"Superhero Fatigue" is a Myth

[Jackie Daytona]

A popular thing to say these days is that "people are sick of the superhero genre". Um, no. They aren't. Let's talk about that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Batman_(serial)

Superhero films have existed almost as long as film itself has. While the last 10 years has seen an explosion of these types of movies, it's a genre that has always existed.

In the 1940's it was Batman. In the 1950's it was Superman. In the 1960's it was Batman, again. In the 1970's it was 'The Hulk'. In the 1980's it was Batman, yet again!

The 1990's branched out. Seeking alternative superheroes. There were so many. Such as, 'M.A.N.T.I.S.' or 'Blade' or 'Spawn'. 'The Powerpuff Girls'. Even strange parodies like 'Meteor Man'. But also going back to orginals. Like the shows 'Lois & Clark' 'X-men: The Animated Series' or, once again, 'Batman: Animated'.

The 2000's had the Dark Knight trilogy. 'Ben 10'. 'Justice League: Unlimited'. And well, you probably know most of the others from this generation.

The idea that no one wants a superhero show is simply false. The problem is that the quality of these shows has declined.

In fact, superheroes are TIMELESS. Even in B.C. you had stories of Gods coming to earth. Hercules and Thor. Or men fighting Gods. Like in 'The Odysey'. Or various and convoluted tellings of Egyptian myth. People imbued with incredible power and doing incredible things.

Because that's appealing. Power fantasy is something that will never die. Ever.

Still don't believe me? Consider the isekai genre. I cannot even BEGIN to count the number of books and animes written in this genre. I bet some of you reading this have never even heard of it. Well, I gotta tell you: It's nuts.

A MINIMUM of 5-6 of these animes release every year. Never heard of them? You aren't alone. I had no idea. It's an endless rabbit hole. There are so many no human can possibly see them all. (Believe me, I've tried. I just keep finding new ones.)

But, uh... I'm getting ahead of myself. Isekai has this trope. That is, a male gets everything he wants. Power, money, girls... basically everything a guy could possibly want.

The reason American superhero films are declining is because of the people behind them. They don't want to do power fantasy that appeals to men. Instead, they want to do stuff that appeals to all audiences, or women specifically.

Captain Marvel, Wandavision, Ms. Marvel, She-Hulk, America Chavez, Ironheart, female Black Panther, female Thor, Wasp, Rey Skywalker, female Hawkeye...

Whatever happened to, y'know, 'The Avengers'? Hulk, Thor, Ironman, Captain America. What happened to the JLA? Superman, Green Lantern, The Flash, Batman. This is what people want. Not whatever the industry is trying to push.

Instead, they kill-off and/or side-line all these characters.

No one is waiting for the Bedrock[en.wikipedia.org] movie. No one cares. Just like no one cares about Kamala Khan or Kate Bishop.

My point is that the industry isn't serving the fans. They are serving themselves. They don't want to do male power fantasy. And that's the core of most comic characters.

Simply consider the OG grandaddy of them all: Superman. A guy with such overwhelming power that he can defeat any normal person in a fraction of a second.

But we don't get a Superman movie. Instead, we get Dr. Strange. Supposedly the most powerful mage in all the Marvel universe. That trained hard to gain his power. Capable of tearing that universe apart. That requires help from a teenage girl with one power. To defeat a woman on the same level as himself just because she is.

. . .
. . .
. . .

Nah, I'm just wrong about all this. Clearly no one wants a superhero movie. They haven't been happening for literally EVER and I'm just some idiot with a keyboard.

[Mad Hatter]

Postat inițial de Jackie Daytona:

Postat inițial de Mad Hatter:

I don't pay to watch capeshit because I'm not a teenager. I also don't waste time reading long-winded, but minimally-insightful, drivel about inconsequential facets of popular culture.

Have you heard of something? This thing people like. It's called: fun.

So, fun doesn't always represent reality. Much like comics don't. So, you can imagine situations that are impossible.

Like, getting with a girl that would never even consider you as a mate. Or saving the world. Simply because you are so strong. Or destroying your greatest enemy with a single punch.

You just hate fun. That's your problem. Not mine. Not the industry.

Also, way to ignore 100% of film history in your reply. Makes you seem super-smart.

What in the hell are you even trying to say here? You're all over the damn place.

[Chesmu]

It has become a muscle worship and gym advertisement theme, the "superheroes" are mostly praised and famed in the writing for their muscles, not their dignity or right doing. That may be what's boring people watching these "bros" all day.

[talemore]

Postat inițial de Mad Hatter:

Postat inițial de Jackie Daytona:

So, you go to internet forums, but don't like reading.

Yeah, this is why comic book movies are terrible. Because the industry listens to people like you.

Rather than *gasp* actual comic book fans.

I don't pay to watch capeshit because I'm not a teenager. I also don't waste time reading long-winded, but minimally-insightful, drivel about inconsequential facets of popular culture.

Still act like a child. Age does not make you an adult. And most cope this childish behavior as strength to win against these childish ideas. Who as well are created by people given power they never earned uses it to corrupt the world around them until there's no light left and why our world has reached out for a super hero Elon Musk to the hope in the forver growing darkness created by people whose purpose in life is to make them suffer. Even Charlie Mugner and Warren Buffett admit that something in the society has changed where people are financially rally to destroy each others economy to obtain a power they will never obtain. Once done with the world it will turn against them as all $ is sent back to them as the world does not need them any longer. They will have achieved very little in their lives who could ever be considered worth mentioned and growing old with only the story how them made people suffer for their selfish gains that all will only love you for what you can give them rather than what they can give to you.

Power is to not let media take it from you. Don't pay the devil his bills, he will give more hell.

[Mad Hatter]

Postat inițial de kbiz:

TLDR. No superhero can climb that insurmountable text wall.

But yeah, there is superhero movie fatigue (especially when they moralize everyone). I don't want a sermon.

There is definitely superhero fatigue, and I attribute it to the MCU essentially dying after Endgame.

They really overestimated their audience's investment in the universe rather than the characters themselves. There's a reason Robert Downey, Jr. is an icon as Iron Man, whereas nobody gives anything resembling a ♥♥♥♥ about Captain Marvel.

Postat inițial de talemore:

Postat inițial de Mad Hatter:

I don't pay to watch capeshit because I'm not a teenager. I also don't waste time reading long-winded, but minimally-insightful, drivel about inconsequential facets of popular culture.

Still act like a child. Age does not make you an adult. And most cope this childish behavior as strength to win against these childish ideas. Who as well are created by people given power they never earned uses it to corrupt the world around them until there's no light left and why our world has reached out for a super hero Elon Musk to the hope in the forver growing darkness created by people whose purpose in life is to make them suffer. Even Charlie Mugner and Warren Buffett admit that something in the society has changed where people are financially rally to destroy each others economy to obtain a power they will never obtain. Once done with the world it will turn against them as all $ is sent back to them as the world does not need them any longer. They will have achieved very little in their lives who could ever be considered worth mentioned and growing old with only the story how them made people suffer for their selfish gains that all will only love you for what you can give them rather than what they can give to you.

Power is to not let media take it from you. Don't pay the devil his bills, he will give more hell.

tl;dr

why are you all trying to ramble at me? you aren't going to change my mind 🤔

[🅷🅴🆇🅴🅽]

I have not seen any Marvel film other than "The Punisher". The clips you usually see tell me in particular one thing: technically high-quality celluloid garbage, perfect for the masses who flock to the cinema.

[Mad Hatter]

Postat inițial de إلهة الليل:

I have not seen any Marvel film other than "The Punisher". The clips you usually see tell me in particular one thing: technically high-quality celluloid garbage, perfect for the masses who flock to the cinema.

Sometimes being visually impressive counts for something, but you're right for the most part.

That said, I liked the Iron Man movies. Don't think that highly of RDJ as a person, but he's a phenomenal actor and has great screen presence and charisma.

Thomas Jane's Punisher is an underrated gem, though. Glad someone still remembers it.

[❤ Sly Succubus ❤]

From what I grasp, people don't like Superman because in a movie he officially murdered a storage building of teenagers because he got triggered and DC even canonically nuked a city, along with Jokes famous acid bite.

Marvel is literally so run of the mill I also don't think their trying anymore.

DC and Marvel are comic book writters first, and movie makers last, you can't do a comic book justice on the big screen, same as how you can't do a manga justice in an anime, its simply things that will forever clash. Heck Harrypotter ironically as a legendarily known screw up where in the movie Dumbledor pushes Harry against his table saying "DID YOU PUT YOUR NAME IN THE GOBBLET OF FIRE!?" while in the books he only put his hand on Harry's shoulder and asked in a calm voice that same question.

DC and Marvel are the exact same way, there are several pieces of lore both movie series exclude entirely from the comics. Like Marvel completely dismisses the fact that X-Men and Marvel Heroes are literally the one and same universe when its extremely well known that heroes and mutants are on the same bloody planet.

DC does it as well with discarding the entire multiverse timeline along with their dark universe arc where Super Man and Batman literally get corrupted and mass murder all life on earth and force the flash to rewind the planet to 5 years before the bad guy arrived by running, however this caused THAT flash to die, by lore there are at least 4 Flashes, but their all canonly the same person because of the fact that its established Superman and the Flash can rewind and fastforward time with their speeds.

Hell lets use an anime for example. In one of the most well known anime's, Dragonball, Hell is a place that exists, but it was changed in the anime to HFIL (Home For Infinite Losers) and as such literally had to retcon several parts of the entire lore because of that, especially when Goku was traveling the Snake path because below, Several black shadow arms tried to grab him in the manga. In the anime instead hell is occupied by freaking Warcraft Orges

[kilésengati]

You are right. I can't be fatigued of superhero stories, because my superpower is really not caring about fictional superhero stories in the first place.

[𝔸𝕣𝕔𝕥𝕚𝕔 𝟙]

While I think there are some valid points here, I both agree and disagree. I to some degree have super hero fatigue. I have not watched a single superhero film since Endgame. That movie was the culmination of the MCU for me. I don’t want more- it’s like a completed trilogy, and any further films will tarnish it…which is more or less what has happened. I have heard phase 4 has not gone well, but I cannot verify, as I have not watched the films or shows.

For me the real issue is the story, but it’s not the power fantasy you are appealing to. The problem with MCU films and even DC films is that they have become dumb action movies with cardboard characters.

To explain:
Super hero movies expect us to care about the hero, but I can’t engage with a flawless oneliner wise cracking superhero. Likewise, most side characters are merely there to be a damsel in desires, love interest, or bumbling idiot. They barely get screen time, so they aren’t fleshed out. Nolan’s Batman solved this issue by having non-superhero side characters that we care about, which ties into my next issue: Lack of stakes.

These heroes basically have 0% chance of dying because there is going to be a sequel. It doesn’t excite me anymore because I’ve seen it tons of times. This is why you need to have side characters we care a lot about, so they can be at risk, and thus create tension. Likewise, when every villain is a “world ending event”, you begin to stop caring. Every adversary has to be bigger than the last, which actually lessens your fear. Likewise they keep killing them so there is no chance of them returning in another film, which honestly is a bummer.

Lastly- I think people want something different. Enough with the same formula. The Guardian of the Galaxy is a good example. Character no one had heard of and unique, well-written plots.

So to summarize- I think the stories have gotten weak and formulaic. It’s like going on the same ride again and again, and it’s just become tiring.

[L1qu1dator]

Postat inițial de إلهة الليل:

I have not seen any Marvel film other than "The Punisher". The clips you usually see tell me in particular one thing: technically high-quality celluloid garbage, perfect for the masses who flock to the cinema.

Which Punisher though?

[🅷🅴🆇🅴🅽]

Postat inițial de L1qu1dator:

Postat inițial de إلهة الليل:

I have not seen any Marvel film other than "The Punisher". The clips you usually see tell me in particular one thing: technically high-quality celluloid garbage, perfect for the masses who flock to the cinema.

Which Punisher though?

The good one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aiik_hIAOv8

[L1qu1dator]

Postat inițial de إلهة الليل:

The good one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aiik_hIAOv8

Indeed that is the one.
I like the Lundgren one too :P

[talemore]

People die all the time. you parents, your friends, you sister or brother. You decide how many heroes you want to sacrifice.

But when you done, there be nothing left.

[Jackie Daytona]

Postat inițial de Mad Hatter:

Postat inițial de kbiz:

TLDR. No superhero can climb that insurmountable text wall.

But yeah, there is superhero movie fatigue (especially when they moralize everyone). I don't want a sermon.

There is definitely superhero fatigue, and I attribute it to the MCU essentially dying after Endgame.

They had great actors playing popular Marvel characters. Which were all replaced by characters no one cares about. Portrayed by actors either mediocre or relatively unknown.

The best part of "Multiverse of Madness" was seeing Patrick Stewart as Xavier in the hover chair. Which says a lot. Considering he's on the screen for less than 5 minutes.

Postat inițial de Mad Hatter:

They really overestimated their audience's investment in the universe rather than the characters themselves. There's a reason Robert Downey, Jr. is an icon as Iron Man, whereas nobody gives anything resembling a ♥♥♥♥ about Captain Marvel.

If you bothered to read my OP? You'd understand that's my point.

[SMIFFY]

Superhero movies have always bored me