California Politician Proposes a $50 Federal Minimum Wage

[WhiteKnight77]

You seriously cannot make this stuff up. Rep. Barbara Lee in California Senate race says minimum wage should be raised to $50[www.usatoday.com]. One of two things would happen. All small businesses would close, or inflation would rise exponentially as prices for goods rise. Forget about restaurants. This would put a lot of people out of work.

$50 minimum wage will put every restaurant ‘out of business’: Chef Gruel

SMH

[RRW359]

I don't doubt that there is a point where minimum wage is too high and causes businesses to fail and while it varies per region it's probably well under $50 even in California, raising it causes little-no inflation. If you look at maps of where inflation is better/worse in the US it doesn't seem to correspond with which States do/don't raise it yearly with CPI, in face the City with the lowest rate in the country is Minneapolis which is in a State that raises it yearly.

[Duck Twacy]

WhiteKnight77 の投稿を引用：

You seriously cannot make this stuff up. Rep. Barbara Lee in California Senate race says minimum wage should be raised to $50[www.usatoday.com]. One of two things would happen. All small businesses would close, or inflation would rise exponentially as prices for goods rise. Forget about restaurants. This would put a lot of people out of work.

$50 minimum wage will put every restaurant ‘out of business’: Chef Gruel

SMH

Assuming that's true, then it's pretty idiotic. The problem with a free floating currency is that inflation only goes up. There's no deflation to allow consumers or regular people to just get a job to work for a living. Industry keeps driving up prices perpetually, driving up salaries.

Ideally there's supposed to be a period of deflation where the currency, whatever it is, comes back to an equilibrium. But that can't happen now. When I was a teenager you could fill your tank for $20 American. Now it takes $40 for a small budget car. Nearly $100+ for a luxury vechible.

The US Constitution says that any court cases over $20 get deferred to another court. I can barely buy milk and cookies for $20.

The consumer economy emphasizes "buy more more more". Okay, fine, but what if you can't work enough to pay for the things the market says you need?

So, whatever.

No, it's not capitalism's fault. Some of it is just pure greed.

A $50 an hour min wage? Whatever. Tell that to retirees who live off IRAs, 401ks, or even Social Security.

[Xero_Daxter]

This is why I moved away from California.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

now in my nation the current minimumwage is about 2000 euro a month based on a 40 week workweek.

our current minimumwage is 13,27 euro (14.47 usd) per hour.

this still is way to low.. as it was originally introduced in 1969 it was actually a decent income. and until 1980 the goverment increased it equal to the amount the median wage increased so that the lowest paid workers kept in line with everybody's else wage increases.

however as welfare had been defined as 80% of minimumwage.. and social benefits rose to over 23% of gdp in the 80s.. goverment made not only cuts in those benefits... (like cutting welfare down to 70% of minimumwage) they also refused to increase the minimumwage many times.. + have altered the minimumwage is now only increased by inflation.

(though how that inflationnumber is calculated is mumbo jumbo.. as maximum rent increases, maximum trainfare increases, energy prices, gdp calculations, and plenty other things all have a different number for that inflation.. usually when you need to pay stuff it's suddenly twice what it is when you stand to recieve stuff)

if we restore the minimumwage back to what it was in 1980.. when it still was fair : we need to raise it to about 25 euro (27.25 usd)
which I would whole heartely support, we can decrease welfare to 60% of minimumwage if we do that.. as a combined bill to not let those costs rise..

compagny's make record profits, and even a 50 euro minimumwage would not have more than 2% of those lowest jobs disapear.. as there is very little correlation to buisnuiss succes and minimumwage.

compagnies will indeed not hire workers if the extra gains of that worker are higher than the extra costs.
however NO compagny will pay a worker the full gains, meaning they always will steal a percentage of that workers labout.
-and how large that percentage is not tied to how vital you are to a compagny but how easy it is to replace you.
So wages are not paid according to peoples moral or financial value to a compagny or society, but according to how easy it is to get another just like them.
most minimumwage workers are very easy to replace so the percentage of what they actual produce is neglectable.
**forcing compagny's effectively to pay a higher percentage won't alter the fact they still add value to the compagny and will be hired.. you just force compagny's to give a fairer cut of that added value to those who actually produce it.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

personally i do think 50 an hour is a bit to high.
25 euro an high (27.25 USD) minimumwage would be more fair.

but as us wages have increased a bit more than those in europe over the decades perhaps 30usd would still be defendable.

50 is indeed to much.

so yes we need to increase minimumwage and YES by quite a lot.
but 50 is likely too much.

[Walach]

My one wish it to have it so companies, or rather the people who runs them, would want their employees to have a good life before the normal goal of making more and more money. In my opinion, it's the "race to gain as much money as possible" that's creating these issues.

I probably have a simple view on this but still, it's always about the money and never about the people.

Anyway, having a minimum wage of 50 dollars seems like a lot, but I don't know if it would create any problems as I don't think anything like this has been done before. I've only heard of why it's a bad idea, but I haven't seen what would happen from prior tests.

[Γαῖα]

Just scrapped some data and it appears only 39,8 % of the population is working full time.(so dont include part time workers). Of that working percentage 57.4% are on or below the min wage.
Thats a shocking stat if over half of all working persons in the usa are on the lowest wage or less.
If the stats aren't wrong then the disparity in wealth is even more shocking.

[Ulfrinn]

De Hollandse Ezel の投稿を引用：

instead of raising the minimumwage.. how about we just set a maximumwage?
-> a 100% income tax on anything you earn above 100k or something like that.

or a flat income tax for ALL sources of income of 60% (and when I say all sources I mean all hammer shut those evations scemes) + a base income for all of say 1600 euro a month
(than a minimumwage is not needed, as you already have a livable income.. you work for that little extra on top of that.. people will have the freedom to just say no if the hourly wage is to low.. what they now can't.

or limit the income gap.. by stating :
if compagnty of <10 workers : "nobody may be paid less than 50% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not earn more than twice the average income of all employees
if compagny of 10-99 workers :"nobody may be paid less than 20% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not eaarn more than 5 ttimes the average income of all employees
if compagny of 100+ workers : "nobody may be paid less than 10% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not earn more than 10 times the average income of all employees
->
more steps will likely be needed. for each employee added upto 100.. to prevent compagny's sticking at that 9 and 99 bracket.. but the general sceme is there..

by essentially forbidding people like besos to earn more than 10 times his average workers income or to pay them less than 10% of what he is earned.. he likely will have to pay those warehouse workers a heck of a lot more and settle himself for heck of a lot less..
cutting the gap from a million times more down to just 10 times more..

meanwhile that small mom & pop shop that barely is making profit as is.. won't have to pay that 1 employee more than they are taking themselves out the compagny anyway.

as the biggest underpayers generally are those big multinationals.. such a limit to income gap within a compagny quite effectively solves that.

Do you think taxing someone making over $100K is going to put money into your pocket? Do you think business owners, doctors, scientists, etc who earn more than that would even stay in your country and contribute anything to the tax revenue at all? And then who is going to pay for all the free ♥♥♥♥ you think other people owe you?

Leave that Marxist nonsense in the trash where it belongs.

[De Hollandse Ezel]

Ulfrinn の投稿を引用：

De Hollandse Ezel の投稿を引用：

instead of raising the minimumwage.. how about we just set a maximumwage?
-> a 100% income tax on anything you earn above 100k or something like that.

or a flat income tax for ALL sources of income of 60% (and when I say all sources I mean all hammer shut those evations scemes) + a base income for all of say 1600 euro a month
(than a minimumwage is not needed, as you already have a livable income.. you work for that little extra on top of that.. people will have the freedom to just say no if the hourly wage is to low.. what they now can't.

or limit the income gap.. by stating :
if compagnty of <10 workers : "nobody may be paid less than 50% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not earn more than twice the average income of all employees
if compagny of 10-99 workers :"nobody may be paid less than 20% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not eaarn more than 5 ttimes the average income of all employees
if compagny of 100+ workers : "nobody may be paid less than 10% of the highest earner and the highest earner may not earn more than 10 times the average income of all employees
->
more steps will likely be needed. for each employee added upto 100.. to prevent compagny's sticking at that 9 and 99 bracket.. but the general sceme is there..

by essentially forbidding people like besos to earn more than 10 times his average workers income or to pay them less than 10% of what he is earned.. he likely will have to pay those warehouse workers a heck of a lot more and settle himself for heck of a lot less..
cutting the gap from a million times more down to just 10 times more..

meanwhile that small mom & pop shop that barely is making profit as is.. won't have to pay that 1 employee more than they are taking themselves out the compagny anyway.

as the biggest underpayers generally are those big multinationals.. such a limit to income gap within a compagny quite effectively solves that.

Do you think taxing someone making over $100K is going to put money into your pocket? Do you think business owners, doctors, scientists, etc who earn more than that would even stay in your country and contribute anything to the tax revenue at all? And then who is going to pay for all the free ♥♥♥♥ you think other people owe you?

Leave that Marxist nonsense in the trash where it belongs.

you take 1 out of 3 alternative proposals.. fail to see it for it's bare content "100k" is a placeholder number for that idea.. and fail to respond to those olther 2 or imagine that those 3 are just examples of what can be done to adress the issue of the income gap.

you also add a nonsensical slur any debate must be on contect.
he who start trowing slurs instantly lost.

------------
But even than :

100k wages are quite rare in my country even for those scientists, doctors etc.
most of those earn closer to 70k ät best and already pay about 46% income tax on that.
you need to be a dentist, prime minster or brain surgeon with a decade experience to reach with a normal profession over 100k and even than not by much.
..
if your nations wages are higher or lower another number could be taken instead.

still I admit a hard cap on nobody in the nation will earn more than x or it get taxed 100% is the lesser of those 3 alternatives to a national minimumwage.. still your conclusion is wrong.

there are many reasons why people work in a nation, netherlands is a pretty desirable place to live even with our high taxes, the lack of doctors has more to do with goverment not putting enough in education. Many people won't even move town for another job let alone nation.
People are tied to their culture, language and family like that.
Only when war breaks out or they personally are heavy opressed they might leave, must taking a lot of their earnings especially if they also have a decent social welfare state.. thats well run.. won't be reason for the vast mayority of workers to leave including the higher educated ones.
***multinations you can with other laws just ban from operating and selling in your nation at all unless they comply.. thus ether scaring those parasites away alowing national chains to rise or more likely forcing them to comply as there still is money to be made in our borders.

most gdp is not made by those over 100k workers.. and the idea of a 100% tax on incomes above it is NOT to fund iniantive scemes.
it is to limit the income gap.. in a different way that minimumwage does.
ideally it will force all people to just lower wages that high to 100k so zero of that max income tax will actually be levied..
such a income cap thus is not MENT as a source of revenue.. but just to make a more fair distribution of wealth without the goverment directly acting with stuff like welfare..
it could ofcourse just BAN anyody paying more than 100k.. in wages.. but tacing any income over 100k a year is just the same thing. and also coveres alternative income sources like income from rented out property or dividents some have.

[Scott, President of Dominos]

I just want to see what happens if they did this. I’m dead certain it would be a train wreck but it would be a funny one.

[MinionJoe]

Because it's worked out well for Seattle businesses...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-0LUqwOAc4

[Γαῖα]

Speaking in the perspective of the UK, putting up the min wage has done little to nothing to change the outcome of those on it and thus sees them trailing the cost of living year after year.
I think the best way forward is to remove them from taxation all together (all forms), provide free at the point of use medical and dental care, free public transport, free communication (mobile,internet), free insurance cover, basically services essential in a society.
As time progresses and the previous wage rate loses relativity we include free food, clothes etc but of any cost so as to prevent businesses ring fencing this group as to control cost.

Naturally these costs would be covered by businesses and those earning enough to be able to pay taxation, the former baring the most brunt. The aim while purchase costs will still increase, is to make businesses recognise the value of these employees and consider balancing this taxation by considering more carefully what they pay this group year on year so as to reduce overall cost rather than how little they need to pay in terms of wages according to what a government says.

[ナルゴ]

MinionJoe の投稿を引用：

Because it's worked out well for Seattle businesses...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-0LUqwOAc4

It's almost as if arbitrarily setting wages higher, irrelevant of supply and demand, will excessively increase production costs. Costs that will inevitably be pushed to the consumers.

[Triple G]

Nargo の投稿を引用：

It's almost as if arbitrarily setting wages higher, irrelevant of supply and demand, will excessively increase production costs. Costs that will inevitably be pushed to the consumers.

Supply and demand aren´t that important nowadays. It´s more about the bets at the financial market. Also You can create demand as a company, and artificially shorten the supply to keep the prices, or demand more. But of course costs will be pushed towards the costumer - in most cases.

[Thadeus]

This does absolutely nothing but supports big corporations and destroys small businesses. People will lose their jobs because not all corpa need to hire them, and the small businesses can't pay them.

I mean it's not surprising at all, we all know the Democrats have a hardon for big corpa and absolutely despise the average joe whom they consider morons in need of a super nanny government.