an AI-integrated one. Hence my earlier post about the AI being opt-in. Ideally existing in a separate OS product entirely.

[Dom]

Originally posted by Nargo:

Originally posted by Dom:

Producers and consumers will always have different tools in their possession.

Yes. Like having a normal operating system vs an AI-integrated one. Hence my earlier post about the AI being opt-in. Ideally a separate product entirely.

In the future AI-integrated OS will be the "normal" operating system, though. That's the point.

It will be a norm in the OS industry to have AI.
Due to its efficiency and the productivity that it enables and the usability enhancement, etc.

[KalGimpa]

Originally posted by Dom:

Originally posted by Xautos:

Linux is open source, there is no way you can hide that in the OS and expect to keep it there. someone somewhere will fork the AI right out and others will simply download, install and remove the AI entirely through that fork.

The massive difference between Windows and Linux is that in Windows you can not guarantee the Recall AI won't be on all the time or that it can be permanently switched off either and neither can it be removed because of the closed source nature of the OS.

You are advocating that those who have no choice should accept they continue to have no choice on Windows where as the alternative is open to have a choice in Linux.

Linux is open-source but there are big companies that work on major distributions. Taking Canonical as the most obvious example, although there are others too.

I don't think it's out of the question that they would add AI tools into their operating system once AI competition within the OS field gets more and more intense. It's true that someone could create a version (fork) that has them removed and there will always be Linux distributions that don't have AI. So don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting that it's impossible to escape AI.

And that's not really the point I'm making. The point I'm making is that AI is going to make the use of the operating system and the services better. That's why there are so many investments and all of the hype. And the industry is constantly discovering new capabilities and potential. The people who don't have that advanced AI integrated into their system, will have an obsolete system in the future that does not perform as well as those that have it.

So Copilot and other AI tools that would function similarly need to be seen in a bigger light & context than just "Microsoft bad".

there are many distros available

someone will fork one without the ai for those of us that do not want that stuff