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Will steam be gimped out slowly by patches MS will implement in favor of MS own UWP?
According to EPIC(U4E) founder Tim sweeney it will.

http://wccftech.com/sweeney-microsoft-will-force-patch-windows-10-make-steam-progressively-worse-broken/

If this true, looking bad but we could have known this all along after MS force us into windows 10 and DX12 cookie W10 exclusive(always bad overall).

Hope this won't happen or LINUX road ♥♥♥♥ M$.

What are your thoughts?
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Showing 31-45 of 183 comments
pasa Jul 26, 2016 @ 10:58am 
Originally posted by tomk1:
-They well the CEO has said that dx12 is only being released on W10 to force assist pc-users after MS missed the W10 target. In fairness the new CEO has Turned MS making breaking profits from the cloud.

And it will be very interesting to look how that fans out. While W10 is built completely on DX12 (as I heard), still all DX is just a group of graphics routines and access to cards. It *is* completely possible to release a version for W7. It was just decided not be done, both to save workload and for that twisting hands.

But if the wind happens to change, it can still be done. If some smart people measure that new games start to migrate to other APIs with LESS ties to windows and W7 is stuck with 11, they may force a directive change to save the market share rather than face.

Or go the simpler alternative of improving W10 listening to what users answer on 'why don't you switch when you technically could'. It might not even be a big list and whatever agenda they have might be done in a different way.
Start_Running Jul 26, 2016 @ 10:59am 
Originally posted by pasa:
Originally posted by Spawn of Totoro:
Many of those issue would probebly go away with that large of a user base. Maybe a commercialy available Linux is needed soon.

I recall that saying from low 90s and repeated ever since. When distros entered the scene people were expecting that happen in couple of years. And alomst 2 decades later still just waiting.

Consumerist sheeple mentality. People really don't by things unless someone is dropping a sales pitch. The only Weakness of Linux is that since it is open source and free. No one makes money from people switching to it. So no one advertises, promotes or sets up marketing and PR campaigns.

There a lot of musticism about Linux and people basically are afraid that if they switch, all their windows documents won't work (false), or their hardware won't work (mostly false), or their fave apps won't work (partially true)
Commander Makara Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:03am 
Sweeney has a bugbear and is despearate to garner a bandwagon of anti-MS motion.

This is propeganda from Sweeney's side.
Originally posted by tomk1:
Originally posted by Spawn of Totoro:
Besides, Windows would have fewer market shares by now, if it wasn't for PC gaming and Steam.

Also, why would they want to hurt Steam when they plan on selling games through it as well?

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2016/06/microsoft-will-use-steam-to-sell-windows-games-not-just-its-own-store/
-! Microsoft !- /

-They well the CEO has said that dx12 is only being released on W10 to force assist pc-users after MS missed the W10 target. In fairness the new CEO has Turned MS making breaking profits from the cloud.

Anyway in time we wont depend on DX12^tm as Vulkan is supported by AMD & Nividia & Valve, according to wiki Doom is 'Up to 66% faster when using the Vulkan rendering path.'
Vulken runs on 7,8,10, Linux & Google is supporting Vulkan for Android.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vulkan_(API)

Microsoft should be rolling in money from the payments from the NSA for account users' data.

"Breaching your privacy ?" No - you signed that away with the licence agreement for Windows 10.

Along with possibly your soul and any duplicated organs.

S.x.
Mivo Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:18am 
Originally posted by Start_Running:
The only Weakness of Linux is that since it is open source and free.

In my view, the weaknesses of Linux are that it's far too fragmented, far too inconsistent, far too user-unfriendly in the sense that it's too open. The vast majority of users don't want complicated, they don't want to learn their OS. They want to use it in the same fashion they use a toaster. It's fine, too. (They certainly don't want to mess around with dependencies, different window managers and GUI frameworks that makes the user experience like a patchwork carpet...)

The other weakness is the lack of commercial software support. If you need to use Wine for a lot of stuff, which often means fiddling around, researching solutions, and then still getting worse performance,

Windows is a good OS. 10 is certainly better than Vista was, and a step up from 8 as well. The problem is really with Microsoft and its policies, not with the actual product.

The very things that make Linux a great success for those of us who like to tinker and fully control their experience and computer are the things that also make it a mainstream failure.
pasa Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:21am 
Originally posted by Start_Running:
Consumerist sheeple mentality. ...

There a lot of musticism about Linux and people basically are afraid that if they switch, all their windows documents won't work (false), or their hardware won't work (mostly false), or their fave apps won't work (partially true)

A read a contradiction here. The last bullets show fair reasoning. Only geeks want to "use linux" or "use windows". I want to do useful stuff. The OS shall just make it possible and otherwise be outta way.

The driver issues alone are enough to alienate most people -- for the best reasons. Can you sell any piece of PC hardware without a windoze driver? Good luck. For linux you need luck at start and more luck moving on. Or restrict to a subset of hardware.

Office docs was a critical issue at the time. By now it should not be a problem. But I did hear enough people complaining about open office and other apps. (OTOH here windows folks shoot one leg for sure as the ribboned office is IMO even worse. Fortunately I can keep using of97 that is as fine as ever ;) And very likely it runs fins under wine too. So right, that should not be a hindrance on switch, however...

in general if you're used to something you need some real incentive to set your mind to something else. And what is the carrot? The lack of price appears falling short to cover the gap. Especially as it is spread over many years of use.

Currently it seems a matter of defaults. And around here all the MS palette is free for every university student. It is as free for them as any alternative. And after they leave, obviously will keep using that at home and if able at work. Such things change the picture will stay the same, or as I said a much better carrot is needed.


Start_Running Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:23am 
Originally posted by Mivo:
Originally posted by Start_Running:
The only Weakness of Linux is that since it is open source and free.

In my view, the weaknesses of Linux are that it's far too fragmented, far too inconsistent, far too user-unfriendly in the sense that it's too open.

And therein lies the rub. Evebn for me,. picking the right one for me was a matter of trial and error. The thing is though... I was able to ffind the right versions for me. For 70% of windows users, Ubuntu with open office will more opr less cover all their needs.

The other weakness is the lack of commercial software support. If you need to use Wine for a lot of stuff, which often means fiddling around, researching solutions, and then still getting worse performance,

It depends. You may not have microsoft word on linux, but open office manages everything microsoft office does and requires very little relearning. Most software from Adobe and Corel have their dedicated linux versions as well. as do many audio and video editing suites.

Start_Running Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:25am 
Originally posted by pasa:
Originally posted by Start_Running:
Consumerist sheeple mentality. ...

There a lot of musticism about Linux and people basically are afraid that if they switch, all their windows documents won't work (false), or their hardware won't work (mostly false), or their fave apps won't work (partially true)

A read a contradiction here. The last bullets show fair reasoning. Only geeks want to "use linux" or "use windows". I want to do useful stuff. The OS shall just make it possible and otherwise be outta way.

The driver issues alone are enough to alienate most people -- for the best reasons. Can you sell any piece of PC hardware without a windoze driver? Good luck. For linux you need luck at start and more luck moving on. Or restrict to a subset of hardware.
Actually just about any piece of hardware out there made in the last 10 years has linux drivers availabl, from the manufacturer. Driver issues are no longer an issue really.

pasa Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:27am 
Originally posted by gallifrey:
Microsoft should be rolling in money from the payments from the NSA for account users' data.

"Breaching your privacy ?" No - you signed that away with the licence agreement for Windows 10.

Do you need to sign away anytihng? I thought the Patriot Act suspended any civil rights you imagined to have officially. Long time ago. And people approved it. And then approved the lack of change too. Repeatedly.

If nothing else, the snowden-released dox show evidence that nsa could just ask the big companies for whatever data it wanted anytime.

And if you want change you need to reform not MS but the relation of state with the citizens. First. Against all the wind blowing from the government AND the citizens.
pasa Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:54am 
Originally posted by Start_Running:
Actually just about any piece of hardware out there made in the last 10 years has linux drivers availabl, from the manufacturer. Driver issues are no longer an issue really.

Really? I worked in linux-based shops between 2006 and 11 surrounded by 100-ish geeks. And talks about what piece of hardware works or not was all too common. Also the product had a pretty strict HW compatibility list. Guess for a good reason.

(If you meant it as joke/sarcasm then sorry for jumping on a shadow. :)
Start_Running Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:58am 
Originally posted by pasa:
Originally posted by Start_Running:
Actually just about any piece of hardware out there made in the last 10 years has linux drivers availabl, from the manufacturer. Driver issues are no longer an issue really.

Really? I worked in linux-based shops between 2006 and 11 surrounded by 100-ish geeks. And talks about what piece of hardware works or not was all too common. Also the product had a pretty strict HW compatibility list. Guess for a good reason.

(If you meant it as joke/sarcasm then sorry for jumping on a shadow. :)

Well let me put it thi way. I've yet to encounter in, my work, a scanner, printer, camera, UPS, Mouse, Keyboard, Sound chip or Gfx card that I couldn't get linix drivers for from the products page if not the cd.
"MD" Jul 26, 2016 @ 11:58am 
Originally posted by Gustave5436:
Scaremongering nonsense.
Agreed

And Linux is great. I just spent 6 months trying out Ubuntu and Linux only games. You may fiddle with it a little, but it's not that "strict" or hard to use. If I did, anyone could. Try it before talking out your asses.

Cheers
Last edited by "MD"; Jul 26, 2016 @ 12:00pm
16 Jul 26, 2016 @ 12:17pm 
Originally posted by Coffin:
Let's not start the doomsaying based on one person's opinion. Even if it were to happen, Valve isn't going to let Microsoft ruin it's digital distribution platform that easily.
Ayyyy. I know you
16 Jul 26, 2016 @ 12:24pm 
Originally posted by Spawn of Totoro:
...console gamer fought back too. Remember when MS wanted to lock disk games to that specific console? There was a huge outrcry and they reversed that decision.

Lets not discuss the P word though. Some may get the wrong idea.
I just rememner my co workers getting all excited for xbox one right before it came out and other people I knew and they all went and trqded their old games and 360 consoles in for credit torwards the xbox one and not even a year and half after the xbox ones release MS announcemes backwards compatibility for people to play their old 360 games on the xbox one.

Never have I seen such a horrible thing done to consumers in my lifetime. Im not very old but still...

To tell your consumers and or advertise to get rid of your old games because they wont play on the xbox one and then make it to where they do was the lowest thing I have seen microsoft do.

I swore off MS console games and consoles after that.

I didnt trade in my old stuff. I thought it was dumb the xbox one "couldnt" play my old 360 games when they said that
Mivo Jul 26, 2016 @ 12:26pm 
My Linux driver experience is like pasa's. I had to tailor my hardware purchases to what would be compatible with open source/standard drivers or at least came with native drivers. Most Linux distro forums have sections where people make suggestions for hardware that works out of the box or comes with drivers. There are entire compatibility lists floating around with rating for how well a piece of hardware is supported in Linux.

I don't know what the situation is like now, but just a few years ago, wireless support for laptops was a huge problem. You often had to rely on propriety drivers, if you were lucky, or you had to fiddle with wrapping Windows drivers, if you were not, with rather mediocre results. So when I bought a new laptop, the majority of models were out of question. Perhaps this got better, I don't know.

It's not showstopper for geeks and computer savvy folk, but it's a dealbreaker for people like my 69-year old mother.
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All Discussions > Steam Forums > Off Topic > Topic Details
Date Posted: Jul 26, 2016 @ 1:24am
Posts: 183