Rings of Power and toxic Tolkien fandom.

[Apexnexius]

I'm so sad seeing the Lord of the Rings Tolkien community now turning Tolkien into a toxic fandom.
So many Tolkien fans are now showing their true colors.

The Lord of the Rings, The Hobbit and Silmarillion is for everyone, not just for some people.
..Middle-earth is also for women, people of color, non binary, transgender LGBTQ and other communities.

We should all support Amazon's new show Rings of Power.
Tall proud dark and/or black people in Númenor is not dangerous to Tolkien's work. It actually enriches the lore.

Again, we should all support Rings of Power and be more positive to each other.
I'm sure both J. R. R. Tolkien and Christopher Tolkien wanted it this way.


Friday 22nd of July Edit:

New The Rings of Power - SDCC Trailer

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYnQDsaxHZU


Edit 2:
On the behalf of the whole community I would like to thank everyone who has come to the defense of Amazon's decision to make Lord of the Rings more inclusive.
And it is needed !

Postat inițial de MistyMountainHop:

So Sauron is an edgy twink Eminem.

Forget it. I'm out.

Just look at the horrendous comment above from this person.
Twink is a derogatory slur against queers. Read the lore in Silmarillion. Sauron had many shapes throughout the ages in MIddle-earth.

Tolkien was never about normative feelings. Just look at Frodo and Sam.
And Gandalf, played by Ian McKellen, is actually gay.
Please do not feel threatened by change.

J. R. R. Tolkien's universe is in good hands.



August 7th Super Edit:
@The Quartering, jeremo (at 6:53 in his/her video below)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp5OS1JE-Y4
Gandalf the Grey has 'de facto' cheerful gay happy feelings towards Hobbits, read the books for god's sake !
Also, Gandalf actually transitions several times (according to Tolkien lore).
One of the many times he transitioned, Gandalf transitioned from Gandalf the Grey to Gandalf the White. Tolkien is all about change and transitioning.
J. R. R. Tolkien went through World War 1 and came out as a different man. A changed man.

Amazon is doing the right thing here. It's all fabulous.



Edit 4:
If Gollum were to suddenly jump up from the river, sword in hand, landing on Elrond's ship while screaming..
" ..It's Tolkien Time precious ! "

That would be completely fine. You see, we are actually tolerant Tolkien fans.



Edit August 10th:
This was the most fun Steam Off Topic has ever been.
I'm leaving this thread open for those of you still interested in discussing Amazon's Rings of Power.
But I'm gonna have to unsubscribe. I lost interest early on, the very moment Amazon announced that they were involved.

If we are all wrong and it turns out the show is exciting (I highly doubt it) then I might start a subscription to Amazon Prime.

That's it !
Time to buy some Steam PC Games. Europa Universalis 4 here I come !

Game On dweebs !



-This thread is $150.000 dollar college degree certified-

[Morkonan]

Postat inițial de unturorum 2.0:

...

I don't know or care about Lord of the Rings and I have no idea what happened with the latest one, but yeah, I completely agree. Like, I don't see how does portraying D-Day how it actually was (so, not full of black women, for example) does any harm to anyone today. It's just history, it is what it is. To quote Red Dead Redemption 2, "we can't change what's done, we can only move on". So, I really don't get what's the point of trying to portray history differently.

I agree.

But, I also disagree in some ways...

I do agree that it's ridiculous to blatantly, and inappropriately, try to do that. But, I would agree that if the story isn't harmed by it, then there's no reason not to.

For instance, the new Game of Thrones prequel series will start soon. And, it's got the same "controversy." It is even more offensive than the TLotR spinoff, being it's the Targaryans.. who were obsessed with their racial purity so very much that they frequently wed brothers and sisters to keep their lineage pure... But, whatevs...

So, in Game of Thrones, there wasn't a whole lot of "cultural diversity" in Westeros. There was, however, everywhere else. That fact was ignored by the current showrunners in their "we're tired of seeing screens filled with white people" quote.

But, there's a point there - The story and setting and all that would not have been harmed by having a racially diverse King's Landing, right? Fleabottom is home to everyone... and nobody there wants to live there, anyway. The point being that they could have sprinkled some diversity around in certain regions in Westeros and it wouldn't have impacted the setting.

But, that D&D did not means it's now a target no matter how many different culturally and racially diverse peoples, nations, and characters they put in there. Because the continent of Westeros was the only continent in the HBO Series that was not culturally diverse, now the new producers thing the whole show was "full of white people."

(They, like many others, only do that for free hype and word-of-mouth and in order to prevent criticism. If one dares to criticize the quality of their show, they can call that person a racist... just like many supporters are doing right now.)

[MinionJoe]

I'd rather read Hobbit fanfic posted to Live Journal than support anything written to promote a cultural revolution.

[Echo NO Aim]

Rings of Power is the same as Star Wars 7-9. FRandom fanfiction made by people who don't understand the universe or the fans.

[DRUNK_CANADIAN]

Stop feeding some of the worst bait I've ever seen (only replying because someone replied 1 min ago)

EVERYONE (or everyone that matters) agrees the Amazon series for the LOTR intellectual property is a sin against humanity and good taste in general.

[Morkonan]

Postat inițial de unturorum 2.0:

...

Yeah. For example, Red Dead Redemption 2 (Wild West) has black women, black men (one is also partly Indian), white women, white men and one Mexican character as a part of the gang and they're all great characters which are very believable and fitting in the seting and the whole story as well, nothing about them ever felt "forced" one bit. It also has a quest involving women's suffrage and another such encounter in a city, but these are real historical events, so there is no valid reason to be against that. The Native American struggle is also a great addition to the game which is a major part of that time period as well. All that kind of stuff in the game is so nicely integrated, reasonable and accurate that it should serve as an example to everyone else. Easily in my top 3 games of all time.

Sadly, I've never played it. IIRC, it's still mod-restricted and can't be modded... which is what I'd love to do to it. Plus, it's got that "online" thing, right?

But... Yes, that's true - There was diversity in the "Old West." Here's my favorite example and the darn guy deserves his very own very high-profile movie, 'cause he's that awesome:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bass_Reeves

Bass Reeves... kicks butt.

There's a few documentaries about the Old Wild West that feature segments about Bass Reeves. He needs a darn movie, though... Denzel Washington would do a good job of it if they can snag him before he gets too darn old.

I'm very glad for "gaming diversity" that allows the player choices. (Up to a point.. I have issues that require context before it gets a nod from me, but they don't involve "race.") But, for myself, I kind of don't really see "race" in video games unless it's strongly pushed. I may notice it from time to time, but it's really not a stand-out thing for me.

Look at Diablo II, for example. I didn't notice that the Paladin wasn't "white." I didn't care. I wanted to play a Paladin so I clicked on the thing. He's black. "So what, he's a Paladin!" /hammertime

Postat inițial de DRUNK_CANADIAN:

Stop feeding some of the worst bait I've ever seen (only replying because someone replied 1 min ago)

EVERYONE (or everyone that matters) agrees the Amazon series for the LOTR intellectual property is a sin against humanity and good taste in general.

I don't disagree with you. But... isn't it something that would be good, in general, to discuss if participants could really get along while discussing it? Would it help the individuals discussing it to get a sense of how others felt about it?

No, it's not going to solve society's problems. But, solving society's problems is always like eating an elephant... You have to do it bite by bite. One may as well try to take as many quality bites at it as one can, right?

[Silverkite]

Postat inițial de Apexnexius:

:nyanrainbow::RainSec:
I'm so sad seeing the Lord of the Rings Tolkien community now turning Tolkien into a toxic fandom.
So many Tolkien fans are now showing their true colors.

The Lord of the Rings, The Hobbit and Silmarillion is for everyone, not just for some people.
..Middle-earth is also for women, people of color, non binary, transgender LGBTQ and other communities.

We should all support Amazon's new show Rings of Power.
Tall proud dark and/or black people in Númenor is not dangerous to Tolkien's work. It actually enriches the lore.

Again, we should all support Rings of Power and be more positive to each other.
I'm sure both J. R. R. Tolkien and Christopher Tolkien wanted it this way. :p_heart: :lunar2020ratinablanket:

amazon is pushing clown world propaganda, if they want to recreate their a replica of meimar insane asylum, they got plenty of places, like in the space, maybe right in the middle of the sun

[Holografix]

If you're not educated in history, be it taking classes at uni about time periods, etc... you will have a myopic perspective of historical time periods and make outlandish statements about which people were where, and who was supposed to be in a certain places.

it's a testament to the improverished mindset of the LoTR fanbase (or any fanbase for that matter) to believe that OGRES and TROLLS are more believable in middle-earth than a variety of skin tones or cultural practices.

[Violent Rainbow]

I don't personally have an issue with them forcing black people into the lore, as long as the show doesn't become all about race. I swear to god if there's a point where that angry looking black dwarf lady says something like "our people were here first and YOUR KIND pushed us aside and took our land" I'm gonna smash my tv to a million pieces.

[[ T h e B o s s ]]

I'm so sad seeing Socialist Revisionism now turning Tolkien into a toxic fandom.
Political Correctness is now showing it's true colors.

Fixed it for ya OP. You're welcome.

[Holografix]

Postat inițial de Violent Rainbow:

I don't personally have an issue with them forcing black people into the lore, as long as the show doesn't become all about race. I swear to god if there's a point where that angry looking black dwarf lady says something like "our people were here first and YOUR KIND pushed us aside and took our land" I'm gonna smash my tv to a million pieces.

i want more black dwarfs in the lore and less white dwarfs so people all over the world smash their tvs into bits. now that would be some good programming.

[Magma Dragoon]

I hear Amazon is working on a live action Boku no Pico for 2024

[Violent Rainbow]

Postat inițial de unturorum 2.0:

Postat inițial de Violent Rainbow:

I don't personally have an issue with them forcing black people into the lore, as long as the show doesn't become all about race. I swear to god if there's a point where that angry looking black dwarf lady says something like "our people were here first and YOUR KIND pushed us aside and took our land" I'm gonna smash my tv to a million pieces.

Yeah.

Don't forget stereotypical gay characters whose only purpose and personalityis just standing there and being gay.

How exactly is this even representation? Do you really want to be represented as a stereotype incapable of being anything more than just gay?

When I complain about such characters, this is why, not homophobia. It just doesn't make sense. If I was gay, I would be offended by such poor "representation" for the reasons I explained in the previous paragraph which are also the reason why it feels "forced". These characters have absolutely no purpose other than just being stereotypically gay.

Who even benefits from this? Homophobic people are pissed off for their homophobic reasons and homosexual people are represented as stereotypes whose only personality is being homosexual and nothing else. I just don't get it.

Man I'm gay and I agree 100%, it's actually extremely insulting that they think they can just shove a gay character into a show or movie and automatically all the gays will watch and love it but no, we want actual good tv and movies just like everyone else and if the gay character is only there to be a flamboyant stereotype I'd rather they leave them out entirely.

[Gus the Crocodile]

Similarly, please leave out all the unflamboyant heterosexual people, that stereotype is vastly overplayed.

[HALO_run]

Postat inițial de Your_White_Knight:

Postat inițial de Apexnexius:

Rings of Power and toxic Tolkien fandom.

:nyanrainbow::RainSec:
I'm so sad seeing the Lord of the Rings Tolkien community now turning Tolkien into a toxic fandom.
So many Tolkien fans are now showing their true colors.

The Lord of the Rings, The Hobbit and Silmarillion is for everyone, not just for some people.
..Middle-earth is also for women, people of color, non binary, transgender LGBTQ and other communities.

We should all support Amazon's new show Rings of Power.
Tall proud dark and/or black people in Númenor is not dangerous to Tolkien's work. It actually enriches the lore.

Again, we should all support Rings of Power and be more positive to each other.
I'm sure both J. R. R. Tolkien and Christopher Tolkien wanted it this way. :p_heart: :lunar2020ratinablanket:

No.

~It always WAS for everyone~... people are just trying to subvert Tolkien's works into something it's not to fit their personal bias.... it hasn't worked before because fans rejected it and it won't go over well this time either, because it never will, fans will always reject it.

More to the point... J.R.R. never liked anyone changing his works.... nor did his son.

They both would be livid in what Amazon's toxic garbage has done, that's why they are doing it after their death... Amazon even FIRED it's "Tolkien Advisor" because the Advisor was pointing out all the problems with Amazon's work.... nothing needs to "enriches the lore" and totally change what he envisioned for his own work.

Thankfully the majority of fans also don't like what Amazon is doing... and are showing Amazon how they truly feel.... and I'm with them ~NOT~ supporting Amazon's toxic show.



Edit:

This is also why Marvel movies, Dr. Who show, "Star Wars", Star Trek, D.C. and Marvel Comics, etc, etc, are also failing...

Fans do not want this... and they never will.

100% agree couldn't have said it better

Amazon needs to lose it's rites to J R R work, before it becomes the new star wars mess

[Holografix]

Getting upset over a show because of your personal identity politics is ridiculous.